To not want dh to go to on midnight mass this year?

[Jellybellyqueen]

Dh goes to a church group once a week, church on sunday, and on special celebrations. He pretty much always goes to midnight mass on xmas eve, and also wants to go on xmas day, which we are spending at my parents this year. None of the (primary aged) dc are interested in going, nor am i, as he's the only religious one in the house. We've been as a family before, dc bored and me trying to keep them quiet, so im not doing it again.
Im also sick of staying in on my own wrapping presents on xmas eve. AIBU to ask him to give it a miss this once?

Butchy you’re out for an argument and you’re being difficult. You only sent a few messages directed at me so I’m sure you can work out.
I didn’t do either of those things but if it makes you feel better telling me I have then do continue.

Can he not go alone ?

You only sent a few messages directed at me so I’m sure you can work out.

And you've sent rather cryptic responses which make it difficult to decipher what point you're referring to.

Do you think the fact that the vast majority of posters actually quote excerpts from the post to which they're responding is merely coincidence?

I think you DO want an argument, hence the reason you keep coming back to fire yet more cryptic responses in my direction.

I think the OP's DH is being a dick and I'm not a practising Christian, but I still think writing off Christianity - and I assume therefore all other religions - as 'a hobby' is perhaps slightly reductive

Agreed.

But I suppose reducing all religious belief to a mere hobby or somesuch makes it easier to write off wholesale as sky fairy hogwash and not something to be respected in terms of the need to observe certain behaviours or events.

He’s not really a practising christian though isn’t he? He behaves like a massive wanker but swans off to sit in a church each week. I thought people who are into gods are meant to be really nice to everyone, maybe it’s just not women/their wives it applies to?

As has been noted...all of the lazy arsedness could be a front to justify the ridiculousness of the opening post.

If this man hadn't picked religion as a hobby, he would have picked something else. People can have all sorts of hobbies (including the sort that involve mythology and talking to imaginary friends) and not be selfish dicks who expect the rest of the family to organise everything in such a way that the hobby is prioritized even when other family members don't participate in it.

All of this stuff 're effort took about 10 posts from the OP before it came out....just not convincing yet seems to be occupying so many posts.

To those of you dismissing it as a hobby, are you aware that Christianity is based on real historical events and not ‘imaginary friends’ and ‘mythology’? You can make your own decision about that, obviously, but the sneering is uncalled for. There is so much unnecessary mocking on mumsnet.

We should respect each other’s right to choose our own path in life.

are you aware that Christianity is based on real historical events

There is absolutely no proof of that. Much less of the alleged "miracles". The man may have existed, there is also no proof of that, but whether he was who he claimed to be is purely a matter of opinion.

I have not taken the piss out of anyone for their beliefs on this or any other thread, but please dont bandy opinion around as fact.

"are you aware that Christianity is based on real historical events"

No it isn't.

@BarbarianMum

I don't know enough about either Islam or Christianity to comment (atheist) Bertrand but the point is trying to get between someone and their religious practice on a large religious occasion for something as spurious as present wrapping is unfair. If there is something bigger going on in the relationship OP should deal with that face on.

Agree 🖕🏻

I think YABU

And I say that as a Pagan who celebrates Yule on the 21st/22nd and not Christmas

Christmas is just the 25th of December to me, just another day, a day that I have off work when I have to fight for the right to have Yule off

Let your DH have his evening mass, just wrap the presents a day or two earlier

All religions are as bad as each other and as worthy of derision. Some are worse than others. Islam for example is worse than Christianity.

Serious historians all accept that Jesus existed; there is more written evidence of that than of Julius Caesar, and no one questions whether he existed, do they?

The Jews accepted that the miracles happened, but that’s a different question, and no, we can’t prove it.

For many people Christmas is a cultural, rather than religious celebration (also remembering that the timing harks back to Pagan festivals and was co opted by the Christian church). The OP married a man who was not religious - he has changed the terms of their Christmas on her and imo the onus is on him to compromise. So I think one mass is fair, two in 24 hours is taking the piss. It leaves all the responsibility for making Christmas happen (for the dc) to the OP.

