To arrange a party for a Sunday as it means the morman best friend can't attend?

[Ieatcake]

Just that really. Struggling to find a date that we and the place can all do. Would you consider the best friend vital?

I already have a hard enough time trying to explain why their family can't have tea or coffee due to caffeine but are fine with chocolate and coke. I don't have anything against them they seem nice, but it's already hard enough as it is trying to get a date that suits all.

It's YOUR child's party.

Why are you worrying about pandering to someone else's religion or preferences?

Plan party. Send invite. If they can't come due to xyz then tough shit.

If one of DD friends had a severe allergy, I would accommodate. Anything else is not my problem.

I have never drunk tea or coffee and just say I don't drink it. No one has ever asked me to explain, only comments I get is 'oh you like my sister/best friend/ex'.

You are way over thinking this invite.

I've been inside their kitchen and they have the same vanilla extract that I use that contains some alcohol. Is that ok in small amounts?

Again, it comes down to individual preference, I know some Mormons who wouldn't use that particular vanilla extract, I know others who happily do. I know Mormons that will use alcohol in cooking, I even know Mormons who are struggling with alcoholism.

Do religious people have a better recovery from cancer?

I wouldn't have thought so. Why would they?

Well I've never asked anyone to explain why they can't have hot drinks, apart from here and no one is answering it. Many religious beliefs did have some merit at sometime.

I'd just like to know what the hot drink one is. Is there a temperature that the scripts say water can't be heated above? Pasta a d rice are fine and what about soup? A mug shot or a cup a soup ok?

So now this thread is about why can't Mormons have hot drinks??
When your original question was about hosting a party on a Sunday? And your initial gripe was having the oh-so-complicated situation of having to explain why a person can have cola but not tea, becaus eof the caffeine.

WUB

Leatcake all religions have inconsistencies. And people observe to a greater or lesser degree. I have a Muslim friend who will take a sip of alcohol to be polite if it's offered to her despite never usually drinking. I have another who wouldn't eat a liqueur chocolate. People believe what they want to. It would be better for you to teach tolerance to your children than to teach them to try and catch people out. I'm not sure why the precise temperature of drinks they choose to have has any bearing on your child's party?

corbyn it's because it doesn't, OP is a GFer

Basically obedience is the reason ... we were told not to partake of hot drinks and that was later defined at tea and coffee and that's that. There is no massive secret to it, that's it, as I said there was a lot of members who used to believe it was about caffeine but officially that's not the case and other caffeine containing substances have never been called into question. Why those two drinks? No idea. I personally drink hot chocolate and another substance called barleycup, I avoid anything with tea leaves in including green tea too ... my husband drinks herbal teas such as elderflower, and 100s of other varieties as long as it doesn't have the tea leaves in it.

Alcohol, we are told "strong drink is not for the belly" we avoid drinking alcohol. I have no issue with it in food, many people cook with it but a lot equally avoid it ... I don't have it in desserts ... many will avoid things that look like alcohol whereas I have a massive supply of non-alcoholic drinks. I also socialise and have no issues being around anyone drinking or even having it in my home, we have a tidy supply of wine that we get given periodically and friends will often raid our supply for something. Other would avoid being a round it or having it in their homes.

Like everything, people all live it differently and understand it differently, not every Mormon is active, not every Mormon lives the word of wisdom, some take things to extremes and there is a massive cultural aspect too, like some Mormons will disapprove of facial hair on men but it really has no relevance to the doctrine and is such culture (my husband has facial hair).

If you have questions just ask them, or ask me. I'm fairly honest about the good, bad and the ugly ... I am fully aware of how weird we appear.

Do we live longer? There is some antidotal evidence to suggest maybe, but I've personal not seen any particular evidence of that. We top have leadership run by very elderly people, our prophet died today aged 89 and his successor is aged 93, but then I have seen many people die very young and cruelly just like in life in general. There is no doubt that smoking and excessive alcohol have an affect on your health, though, but as for tea and coffee not sure there is any particular benefits, I think it we all truly lived it, eating foods in season, having a great supply of grains and herbs, reducing meat, and getting adequate sleep it would have a greater impact in our overall health. However generally people often live the "do nots" rather than the "dos".

