to have just cried when DS told me this? (edited by MNHQ)

[ReallyNormalForNorfolk]

He's only just turned 7, and appears to have worked it all out for himself. Santa doesn't exist, does he mummy? It's just you and daddy isn't it? I honestly didn't know what to say. I don't like to lie exactly, and sort of changed the subject to how you can believe in things that you can't see - like love, different people's gods, etc. He then said religion was a load of rubbish and not true as he had never seen an angel come down from heaven. Fair dues, a rational analysis I guess, but I was hoping that this moment wouldn't be quite so soon.
He is in fact a very rational little boy, and I don't want to lie to him, and give him the time to make his own mind up - but I am sad to say I did shed a tear or two because it seemed like such a loss of innocence/watershed type growing up moment. I said "should we forget about xmas then?" No, he still wants the presents! I haven't confirmed or denied anything - just feel a bit awkward about it all -wwyd?

I'm 27 and my mum still writes 'love from Santa' on my presents.

My 9 year old believes but not really I think. It is nice to let children have a tiny bit of magic. I have said that stockings get filled whether children believe or not. Cryptic enough to take it as Santa must be real or parents do it. But it also takes the pressure off the decision to not believe, they can do what they want. My daughter loves fantasy and half believes in a lot of things, like that she might get an acceptance letter to Hogwarts :-) my 7 year old boy is much more straight forward and I thought he had figured it out last year. But because his older sister believes he seems to be following suit for now.

ffs so h knows so what

i was never lied to about som made up man in a suit my parents bought me presents that was that didnt miss out on anything

DS aged nine has confronted me a couple of weeks ago about Santa, because of the kids at school telling him Santa’s not real. He was very upset when I admitted it. “Why did you lie to me for so many years?”was the question that got me!
Poor sausage was quite upset, cried a bit and said Christmas will never be the same again. So there, the magic is with the ‘believer’ if you see what I mean - it’s not for Mumsnet or anyone else to decide if Christmas is magic or not

Hola,
I’m sick so haventbread all of the posts.

I did read a thing on Pinterest’s a few months ago about “making them Santa”

In short, when they stop believing you explain to them that there’s not just 1 Santa, the guy in the red coat is just a cover for something more special. Explain that you and dh are Santa’s and would he like to be one too.

Let him buy some gifts and wrap them “from Santa” I suppose this works best if u have younger children but if u don’t he could give his gifts to an old people’s home etc?

So it keeps the magic of generosity and giving alive but not the fairy tale of Reindeer flying through the sky..?

(Sorry if someone mentioned this already)

I tried to make him feel better by saying that Santa as a person may not be real, but the tradition is real, the kindness and generosity towards those around one is a wonderful spirit that parents all over the world keep alive through the idea of Santa.
I told him he could become a part of it by choosing presents for his younger cousins if he wants to.
He seemed to like that and accepted the idea of Santa as a tradition and of the Christmas spirit going on

Haven’t read* ffs

Haha, crossed posts
But Defo what I would have done 😊

NannyJones snap! (Sorry you’re sick btw)

I applied a version of that and it really seemed to help DS, thinking about it like that

My son was about 5, he wasn't having any of it. We went to Disney when he was around 6, didn't believe that either. He can smell BS a mile off.
A bright lad you've got there OP.
Tell him the truth and say we'll still have loads of fun!

I’m not sure that it’s rational, he can’t see it so therefore it must be rubbish - that’s a 7 year old being a 7 year old. You should teach him to respect that beliefs can be real despite not being seen...

The thing is, a child running around 'being' a policeman or twirling around 'being' a ballerina or hurtling along 'being' a train driver knows all about the joy of 'being inside a story', of being wholly immersed in a 'pretend world'.

They don't need parents to make up lots of elaborate stories - or tell lies - to 'make it real' or 'keep them believing'. It IS real, while they are in the story, pretending, and it is simultaneously 'not real' - anyone who knows any 2-7 year olds will know they can flip between those two quite easily, and without any adult support at all other than providing the occasional basic prop and consenting to e.g. be the prisoner or the ballet teacher or a passenger in the train and joining in the story that you are telling / living in together.

My children have always known that father Christmas is a wonderful story, and like lots of other stories in their lives, they could be 'in' that story at will. So for them, and for us, it remains something that we can all 'step into' at will - we can all suspend disbelief and ponder what will be in our stockings / follow NORAD as it tracks his travels - and so has retained all its magic many years after what other families have experienced as a 'big reveal' after which Christmas has never been the same again.