Butchy I’m not being difficult. You disagree with me and that’s fine. The purpose of me posting on the thread is to respond to the OP not to what everyone else’s opinions are.

I’ve given mine, you don’t like it and don’t agree with it. Fine. That’s ok.

The fact that I’ve continued to tell you that you it agreeing with me is grand suggests I don’t see any purpose in us battling this out.

I’m glad you’ve got the time to quote and make things bold, if you’re finding it difficult to respond to me I suggest you ignore what I’ve written and don’t waste your time speaking to cryptic me!

I was all geared up to say "do the wrapping on a different night, but ask him to make it one trip to Church instead of two, or attend the vigil service with the children".

However OP has tried taking the children and he ignored them, tried encouraging them to participate when he doesn't. I get the feeling this is less to do with Midnight Mass and a lot more to do with a DH who doesn't pull his weight and has a weird attitude to his religion.

A church which kicks out a woman managing restless small children at a family service (and MM is a family service) is pretty unusual and not one worth wasting time in frankly.

For someone apparently so committed to physical attendance at Church (evening and morning every week is well above average), he apparently lacks the desire to share it with his children or live the spirit of the faith. I'm intrigued as to which variety of church fosters this.

Butchy I’m not being difficult.

I never said you were being difficult. You are being extremely discourteous and cryptic however.

I’m glad you’ve got the time to quote and make things bold, if you’re finding it difficult to respond to me I suggest you ignore what I’ve written and don’t waste your time speaking to cryptic me!

It is a common courtesy to quote from the part of a post that you are replying to. You will see that the vast majority of posters do this. There's a reason for it.

Trying to imply that you don't have "time" to follow a very basic courtesy to other posters is a nonsense.

I simply don't believe that you can't see the problem in posting things like "Butchy, I have and I’m not" and expect me to have the faintest clue what post you're referring to, far less what point in the post.

The fact that you are simply coming onto this thread now to fire off replies to me and contribute nothing to the actual discussion suggests that you really, really do want to keep things going.

"Serious historians all accept that Jesus existed;"

Serious historians all accept that there was probably a person called Jesus living about the right time. They do not accept that he was the son of god.

Haven't read the whole thread but it seems absolutely ridiculous! Wrap presents the night before, spend the evening with DCs and DH, then wave him off at 11 and either go to bed or pour yourself a glass of wine and crack open the chocolates.

*Maybe you should read the thread? It usually helps, I find. wink

Unless he’s thumping 50 shades of New Testament at you and the kids, or haunting his local church 24/7, how’s it going to affect “family life”?

One can adhere to a religious faith without expecting the rest of the family to sign up too.

And presumably you do think that one’s spouse should be allowed to have external interests?*

Just catching up with it now, Bitchy!

It affects family life by religious observance preventing day trips on Sundays, just for a start. How do family holidays work if one partner insists on going to 2 church services a week?

And yes, external interests are great. DP and I have several. But they're things that can be done as and when, not requiring us to be at a certain place at a certain time every Sunday/Christmas Eve/Christmas Day etc.

I am totally with the OP on this one. Why don't you just ask DH when he is intending to wrap the kids xmas presents with you, then leave it with him to think about! Why is it bloody always the womans job to wrap the presents anyway!! I don't even think that it s the wrapping of presents as such, it is the fact that if the OP wasn't around then he wouldn't be able to go to the service anyway (unless he took his children with him). Therefore why is the OP the constant babysitter?

In fact I think that you should arrange to be "away" on Xmas Eve, see how he manages then. There must be plenty of single parents that would love to go out on Xmas Eve but have the responsibility of their children.

How do family holidays work if one partner insists on going to 2 church services a week?

Quite easily, I found. Particularly in the days of the internet. I had an observant mother who used to research - and later get me to google - local churches in the area we were bound for and pop into whatever church was nearest to wherever we were staying.

I personally never experienced family life being curtailed by the fact my mother was a practising Catholic and dragged me along back in the day. Obviously I can only speak from personal experience.

Of course, taken to extremes I can imagine it having an impact but I know very few seriously devout Christians these days. I wouldn't really class pootling off to a Saturday night vigil or a Sunday mass as being seriously devout, nor even attendance at MM and Christmas Day services.