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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

Original poster

Aibu for calling her a racist?

131 replies

spiritofadventure · 14/12/2017 09:22

Went out for a few pre christmas drinks with a group of close friends on Saturday night. Nobody was drunk and we had been out for maybe 1 hour when somehow, the conversation turned into a discussion about Trump.

One of my friends came out with 'Trump is going to change the world for the better' and then proceeded to have a good old rant about how 'blacks and mexicans' are responsible for 'all' the crime in America. I asked her what she was basing this on , to which she replied 'people should just stick to their own people and stay in their own countries'.

This comment left me open mouthed and furious! I am mixed race and 2 other friends in the group are from another European country.

I told her that I had no idea she had such controversial opinions and that i didn't want to carry on a conversation with a racist. And then I left.

We haven't spoken since, but I have spoken to other members of the group and have been told that she is 'deeply hurt' that I called her a racist and she wants an apology.

I stand by what I said and i don't want to apologise.

Aibu??

OP posts:
RebeccaBunch · 14/12/2017 11:50

its not my job to educate the ignorant or goady fuckers hjgguygi8y86, especially not one as committed and belligerent as you are.

missperegrinespeculiar · 14/12/2017 11:51

Well done! These hateful views should always be challenged!

To the posters that say "live an let live", if you are part of the group targeted these opinions have real consequences on your life, they make your life harder, sometimes dangerous, you can only ignore them if you are not targeted

and for the argument that only one option is acceptable in society, I am sorry, you may have a right to your opinion, I am not stopping you from saying it, go ahead, but then don't complain if I do not want to associate with you, it is my right to be of the opinion that I do not want racist and/or xenophobic (who cares which it is precisely, both are horrible!) cunts in my life!

Ceto · 14/12/2017 11:51

To be a racist means the person believes one race is superior to another. She didn't say anything to show you she believes that.

This sentence on its own is nonsense, hjgguy. This woman said that blacks and Mexicans are responsible for all the crime in America. If it were true, clearly she is saying that white people are all honest and never commit crimes whereas people of the named races commit every crime from littering to rape and murder. If you seriously claim that that isn't a statement that one race is superior to another, you cannot understand plain English.

JassyRadlett · 14/12/2017 11:53

Either hjgguygi8y86 is racist and deploying well-tested tactics to defend racism, or hopelessly thick and unable to construct a logical argument from first principles, or understand the importance of context in interpreting text.

I wonder which.

OhChill · 14/12/2017 11:53

hjg

I refer you to my previous post. Bye now!

IvorBiggun · 14/12/2017 11:55

Particularly appreciating your posts IrisAtwood and others.

We should stave the GF of oxygen now.

IvorBiggun · 14/12/2017 11:55

starve

JingsMahBucket · 14/12/2017 11:57

YANBU and good on you for calling out the racism.

Others, please don't let @hjgguygi8y86 derail the post. S/he is being a GF and deliberately trying to press people's buttons.

Gilead · 14/12/2017 11:58

So predictable and such a very, very poor, distasteful position
Ahh, sweetie, I rather think you are in 'distasteful position'.

Gilead · 14/12/2017 11:59

I do find it interesting that when one refuses to engage with a person with such views, one is accused of having no argument; posted to force an argument so that they can further promulgate said views. Hmm

IvorBiggun · 14/12/2017 12:01

It’s a conundrum Jassy, that’s for sure!

Do your friends who have contacted you know what happened op?

Believeitornot · 14/12/2017 12:02

@hjgguygi8y86

Please respond to: This sentence on its own is nonsense, hjgguy. This woman said that blacks and Mexicans are responsible for all the crime in America. If it were true, clearly she is saying that white people are all honest and never commit crimes whereas people of the named races commit every crime from littering to rape and murder. If you seriously claim that that isn't a statement that one race is superior to another, you cannot understand plain English.

Because this one of many valid arguments against your post.

In fact you haven’t directly responded to the counter arguments - you’ve just been defensive about the right to your opinion.

hjgguygi8y86 · 14/12/2017 12:02

IvorBiggun

hjggy you made several sweeping statements including the assertion that “Blacks are more likely to commit violent crime in the US” without giving any thought to the context or even understanding what that means.

You are forgetting the OP's post and the purpose of this thread. The OP has not asked us to delve into the background of crime figures, she has asked us whether she was right to call the other woman a racist and I very clearly went through all the statements made by the woman. Of course I am not going to begin an examination of social structures around it, as that has nothing to do with the OP's post and this AIBU.