I have always felt uncomfortable about deliberately creating and fostering a lie which has one day to be discovered, but have always loved creating and entering into a fabulous story alongside my children, in the same way as my - now very elderly - parents still manifest a childish glee in preparing stockings and creeping around to deliver them to their middle-aged offspring and their teenage grandchildren.

DS was 6 when he insisted it simply wasn't possible that Santa could do everything on Xmas Eve. He's always been a rational, scientific sort. DD tried hard to change his mind, probably feeling she could be blamed for telling him. But I just agreed, and asked him not to tell his friends as they might still believe. He didn't tell and we still had good Christmases afterwards. We evolved the game where the DCs try to catch me putting their stockings in their rooms. They've never caught me yet. 😁

It’s time to give him the talk about how we’re all Santa because we give gifts to other people to make them happy.

We told ours that Father Christmas is another name for the 'Spirit of Christmas' and that everyone can enjoy that. I believed in Father Christmas and I can still remember my shock and feelings of emptiness when my Dad casually told me that he didn't exist.

My mum will still not acknowledge he doesn't exist and both her kids are in their 30s

I told my son about Saint Nicholas, and that people still remember him and celebrate him in the form of Santa. He sees it like we celebrate the birth of Jesus, but he’s not around anymore. He loves the magic of Christmas and still buys into the whole Santa thing. I think it’s miserable to say it’s all just a lie. Jesus wasn’t born on Christmas Day either, so that’s a lie but we still celebrate it.

When Ds was nearly 5 he asked if Santa was really me and daddy.
I've always done "some people say FC brings presents - let's leave whisky and mince pies out just in case", so my answer was "which do you think is more likely, someone flying through the sky with magic reindeer and managing to give presents to millions of children in one night, or that all the grown-ups are sneaking off and buying presents for children and hiding them and pretending?"

He happily replied that no way would all the grown-ups be that kind and organised! While clearly realising that must actually be the alternative.

Now ds makes up his own character each year who he swears will be the minion delivering presents. He must be right - they always leave a note...

I think it’s miserable to say it’s all just a lie.

Absolutely. It isn't a lie. It's a story - a story based on St Nicholas, and embodying the important things about Christmas. The different versions of the Nativity story in the different Gospels are like that, too - they are based on the birth of Jesus, but the details (was he visited by wise men, or by shepherds? ) was part of the way the authors of the Gospels wanted to tell the story. Links between the timing of Christmas and Yule are also all bound up in the stories and traditions too, as are the traditions that different countries have around St Nicolas' feast day and Epiphany.

Plenty of magic and wonderful stories. Those dismissing it as 'lies' - do you do that to all stories - read Thomas the Tank Engine and finish off with 'of course it's a lie' every time? Equally, do we have to force children to 'believe' in Thomas the Tank Engine if they are to enjoy the stories?

Beyond 7 is abnormal in my view

Agree. They are humouring their sentimental parents or hoping to keep the supply of presents going (or both), if they pretend to believe after that.

Children aren't stupid.

I’m getting on now, over 50; I do consider myself spiritual, but not a regular church goer; However, I do believe in the “spirit” of Christmas; for children it’s “embodied” in Father Christmas; for adults it’s that warm feeling of end of year, cosy colours of winter evergreen and red berries, nights with the family and very many people reaching out and showing a special unexplainable warmness to others; surely, it’s a spirit of sorts that comes over us; I really hope your little DS does know this feeling and does not lose it. In this turbulent world, it’s one of those things that I’ll does seem to be miraculous ;-) !

I do wonder whether the rigidity of 'having to ensure that your children believe in Santa' (absolutely not the norm in my own 1970s childhood), with an almost cult-like insistence on reindeer food and mince pies and Never Telling The Children Or Christmas Will Be Ruined is because children don't do 'make believe play' as much anymore, in the era of screens? 'Make believe' play of many days' duration is a predominant memory of my own childhood, and something my now teenage children did a LOT of - but I see less of it at playtime in school now, beyond relatively formulaic 'retelling' of known TV series and e.g. 'mummies and daddies'.

Links between the timing of Christmas and Yule are also all bound up in the stories and traditions too,

Ah yes, I love all the festive murder and torture as I persuade others to believe the same as me.

Well I don’t think you’re being over dramatic. There’s a very small window of time when kids are completely innocent and you can enjoy indulging them with belief in all kinds of lovely magical wondrousness before they have to live in the shitty real world forever. I totally understand why you cried. My eldest is 7 and I dread that moment.

Be proud you have such an intelligent DC