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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

To have tried to help a homeless man?

181 replies

darkcandlelight · 17/12/2017 16:34

Went to Manchester for the Christmas markets and we stayed over last night. There was a homeless man sleeping by our hotel and I was really concerned about him. This morning my 11 yo was worried he wasn't moving so we went to get dh up to ask him (he has a medical background) and took him a cup of tea. Dh is really annoyed with me, he says it was irresponsible.

So was I being unreasonable? I really thought the man had died at one point.

OP posts:
Bubblebubblepop · 17/12/2017 21:57

Oh for gods sake who cares what homeless charities say? They're hardly saving the country from homelessness. I'm not going to let a charity tell me whether or not I can give a homeless person a tenner Hmm

LipstickHandbagCoffee · 17/12/2017 22:00

Do what you want,youre an adult. But give a thought to why the advice is not to give cash
Giving cash maintain addiction and or dysfunctional behaviour

Bubblebubblepop · 17/12/2017 22:04

Of course it is. But if I don't give cash and an addict goes into withdrawal who is there to help them? No one, basically.

LipstickHandbagCoffee · 17/12/2017 22:07

Don’t make out you're being altruistic in giving cash to avoid withdrawal
You give because on a certain level it makes you feel better
there are funded withdrawal programmes if individual wants to come off

YellowFlower201 · 17/12/2017 22:14

You're giving cash to ensure an addict doesn't go into withdrawal? I've heard it all now Confused

BulletFox · 17/12/2017 22:15

Julie Burchill did a good article on this once that if you give cash away, you cannot dictate how it's spent.

Bubblebubblepop · 17/12/2017 22:21

Of course I'm not giving cash to prevent withdrawal. Where on earth did you get that from? Drama queen

LipstickHandbagCoffee · 17/12/2017 22:27

But if I don't give cash and an addict goes into withdrawal who is there to help them? No one, basically
So you’re giving cash to prevent withdrawal?

Bubblebubblepop · 17/12/2017 22:30

No. I'm giving you an example. What will a homeless charity do for an addict in need of a fix? Bugger all.

ImogenTubbs · 17/12/2017 22:38

OP - I made a promise to myself a few years back that I would never walk past a person who appeared to be in serious trouble - unconscious, distressed, etc. A few times when I have felt vulnerable I have asked a police officer to check them out instead of approaching them myself, but if I won't ignore someone unconscious in the street. You were not irresponsible.

LipstickHandbagCoffee · 17/12/2017 22:41

What are you suggesting the homeless charity do?whats your preferred intervention
The charity will sign post to other services,offer health check up, help apply for benefits, if asked can help contact significant others

Unescorted · 17/12/2017 22:47

Write to your MP and local councillors. Ask them to prioritise wrap around care for the homeless and vote against universal credit and local housing allowance caps for singles that do not even cover social rent properties. Ask your politicians why we subsidise from our taxes people buying a £400,000 house but can't find money to get a bed for the night when it is ten below.

HermionesRightHook · 17/12/2017 22:48

I don't know what the answer is to giving money or not, but I can't always give cash - partly because I don't always have any on me. There is also definitely organised begging going on in the area I see homeless people most often; we've been warned about it by the police.

So I make a monthly DD donation to Shelter and give money directly to people occasionally, as well as reporting locations to rough sleeping hotline.

I have no idea if what I'm doing is the right thing but I feel it's better than not doing anything. Shelter are a great charity.

Bubblebubblepop · 17/12/2017 22:52

I expect Nothing at all lipstick. Just refraining from posting links about whether they think the public should give cash to try and win an irrelevant argument on the internet would be nice

LipstickHandbagCoffee · 17/12/2017 23:03

I haven’t posted any links supporting giving cash to homeless,someone else did.
I responded to that poster,their homeless charity,is in fact drug Rehab & criminal justice
Different emphasis.different ideological basis.not a homeless charity at all

Hairyfairy01 · 17/12/2017 23:13

Ignoring all the other comments, of course you weren’t irresponsible. If your dh has a medical background he has a duty of care to make sure the homeless person was ok. Exposing your child to such horrors isn’t a bad thing, hopefully it will be a life lesson.

maeraprocyon · 17/12/2017 23:14

I was street homeless for a while, and knew (and still know, very well) most of the homeless people in the large city where I lived. The fact that I didn't drink, smoke or use drugs was a major talking point among the other homeless folk I knew, so unusual was it.

