AIBU to think the NHS should not be recommending hysterectomy to young girls

[pisacake]

NHS handout for 'young trans people in the UK'

www.mermaidsuk.org.uk/assets/media/17-15-02-A-Guide-For-Young-People.pdf

'Surgical Options'

"Hysterectomy
This surgery involves the removal of the interior female sexual organs. This prevents the risk of cancer and forever prevents periods or risk of pregnancy"

Sounds awesome doesn't it!

Here's the NHS advice on taking drugs

"Hormone Blockers
If blockers (or anti-androgens) are taken when younger, the effects from puberty are likely not to occur and a more passable body is likely to result."

Yes, that's right kids you can just skip puberty, and be Peter Pan. It's a brave new world where you are stuck with a micropenis for the rest of your life.

And what if your stupid parents don't agree?

"If you are under 16 a lot will depend on gaining the full support from your parents. In other countries hormone blockers can be given to younger transsexual people which will prevent the onset of unwanted secondary sex characteristics. This may mean that you look further than the UK for medical intervention. It would be undesirable to buy hormones over the internet without fully knowing what you are buying."

That's right kids! You can suppress those pesky unwanted secondary sex characteristics' by buying hormones on teh internetz. Yay NHS! Yay Aneurin Bevan!

And boys, thinking of becoming girls, it's NOTHING to worry about, you can chop off your balls and turn your dick inside out, it's perfectly normal! It will even improve your health, everything is awesome!

""Orchidectomy is the removal of the testes. This operation means that testosterone will no longer be naturally produced in the body and therefore you can do without your testosterone blocker. In general, the lower the dose of any drug the lower the health risks you will have. "

"Technology for SRS is quite advanced and with good surgery even gynaecologists are said to find it hard to distinguish a constructed vagina from a natal one. "

A constructed vagina huh? You mean like a sex toy? www.lovehoney.co.uk/sex-toys/male-sex-toys/pocket-vaginas/ I hear they are pretty realistic too.

This is NHS advice, albeit I don't think any doctor actually reviews this stuff before they print it, there seems to be an attitude that it would be transphobic to have any of this written by mainstream medics, so let's just let a self-selecting group of people with loud voices do it. (Like the group Mermaids, who are recommended in the handout, and who basically consist of one woman who took her son to Thailand at 16 to have 'bottom surgery'.)

And don't think all these pamphlets and websites telling you that hysterectomy and puberty blocking are awesome have no effect on kids. Nope, there is a MASSIVE increase in kids identifying as trans.

Here's an article today from St Albans www.hertsad.co.uk/news/increase-in-trans-support-is-offered-as-child-gender-fluidity-rises-in-st-albans-district-1-5264057

Lots and lots of girls deciding they are boys because "He wouldn’t wear knickers and refused to play with girls’ toys" and the NHS happily supporting that. (That biologically female child is seven-years-old, and per the NHS handout above you will get GREAT results, by taking puberty blockers follow by testosterone, which "offers very effective masculinisation for FTMs". Apparently said child is "adamant he will grow up and get married and be the husband and daddy and he will have a wife". )

There is obviously no meaningful consent possible by pre-pubescent child to puberty blocking, because they have no real conception of what puberty hormones would do to their body AND brain. But apparently there is no concern whatsoever about this, because EVERYTHING IS AWESOME when you're trans. So much better than being a boring old 'cis' female with periods and cancer and pregnancy and all those silly 'ciswoman' problems.

Even if you are an adult woman, suffer from horrendous periods and PMDD and know that you don't want children, you probably won't be allowed a hysterectomy on the NHS. You will be told that you "might change your mind".

I am not even allowed my tubes tied Apparently I might change my mind. I know I won't change my mind. Yet both male and female doctors have refused this to me and said to come back when I am 40!

TBH I never really got the pint if all this-why would you sacrifice your fertility just to look more 'passable'? No rational person would do something like this at such a young age. It's not responsible to offer sterilisation to children when it is very likely that they will want children eventually

MarthaArthur

I did read an article about a trans-person, can’t remember if they were male or female, who had dementia. And they totally thought they were their birth six. Couldn’t remember transitioning at all.

datun thats absolutely tragic. It cant have good effects on brain and body. To encourage kids into it is shocking.