Racism is socially unacceptable - it’s why we have legislation on our statue books to make it criminal and also to protect rights in civil law. Your logic is seriously flawed.

No, yours is. You keep jumping to conclusions and assumptions. You said I must have known my comments were socially unacceptable. My comments, not racism. I hold on racist comments. I have stood back and considered what the woman OP was talking to said and I have answered the AIBU.

It’s also not escaped my attention that this thread by a mixed race woman who has witnessed racism had been hijacked by hjgguygi8y86 to tell us she and all those who agree with her are wrong. I’m not interested in continuing to give her a platform and the attention craved so I’m done.

Can you really not see the irony in what you have written? I posted one post. Just one that offered my reply to the AIBU. I have been met with a barrage of hate and insults. In response to these posts by you and others, I have responded requesting you to support your hateful comments and the accusations. Not one of you has. How unbelievably ironic that my replying to all the onslaught of attacks from all of you is then translated by you as me hijacking this thread.

This thread has already been hijacked - by all of you who are the "you're racist" bunch who simply cannot ever step back and think about things intelligently or debate properly and nicely. Not everyone who disagrees with you is a racist, but the only way you can cope with others' opinions is to believe that everyone else is a racist because you have nothing to back up anything you say.

This is MN at its worst. I'm out of here because it's horrible bullying behaviour. You have no idea how much damage you do to the anti-racism cause or how much damage you do to yourselves by failing so starkly to talk to people whose opinions you don't agree with. You must all live in such closed, shallow worlds, no wonder you come on here so full of hate and so empty of arguments. I'm gone.

IvorBiggun · 14/12/2017 12:04

I’m veering towards thick now Jassy

IvorBiggun · 14/12/2017 12:05

...with a dollop of sanctimonious arrogance.

Believeitornot · 14/12/2017 12:07

@hjgguygi8y86 shame you’ve left but you haven’t actually really responded with any logic as to why what you say is not racist.

I suspect you can’t quite back your argument up and it’s easier to run away.

IrkThePurist · 14/12/2017 12:10

spiritofadventure Ywnbu, but I'd also be concerned about friends who didnt call out the racist comments, then tried to make you apologise.

RhiWrites · 14/12/2017 12:16

' x is really upset with you and is livid that you called her a racist in front of everyone. She just messaged me saying how can she be a racist when she is friends with you?'

Message back “we are not friends because I’m not friends with racists”

zzzzz · 14/12/2017 12:31

This reply has been deleted

Message withdrawn at poster's request.

NotACleverName · 14/12/2017 12:48

hjgguygi8y86 NC for this post.

Ah, so you're too chickenshit to post that under your regular user name? Good to know.

thegrinchreaper · 14/12/2017 12:51

The only apology she'd get from me is 'sorry-I'll call you a xenophobe next time'. Is she fucking for real.
Good on you for walking away. Too many people sit there in uncomfortable silence.

Original poster
spiritofadventure · 14/12/2017 12:59

hjgguy as I have said already on this thread, I am respectful of people's opinions, whether I agree or not, if they can put forward an intelligent argument based on fact. She did not.

OP posts:
IrisAtwood · 14/12/2017 12:59

hjgguygi8y86
As for your statistics, while they can be used to justify the statement that black and Mexican people have higher rates than other races, what they don’t do is identify or take into account any causal factors or variables other than race which may be responsible for the differences.

Different ethnicities have different experiences of the world (often due to racism by the way). Experiences of poverty, deprivation, marginalisation and discrimination are mediated by the particular ethnicity of the individual. This is why pointing out that Asians are an ethnic minority but do not feature as strongly in crime statistics is not an adequate rebuttal to the suggestion that being an ethnic minority is a major factor in criminality rather than simply being black or Mexican.

IrisAtwood · 14/12/2017 13:05

Thanks IvorBiggun and you are right about not giving h. any more oxygen.

MorbidBibliomancy · 14/12/2017 13:32

YANBU, OP. I wouldn't want anything to do with a person like that either. Sounds like you're well shot of her.

Also seconding a PP's recommendation of The 13th for anyone interested. It made me equal parts angry and heartbroken, but it's a fantastically put together documentary and clearly explains the problems of systemic racism in the US and the prison industrial complex.