In my experience 99% of street homeless are addicted to drink or drugs or both. In almost all cases, they aren't abusing substances because they're homeless, they're homeless because they're absuing substances. They will almost always deny having substance abuse issues but are almost always begging solely to feed their habit. The homeless are NOT required to pay for a bed at a night shelter and most homeless are given (by passers by) more food than they could possibly eat - all of their money goes on feeding their habit. It doesn't do anyone any help to delude ourselves that most homeless people aren't on drugs or that if they are, they only do so because they're homeless, because that really is not the case.

It is generally not actually hard to get off the streets. Homeless charities are very good at getting people into supported accommodation very quickly, as happened with me. If you're genuinely just down on your luck and just need a helping hand getting a roof back over your head and helping you sort out benefits or get back into work, this is fairly easy to do. A lot of 'homeless' you see begging are not actually street homeless and in fact do have accommodation.

What they find hard is sustaining that accommodation. Most homeless people I know have been housed multiple times and lost that accomodation each time due to rent arrears or anti-social behaviour stemming from their substance abuse issues. Even many of those who sleep on the streets have accommodation but don't utilise it because the time and money spent travelling to and from it is time and money which could instead be used to fund their habit.

Rehab alone is rarely successful because the user immediately returns to the same social circle etc. and inevitably relapses. Many had poor childhoods and never had a 'normal' life to begin with so lack the life skills neccessary to build a life away from substance abuse. What does have a better success rate is long term residebtial rehab where the user not only detoxes from drink or drugs but is also given therapy to deal with the underlying issues and is taught the skills they need to function in society. They go through several stages of rehab, increasing their level of independence and decreasing their need for support, and by the time they leave rehab have accommodation, a work placement and the life skills they need to make a go of it. That sort of rehab is vastly more successful than short term rehab or detox.

If you really want to help homeless people, campaign for more funding and access for more long term residential rehabs, and for more effective support for troubled families and kids in care in the first place so they don't grow up with the issues which often result in them spiralling into addiction and homelessness.

What does nothing to help is to delude yourself that
-homeless people aren't on drugs
-they're only on drugs because they're homeless
-your money will be spent on food or shelter
-a roof over their head will solve their problems

LipstickHandbagCoffee · 17/12/2017 23:27

Duty of care,yes.that could be enacted by calling ambulance,an assessment at safe distance,coordinating 999 call
Duty of care doesn’t mean undertake risky intervention,it means act safely and appropriately
In UK law a passing doctor has no legal obligation to assist a person in distress. However ethically there’s an Good Samaritan principe expectation to intervene if
It’s emergency
safe to do so
Within your skills

LipstickHandbagCoffee · 17/12/2017 23:34

good comprehensive post, maeraprocyon

Hairyfairy01 · 17/12/2017 23:34

Indeed lipstick, so i’m Wondering what part of duty of care the op dh did. Maera you give a lot to think about.

LipstickHandbagCoffee · 17/12/2017 23:37

You’d need op to elaborate on that

MrsTerryPratchett · 17/12/2017 23:42

What does have a better success rate is long term residebtial rehab where the user not only detoxes from drink or drugs but is also given therapy to deal with the underlying issues and is taught the skills they need to function in society. They go through several stages of rehab, increasing their level of independence and decreasing their need for support, and by the time they leave rehab have accommodation, a work placement and the life skills they need to make a go of it. That sort of rehab is vastly more successful than short term rehab or detox.

I agree wholeheartedly. And twenty years ago we still had a lot of these brilliant places that changed lives. Guess what happened to them... Because AA is cheaper than residential rehab that actually works. Populist policies that don't work and a media that encourages judgement and ignorance left politicians free to make policies that kill people.

Greenshoots1 · 18/12/2017 04:57

There are several very effective charities, Crisis is one of them. Ill put my link in again!

www.crisis.org.uk/get-involved/streets-of-london/

crisis homeless choir

HuskyMcClusky · 18/12/2017 05:27

This is what’s wrong with the world. Someone is potentially DEAD and it’s irresponsible to help them if you have a child with you? Sorry but it’s far more irresponsible to ignore them.

I agree completely.

The child was 11, not 4. That is old enough to understand that yes, some people in our society have no homes.

BitOutOfPractice · 18/12/2017 08:26

I'm not sure I would've taken a child with me if I genuinely thought he was dead. That could've been pretty traumatic.

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