MarthaArthur

To be honest, I think dementia is heartbreaking anyway. I would like to see the sort of money and attention that transgenderism garners diverted to that.

Belligerent It would be interesting to see if your friend said that she now identified as trans if she would be given the option of a hysterectomy...

Might be worth a shot. Can't believe that things have come to such a screwed up state of affairs that I'm actually writing that as a serious option as a way of being treated seriously in order to get treatment.

Very true. Its a shame nhs is even hinting that hormone/surgery is a thing for youngsters when they wont even fund life saving cancer drugs or routinely stock the new drug that can help dementia because it costs too much.

I often wonder if I would be on testosterone if born 5 years ago instead of 50. I always wanted to be a boy, boys had more fun, better toys, better clothes and were allowed to do so much more than girls.

This is one of the reasons I feel so strongly on the topic of transkids tbh. I was a total 'tomboy'. Ontop of this I hated being an early developer and the attention it got me. My boobs came way before my period. I was terrified at the thought of periods and would definitely have said I was a boy if I knew there was a way to 'get out of' starting periods AND getting rid of my breasts. I was in the 'never want kids' camp too as a teen. I didn't fully feel comfortable as a female until maybe about aged 20. I am now quite happy with my life, and have 2 kids who I adore. If I had been born a little later, the chance to have my life would have been taken away from me because a childlike me would have been deciding on my adult future. And by the time I fully understood, it would be too late. I would be an imitation of a man..and infertile.

Find the hysterectomy stuff quite hard to believe, especially in very young women. I asked at the start of the year aged 32 and was told that they wouldn’t consider me at this age due to the increased risk of heart attack and various other conditions that can result from having one

@elendon asides from the possible psychological and reproductive implications - does anyone know if there are general health risks around taking these drugs?

I don't know if there have been studies into the effects of long term cross sex hormones. I am certain there will be bad side effects though. As far as I am aware, no proof yet. Todays 'trans' people are the guinea pigs it seems. And of course, if anyone had any dodgy side effects they would be bullied into silence anyway, like detransitioners are. So it would be hushed up.

Lupron though, there are many many accounts of side effects from even short term use of this.

www.nwhn.org/lupron-what-does-it-do-to-womens-health/

Explains it pretty well. And these 'puberty blockers' are described as harmless, and reversible. No cases of kids on them deciding to 'reverse' the process, and a lot of people who have been on it reporting awful side effects.

Start this thread a million times. This is what our kids are facing

Absolutely.
I don't even care if it is goady.
It's horrifying that so many children are being encouraged to go down the road of life altering procedures such as hormone blockers and surgery.
Delaying puberty can carry other health risks. It's not the golden/fix- all panacea it's made out to be.
Same with the surgery. Sometimes nerves get permanently damaged.
Why wreck perfect, as they, are bodies?
Most of these children need lots and lots of counseling. The type of support where they can eventually be got to a place where they are accepting of the bodies they have.
That's where we should be throwing the money at.
Not offering them an 'easy fix', which some may regret in later life.

NHS needs to stop with their pamphlet shit and offer these children (and their parents) lots and lots of counseling and support instead.
NHS needs to stop pandering to the bullies.
What kind of institution is so worried about 'saying the wrong thing' that they're willing to risk the long term health of the Nation's Children?

This whole debacle makes me think of the Pied Piper.

Yes, It's a new world and quite frankly it's horrifying.

www.statnews.com/2017/02/02/lupron-puberty-children-health-problems/

Just found this article about Lupron.

This part was especially interesting

The drug made headlines two years later. Justice Department officials announced a civil and criminal settlement with Lupron’s then-maker. Prosecutors said the Lupron sales team rewarded doctors prescribing the drug for prostate cancer with ski trips, golf outings, and bribes. In a court document, one gynecologist said a salesperson told him he “could earn $100,000 annually” by treating the women in his practice with Lupron.

The settlement resulted in a corporate guilty plea for conspiracy to violate prescribing laws and one of the largest fines at the time — $875 million.

Just realised Pencils put the link to this story earlier in the thread Still found that part especially interesting though.

Can I ask any of you on here who thought you might have been transed as a kid, whether you genuinely think that?

Given what we now see as social contagion. Do you honestly think that you might have been sufficiently bothered to have persuaded your parents that you were in fact the opposite sex?