My in-laws are observant Mormons and very involved in their local church.

I am firmly atheist and they don't care. They are and always have been lovely to me. They take us out for meals on a Sunday no issues too.

They don't drink tea, coffee or alcohol. Neither do I funnily enough (namely because all those drinks taste horrid )

I wonder if children of my friends ask why I don't drink tea or coffee or alcohol? Seems odd that a child would care or think about that at all. Mine have certainly never asked me

In my experience, not all people of one religion do or believe exactly the same things. Religion is quite personal, so finding hard and fast rules that are adhered to by all who identify as belonging to a certain religion is very difficult much of the time.

Curiosity is fine, but your comments about cancer and creationism may suggest to some that you are trying to pick holes in religion and the religious beliefs of others. For example, your asking about cancer recovery rates for those with religion seemingly out of the blue may be interpreted as an attempt to prove the futility of religion/prayer. Perhaps questions like that are why the Bali Facebook group blocked you?

A good rule of thumb may be that the religious beliefs of others don't need to make sense to you, but you do need to respect them.

I think maybe the OP and her son share a similar level of curiosity about things and like to ask many questions!

And I suspect that, as this thread has several Mormons on it, she has used this opportunity to ask questions that she might feel awkward asking her son's best friend's family.

I don't see it as anything other than that, really.

If an 8 year old turns down tea or coffee because of caffienne its probally because they are just that 8 years old!!! Not because of religion.

I dont drink caffienne as gives me a headache dont think anyone has ever questioned me when I say no thank you to a hot drink. Ever...

Does anyone really take that much notice of what other party guests eat or drink (unless they get really drunk or eat all of the food altogether??)

Cater for others dietary needs but you are sooooo overthinking it OP! No one cares what your sons bf is eating and drinking!!!!

I've not rtft (sorry) but wanted to come and give my opinion as a mormon :)
It would be lovely if you could arrange something for a different day, the family would be really grateful. Some families don't attend parties on a Sunday, others do. It's a really personal thing as to what is and isn't OK on a Sunday :)
As for the tea and coffee thing, just because I've seen so many people mentioning it, it's not the caffeine that's a problem. Our health code (the word of wisdom) specifically states we abstain from tea and coffee. Many people over the years (both inside the church and outside) have taken that to assume it means caffeine, but it doesn't!
If you have any questions about what we believe, never be afraid to ask. Most of us are more than happy to talk and to answer. I'm certain the mum will be more than happy to answer your questions.

When I say arrange something for a different day, I mean if you need to have the party on a Sunday, have the friend over for dinner another day... Sorry that wasn't very clear!

Has the best friend actually said anything?

When I had a LDS friend, she would offer me coffee at her house. She didn’t drink it herself but hospitality meant a lot to her and she would keep a jar of Instant in her cupboard.

I've read more of the thread now! There were a few people saying that personal interpretation is confusing as an outsider. Can I just point you to Catholicism for a wee sec? I know many Catholic women who use contraception. That's not difficult to understand, it's personal choice. Mormonism is the same :)

I also know Muslims that choose to drink alcohol and other people that miss out parts of their religion too. That doesn't make them bad people, it doesn't make that religion null in void, it just makes it personal choice. We all have agency, freedom to choose :)

I wouldn't knowingly arrange the party on a date that excluded my son's best friend because it clashed with his family's religious customs. That seems like a very hostile thing to do and my son would be upset - at 8yo my boys' friendships were important to them and I respected that.

It does sound as though you have a visceral distaste for religious beliefs which you see as illogical and silly - i have some sympathy with that (staunch atheist) but is your distaste strong enough that you don't want your son to have a best-friend relationship with a Mormon? Excluding him from the party by arranging it on a date you know he can't attend looks very much like it.

