to wonder why Corbyn isn't more popular considering the battering Theresa May/the Tories is getting?

[mothertruck3r]

The Tories/Theresa May have been getting an absolute kicking in the press recently (rightly deserved) and every day there seems to be a new controversy. May seems completely inefficient and doesn't seem to know whether she is coming or going (literally).

However, I am surprised that Corbyn/Labour is not polling higher. On all the polls I have looked at his rating seems to be either equal to, very slightly above or very slightly below May. He should be well out in front at this point.

I am not a Corbyn/Labour fan (although agree with a lot of their policies) but I am wondering why is he not polling better?

My fear at the moment is that they have been allowed to go so far, that anyone left of them which includes a lot of conservatives are called "lefties" plus a whole host of other insults. I always thought most people sit pretty much central in the UK - but the way our political system works we have to choose a side - and that side may go too way one or way or the other for our liking.

I think that is a bit of confirmation bias, momentum et all pretty much called anyone and everyone a daily mail reader, red Tory, it was evident on here and I've seen many prominent labour supporters called Tories because they dared to question dear leader in the run up to the last GE, centrism is Unfortunetly what got us in this mess and I say this as a centrist, but the term it's just a different colour tie did hold weight.

Tammy agree wholeheartedly.

I worry about the younger generation, will there be anything left for them. Every gen is getting a worse deal than the last. That is not how it should work.

If we'd had PR in 2010, the second biggest party would have been UKIP.

Not necessarily - because this IMO and expression of tactical voting in a first past the post system. I imagine with a PR system UKIP would have got somewhere around 8%, which would represent people who vote UKIP come what may. In the last election how many people were voting to keep the Tories/Labour out? We have already had a few on this thread saying that they would have liked to have voted one way, but needed to keep the one they didn't want out.

justalurker that is an interesting way to put it. I hadn't thought of it like that.

I suppose my mind says I don't fit into either party particularly well - or didn't. But I've shifted over the years to the left as it is more in tune - although I don't agree with all party policies. In my mind that put me more in the centre of both, but if I read you right that the centralised notion is more of a Media blurb to make people more comfortable with switching teams?? Or I am still not getting it?

A lot of Corbyn's policies would be considered fairly middle of the road in Continental Europe and Scandinavia.

That isn’t true every generation is getting less than previous generations

Things have hugely improved in some areas in the last 30 years and declined in others

But we have to make changes if we still want an NHS if we still want to social care to be able to give the support it does or go back to what it did before recent cuts, and likewise with education and emergency services but for that we would all have to pay more tax not just a few and labour under Corbyn won’t put that forward as it isn’t very popular with

Tammy if you're able to show the Corbyn hasn't sympathised with terrorists regimes, doesn't enable anti semitism and has never expressed admiration for Marx I'm sure all those posters who've mentioned these things would genuinely like to know

In the meantime, though, it's like watching the mum who attended her son's school parade and cried "Ooooo look ... they're all out of step except our Johnnie!!"

That isn’t true every generation is getting less than previous generations

Things have hugely improved in some areas in the last 30 years and declined in others

But we have to make changes if we still want an NHS if we still want to social care to be able to give the support it does or go back to what it did before recent cuts, and likewise with education and emergency services but for that we would all have to pay more tax not just a few and labour under Corbyn won’t put that forward as it isn’t very popular with

Nice to see all the Daily Fail hyperbole of "haemorrhaging" money to "health tourists", when the truth is that it's less than 0.3% of the budget (if I remember correctly, I cba to google, but it's something around that). Policing it would cost more than that.

And that's ignoring that helping people who need help is the moral thing to do. I'm not arguing any more with people who think that someone should just be thrown out to die. You are wrong, and you will continue to be wrong not to mention a horrible person

Baby boomers had,

1. access to free higher education
2. job security,
3. decent pensions
4. quality housing that didn't cost 5 x salary

My gen

1. affordable higher education
2. access to affordable rented accommodation
3. part final salary pensions
4. reasonable permanent job opportunities

Next gen

1. less access to higher education due to increasing costs. Student Loans and Tuition Fees
2. unaffordable levels of rent
3. limited access to affordable housing
4. zero hour or fixed term flex contracts in a wide range of jobs.
5. linked to 4, less job security

Even without the threats to our NHS, and other public services, Opportunities are not improving for - I'm actually surprised that more of the younger generations are not up in arms at their prospects.

