Leaving toddler in car

[rabbitsdontlayeggs]

Please settle this disagreement for me and my DH!

Leaving toddler (20 months) in the car while you go and pay for petrol. Would you do it? I would not (unless I was using pay at the pump, then I wouldn't get her out as I'd be stood right next to the car) but DH says he would and has. I'm horrified that he's left her and have said I really don't want him to do that again, he thinks I am ridiculous and 'it's only for two minutes'.

Who is UR?

Those are risks, OP, but so are the risks of her getting hit by a car in the forecourt. They're all low, but they all exist. You can't keep your children 100% safe 100% of the time. It's up to each parent to weigh them up. I've heard of too many accidents in forecourts, including a child death opposite my MIL's house, to think that it's worth getting them out of the car to avoid the very minor risks you've identified.

Only on Mumsnet do people take their children out of the car to pay, I’ve never seen anyone do it IRL.

I'm on Mumsnet and I'm a real person! I take mine with me to pay, but I wouldn't judge someone who didn't. The one that walks is really quite docile (when out in public) and was never a bolter and I always felt more comfortable having him with me. I do always seem to end up buying him some chocolate though... If he had been a bolter I might have left him in the car!

It's one thing to take out a small baby in carry seat, just wait until you have 2 including a bolter...

Well, it appears you can still have PFB moments even after the baby stage!

This is an age old MN debate - and never the twain shall meet .

Personally, I always left ds in his car seat in the car. Could always see the car when paying - and he wasn't able to undo his car seat harness. My viewpoint is that that is a far smaller risk then trying to wrestle him out the car and across the forecourt.

If the forecourt is such a dangerous place with the potential for fires, why increase the time on it

I would never leave my child in the car! I agree with you.

So of your concerns:

Getting loose from straps - and doing what in a locked car? She's safely in the car even if the car gets damaged.
Choking - how often does she choke when not eating?
Car theft - really? From a locked car in a place covered with CCTV
Kidnapping - ditto.

Versus being walked across a forecourt where there are moving cars and she could easily break loose from your hand.

Kidnapping/car theft - unlikely. Petrol stations are covered in CCTV.
why would someone kidnap an unknown child. Sounds like more hassle than it's worth. Maybe slightly different if there is an on going custody issue.
Car getting hit cars in petrol stations are moving slowly. Even if the car was bumped I doubt a child in a well fitting car seat would be injured.

DD is 1. When she was tiny (and I was scared to have her out of my sight) I used to carry her in her seat to pay. Now she is too heavy to carry with her seat (and I've chilled out a bit!) I leave her in the car if she is asleep / happy / I can see the car. I lock the car. I figure I'm more likely to be hit walking than the car be hit hard enough to hurt her. But I usually p@p to avoid the dilemma.

I would definitely take my toddler with me to pay. Every time.

I work in a petrol station and a Mum left her 4 year old child in the car while she came into the shop to pay. The child got out of her seat and released the hand brake, the car then rolled forward into the electricity box. The child was unhurt but the car was damaged and so was the electricity box. Other customers have also left hand brakes off and cars have rolled into each other. So accidents can happen, I wouldn't leave a child in a car.

That's why I only ever did it when they were fast asleep at nap time, I used to drive around until they fell asleep and then buy petrol/ milk. I could pay at the kiosk and constantly check to see if they were still asleep. It worked a treat, they never woke up.

My concerns are:
Her getting loose from straps - surely if you were worried about that, the time to worry is when you're on the move, not parked up at a petrol station?
Choking - on what? Fresh air?
Kidnapping/car theft - lock the car. Depending on how old your car is, it might have an immobiliser.
Car getting hit - unless there's some high octane police chase going on and the pursuit goes through the petrol station, the speed at which someone drives into a petrol station generally would cause much impact if you car did get hit. In my 27 years of driving, I've never seen a car get hit in a petrol station.

Seriously, unclench.

A friend once told me that when she was little her mother left her in the car to pay at petrol station & a man got in the car & pinched the toys she was playing with & was gone before mother returned, this story stuck with me & I never leave a child in a car unattended as know this man could of taken her before her mother even noticed, fast forward a good few years and I worked in petrol station for 6 years & I'd say 99% of people would leave them in the car, (most clearly wasn't watching the children in the shop either) & some of the things that happened on the fore court just reaffirmed my choice to not leave them in the vehicle,
The signs your on about are that children arnt allowed to use the pumps or shouldn't be around the pumps when being used not that you should leave them in the vehicle while you go pay etc

I never took my dd in with me to pay, ever.
I never took my elderly mum in either, who struggled getting in and out of the car in her later years.

Basically the 'argument' is kind of should anyone stay in the car when someone goes to pay, you could say? What about teens?? (I appreciate teens would be able to get out but then would that be safe?).
The likelihood of being hit by another car or something explodes is just as likely to happen as I'm stood filling the car also.

I would leave my three in their car seats, in the locked car whilst I paid for fuel. Far safer in the car than being dragged en Masse across the forecourt.

Lock the car, tell them to watch you whilst you queue to pay, wave at them from the queue. What do you think will happen?

Kidnap/theft of car from garage forecourt- how many cases of that exist in reality I’d be interested to know I suspect we are talking less that 5 in 10 years nationally, I’d bet injury of children on garage forecourts pose a far more significant risk.
Choking, -don’t leave child eating whilst you aren’t in the car. ?
If the child can get out of the car seat unaided it either isn’t fitted correctly or they are also a high flight risk on the forecourt.

Don’t think twice about it. I use pay at the pump mostly but that’s because I’m lazy rather than because of the kids :)

"some of the things that happened on the fore court just reaffirmed my choice to not leave them in the vehicle"

What kind of things?! Do you live in the middle of the bronx? I've never seen anything exciting happen in a station forecourt! I obviously haven't lived.

As for 'a man pinched my toys and disappeared', eh?! Sounds about as likely as 'the cat ate my sandwich'. You don't think that perhaps since she was only 4 at the time, some of the detail might have got a little embroidered in the telling?! Anyhow - just lock the car!

I have twins.

Possibly in a different universe in which I was born with 4 arms, I would have been able to take them out of the car, shut the car doors, carry them across the forecourt, make payment, carry them back across the forecourt, open the car doors and strap them back in. By which time the people waiting for that pump in the car behind might have died of old age.

"some of the things that happened on the fore court just reaffirmed my choice to not leave them in the vehicle"

What things?

And I'm sorry to doubt your friend, but it seems very weird that a man would get into the car and steal her toys and be gone before her mum came out . That sounds like the type of story (patently untrue) that dd used to tell me (and absolutely believe) when she was about five.

No pay at pump here. There is no way I would take three small children across a busy forecourt and make them queue up to pay for petrol.

x-post frogsoup

My typing is very slow!

this one if the virtues of doing a dynamic risk assessment. By that I mean, how busy is the station? Is it dark? Is it raining and the forecourt slippery? If you have more than one small child with you how will you get them all out of the car and safely take all of them across the forecourt? Is the child settled or cranky? Will they get upset if alone for a few mins?
On balance a child is much safer in the car, but if you can see the place is really busy, you may feel less anxious if they are with you.
Neither of you are being unreasonable.
I left mine sometimes, I took them others, it all depends.

Leaving kids strapped in the car is fine.
Especially given you don't live in the States.

haha, great minds Maryz!

Unless you live in a very high crime area if I was your DH I would be concerned by your risk perception