Is there a reason why the birthday party can't be held on a Saturday, sorry missed if you have already said.

Been there, done that. I'm not religious at all, but we have friends who are deeply into faith. All respect, from both sides, that's why we're still friends. What worked perfectly every time was to nót give any explanations at all. It's their religion, their choice. So if anything occured where those friends were involved, but could not attend, I simply said they were otherwise occupied. And you could invite the bf's family telling them gently you'll understand if they object to that date, time, catering, and then offer them an alternative moment to come and congratulate your son.

The point is OP, you don't have to offer an explanation to your DC . Say you don't know because you're not Mormon. . Are you supposed to be the oracle? Just tell your DC that it's because of the Mormon lifestyle / religion and if they need further specifics to ask the friend. Why all the fuss? There are contradictions in all religions, but why worry about these things that don't affect you? Just book your party when it suits you and it's up to them whether they want to attend or not.

I thought even the pope changed his stance on condoms?

Yes can't hold it on a Saturday unless it's a month afterwards. It's either change the venue (and they do a complete package that we want) or have it then.

Thanks for all the responses I do find beleifs interesting, I'm not trying to belittle them if it keeps someone happy and doesn't harm anyone why would anyone have objections? It's not quite a religion but I have a friend deeply into her homoeopathy, it's bonkers to me but she can afford to pay a fortune for sugar pills and keeps her happy.

I do wonder if red bull and coke were around at the time of its invention if they would be forbidden too. I'm not actually a huge coffee tea person but I do like herbal teas.

Are you ever tempted to swap Saturday and Sunday around as your day of worship / reflection if it's more convenient?

I ask about cancer as Im wondering if removing several vices leads to a longer life, or if people swap them for other just as harmful vices / or do them in secret.

Yes can't hold it on a Saturday unless it's a month afterwards. It's either change the venue (and they do a complete package that we want) or have it then.

I would speak to them and more importantly ask your son what he wants. If he wants it sooner, which is what most younger children would want, then do what suits YOUR family, perhaps do a play date or something together in another day.

I do wonder if red bull and coke were around at the time of its invention if they would be forbidden too. I'm not actually a huge coffee tea person but I do like herbal teas.
Yes, quite possibly. Although I personally do avoid those drinks because I believe them to be harmful. I guess the word of wisdom isn't meant to be a conclusive list, we are supposed to use our own judgement on what is healthy and look after our bodies.

Are you ever tempted to swap Saturday and Sunday around as your day of worship / reflection if it's more convenient?
We go to church on a Sunday so that's the sabbath (the 7th day when God rest) however my SIL lives in Bahrain and as a country their sabbath is Friday, so that's when they go to church and treat as the sabbath. But as for individual members we wouldn't really change it.

I ask about cancer as Im wondering if removing several vices leads to a longer life, or if people swap them for other just as harmful vices / or do them in secret.
I think many of us, myself included swap them, it's not really truly living the word do wisdom though is it, it's quiet hypocritical, but I eat chocolate and even call it my drug. I guess I see it as a step by step process. It's an aim for being healthy, but the reality is I think many, not all, replace with other things that aren't all that healthy.

As for doing I'm secret, some members I'm sure do, for me personally it's never been much of a temptation to drink, smoke or whatever, I know that we have been given wine more than once form people who know we don't drink, but clearly believe we do in secret ... I don't think people really do on the whole though. Least not people I am close to. I remember feeling rebellious once and going and buying a can of Pepsi 😂 I've never touched alcohol and certainly never felt like I missed out.

As another exMormon, I attended lots of parties and other functions on Sunday. I think if it is the best friend then your child will really want them there. It's important and obviously you want to do what is best for your child.

I am sure that if Coca Cola and other drinks like this had been around then, they would also have been restricted. I was only asked once, jokingly, when I started at university - so people didn't really know me - 'What are you a f@ckin MOrmon?!' when I said no thanks to tea or coffee. All other times it was assumed I just didn't like them.