If we'd had PR in 2010, the second biggest party would have been UKIP. Thank god their star has waned!!

And Hitler gained his power due to proportional representation.

Hitler was elected by proportional representation, but he gained his power by referendums.

So I gather PR is not popular .

Is there a historian who can explain how PR brought Hitler to power. Not the Wikepedia version. I read it, but it looked like a fight going on between the rise of communism and the rise of the Nazis - two unpleasant choices, so it kept swinging ????

Why oh why did I take a minor in American Politics & history rather than European. Need to go back to school

Wow cardinal - way to make judgments! What a lovely caring lefty you are - typical corbynista!

Oh please no to the mud slinging. I was actually having an interesting conversation and learning a few things. History, why people vote one way or the other, that people don't like PR. Genuinely interesting. should have known better it's AIBU

Oh dear Rebecca, not so good at reading, are we...

Frankly cardinal not one word of your tripe on this thread is worth reading!

We had a vote on whether to introduce PR - excuse a wiki link: not that many turned out to vote and the answer was quite decisive. Not sure why, given that everyone moans about first past the post: en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/United_Kingdom_Alternative_Vote_referendum,_2011

You are wrong, and you will continue to be wrong not to mention a horrible person

Tbh making comments like that say more about you than anyone else.

We didn't have a Referendum on whether to introduce PR - the Alternative vote isn't PR.

Next gen 1) less access to higher education due to increasing costs. Student Loans and Tuition Fees
Its just not true that people have less access to higher education. Its an objective fact that more and more students are going to university.

I think most people in this country are broadly socially liberal and broadly economically conservative. That's what Blair, Brown and Mandelson realised. Cameron too, to a lesser degree.

Corbyn is fine - McDonnell I'm less keen on, personal reasons - but he looks that little bit too far left economically for a lot of people.

I also think the months of infighting didn't do the party many favours, even if it does seem to have settled down now. (This part isn't really his fault.)

Finally - and this is the crucial thing - he tends to come across as a manager rather than a leader. It's a charisma thing.

There are actually an awful lot of people in this country who have no political home right now. The Conservatives are a bit too right-wing and Labour are a touch too left-wing. (The Lib Dems still fit into a people carrier so they have minimal impact.)

Corbyn can firefight like no one else - he ran rings around Theresa May in the election campaign - but he seems to struggle to get across the big picture stuff. Feels like there's no strategy, just campaigns. I think if he'd have been able to set out a cogent alternative to the government on Brexit, for example, he'd be in a stronger position.

So, let's say I am making up my mind influenced by the posts (pages of) here. There's the OP asking - why don't more people like JC if TM is so bad. Like a place your ideology and vote on a singular continuum.

But then all these opinions posted here...so many issues and so many perspectives....hardly a yes or no, singular, left or right issue.

So, hardly can one person satisfy all these points of view - JC or TM.

I suppose if you are looking for a One Leader fits all, then maybe you might prefer dictators, autocrats and charismatic (narcissus) leaders.

Nope I'll stick with the bunch we've got thanks - unless some of the Opionites here fancy giving it a go (being a politician).

TBH I'm entirely phlegmatic about what random people on the internet think of me based on a misreading of posts.

Particularly when they are the kind of people that think patients should just be turned out to die if they can't afford private treatment.

Note to self - put myself forward at the next elections I'll do it, but I know I'll get a kicking at the polls (would need a swing of 60%). I'd stand for Labour with Corby as leader. I joined the Labour Party last year after years on the political fence. To me he was the only one that made some sense. I read the policies, I liked the economic policy docs - not the snippets in the papers, like a nerd I printed them out and read them with a highlighter and a scribble pad they don't lend themselves to snippets or punchy headlines, boring sensible economics. Not the trickle down economics that are currently in play. To me they made sense

I even donated a reasonable amount to the election campaign. I now have lots of random bags, books etc - didn't really need those (a bit like kickstarter gifts if you get my drift - the gimmicks are not needed in my opinion - but I do rather like my bag).

I get there is a stability that people seek and May/the conservatives give them that? I struggle that people might actually completely agree with everything what they are doing? It's doesn't feel British to have such an aggressively right wing government in power.

All entitled to an opinion though.

Well you failed spectacularly to come up with an alternative fair solution - or did we just "misread" that too?