And how far would you have taken it? Do you think after socially transitioning, you might have considered puberty blockers?

I hear it a lot. But the trans lobby say that’s just girls being tomboys. It would not have been taken seriously.

So I’m interested to know what you think.

I still can't believe the NHS are going along with this, it just seems unreal to me. If they can find the money for this why can't they find the the money for children's mental health services, which is what these children really need. I've seen heartbreaking posts on here from parents of suicidal teens having to wait 10 months to see mental health professionals and here we are offering kids surgery to change gender ffs.

datun i was a kid who climbed trees and played dolls. I was going to marry my female best friend she was a tomboy and didnt even own dolls. She looked up how to become a boy on school computers and said she waa going to have an operation to be a boy. She even tried to bandage her none existant breasts. I think if this happenes today she would have been encouraged to have testosterone and become male. I believe she would have then become very confused as she is happily married with 2 children now.

ScrabbleFiend

Money is found, because they are outsourcing the stuff. Mermaids, I believe, get some money from the government, but most of it is donations.

From what I can gather, from other posters, this is now par for the course. The government outsourcing half their public services to charities.

MarthaArthur

Yes, she does indeed sound like a prime candidate.

Innocent children are being used in what i see as a huge experiment on small and vulnerable people in society

It's so wrong.
But what can we do?
Even some of the parents seem deluded.

I believe hee and another friend would have been encouraged to go down that route. Shes still not particularly girly now but she does like make up and stuff she disnt like back then. I had a male friend who came out as trans 2 years ago he had less than a years councilling before beimg accepted onto hormone treatment and surgery he declined last minute and chose to stay male. I havent asked him why though but he said being a woman waa hard.

The NHS will be sued to the high heavens once this generation of transkids grows up and realise what has actually been done to them. Once the long term effects of lupron and cross sex hormones start showing. When they want kids and are infertile due to drugs. When they decide that they actually are their birth sex and cannot be 'turned back'...so many ways the NHS (and possibly parents) will be sued. I hope Mermaids is one of the first casualties of this. I genuinely do. I suspect they will escape scrutiny though and the NHS will bear the brunt. Given the NHS really should know better.

Don't forget the effect on their growing bones, not to mention any other problems (at the moment a very grey area) that may not present until middle age.

Why are the NHS pandering to Mermaids?

children must be allowed to grow and mature free from any pressure from adults to adopt any particular lifestyle.

Well said.
Says it all.

The government outsourcing half their public services to charities.

Ah now it makes sense, of course they do.

I hope posters do keep talking about this issue, I know people get fed up seeing so many trans threads but I've learned a lot reading them over the last couple of years, although this is the first one I've posted on. I rarely hear anyone talking about it in RL unfortunately.

whatabreakthrough
We can talk - open this issue up. Every wrong in society I can think of stops once people hear about injustice - they want to stop it.
Currently people have been led to believe that the injustice to trans people is THE most important and dreadful wrong in society so we must all go along with whatever this group proposes.
Now we are discovering that actually significant harm is being done to children and adolescents and also to women - and we can hear about it because because people have been courageous, stood up to the silencing and spoken out.
So we must speak out and explain and challenge - respectfully but assertively because this is about the safety of our children.

Do you honestly think that you might have been sufficiently bothered to have persuaded your parents that you were in fact the opposite sex?

I would like to think not, as my parents are very much critical thinkers. BUT, there is a lot of pressure on parents to do what the children want. My mother could maybe have been persuaded by being told fake suicide stats and such by supposed respectful organizations that she had been directed to by the NHS. Also I was..kind of manipulative as a young teen. If I heard about puberty blockers, I would possibly have pretended I was actually suicidal over my sex to get my own way. As I already self-harmed (which was NOT a manipulative thing) to say I was suicidal due to their refusal to put me on blockers wouldn't have been too much of a stretch.

And how far would you have taken it? Do you think after socially transitioning, you might have considered puberty blockers?

I wouldn't have needed any 'social transition' tbh. I was 'a boy' in pretty much every sense of the word (ignoring biologically ). Only extra thing I could have done is demand different pronouns and made my name 'boyish' or neutral. Which I would definitely have done if it meant I could skip periods and get rid of my increasingly womanly body. I would definitely have gone on puberty blockers.