WHBU ? (Wheelchair vs. Buggy)

[DisabilityIsALifestyleChoice]

(NC'd but old hand here)

DH tends to chat in various discussion groups, and yesterday, in a discussion about roads told someone to fuck off.

Here's the conversation which started around using buses and how everyone should do it to relieve road congestion,

DH:
And wheelchair users can wait all day, and still not get a bus if there are people refusing to move their baby buggies.

POSTER:
What are parents to do if they have a child in a buggy, some shopping
underneath, so it cannot be folded and cannot relinquish their position and get a later bus, because they have to be at school for a particular time to pick up their 5 year-old child?

DH:
That's choice, compared to the necessity to use a wheelchair.

POSTER:
It's not choice if you have to do the shopping so as to have an evening meal, have a young child that you have to bring with you and need to pick up the other child from school. The wheelchair user may well have much more choice, as many can walk short distances and chairs
can fold. In some cases, their journey may be purely frivolous, unlike the example parent.

It was at this point DH suggested the poster "Go f* themselves".

I should add that obviously DH is sensitive to wheelchair users (which is what I am) and tries to be polite where he can (as befits his age, and maturity). But he's fretting now whether he was too abrupt .

I wonder what the vipers of AIBU think ? (For the record, I am 100% on his side, here ...)

I can't even sit my twins safely on the sofa, there's no way on earth I could wrangle them both on a bus seat. I do wonder what sort of compliant one year olds other people have. Hoping that there's two random people who will happily hold wriggling kicking one year olds while I wrestle with a double buggy isn't really a reliable plan.

If I had one baby, I'd have no issue folding their buggy, or would just use a carrier if I were psycu

Freudian I spent a year virtually housebound when I had my son, because on the few occasions when I was able to get out of the flat, I wasn't able to go anywhere as I was still on an old Routemaster route and could not take the bus as it would have been impossible for me, and dangerous for my son if I'd even attempted it.

(I eventually moved to a flat with a lift, and a nearby tube station also with a lift, and my life was transformed, totally transformed.)

I'm not laughing at disabled people having to campaign for their rights, because I've been there and done that. I'm laughing at the idea of you with your attitude towards disabled parents being part of something called "Transport For All".

Sorry - page crashed

...if I were physically able. When they're bigger and able to stand safely and sit in a seat I'll have no problem doing that either. Right now it's just not possible and I worry every time we have to get the bus. the times where he's deteriorated quickly and I'm rushing him in to hospital have been so distressing, I'm trying to keep an eye on them both and monitor his sugars on the way - it's a bloody nightmare.

Milk the driver was completely right to prioritise the wheelchair user.

Really? All disabled people?
I've only ever seen people being polite about this
Me too.
I was extremely grateful once to a wheelchair user who insisted that I re-board the bus after he went in as he knew my buggy would fit next to him. He was right
On the other hand, I was shocked by the bus driver who closed the doors and drove away when a wheelchair user was arriving at the bus stop , cue me getting up with my buggy ready to unboard, the driver looked back and said "no it's fine" and drove off.

A hypothetical I have wondered about for a while - as I described earlier buses in my area have one space designated for wheelchairs and one for buggies. If the wheelchair space is occupied by someone in a wheelchair and the buggy space by someone in a buggy, and a second wheelchair user wants to get on the bus, what should happen? Is the buggy owner reasonable to stay put?

@MadMags I understand that the wheelchair space is for them.. but that isn’t even where I was planning on sitting..

The buses we have here have the wheelchair seat on one side, and then similar to the picture I’ve included.. but it’s just one of the flip down seats.

On my way into town that day, I had put my buggy in the drop down seat section. As there was already two buggies in the wheelchair bit.

It's funny because the only interaction I've had in this thread with you is you challenging disabled parents' rights to get on a bus with a buggy, when you are part of something called "Transport For All". (It wasn't in the slightest bit funny when I was living it, I'll agree. That was one of the worst, most lonely, most painful times of my entire life.)

I find that many (even the new buses) are just badly designed. There are new buses on a route near me which:

• reduced the number of priority seats from 8 to 6 (and there is less seating on the downstairs, but more useless bulky plastic to make up for it)
• put metal poles across the top of the seats at head height so you can crack your head open if the bus stops suddenly
• reduced the legroom so you will struggle to sit down where seats are available
• reduced the size of the wheelchair area so that less people can use it (and you can no longer put a wheelchair and buggy there)

But the bus is an electric hybrid so that's progress right?

And you may be right in some buses! And I think you are totally wrong in others. Do your homework, don't assume you are the only source of knowledge on this.

I'm disabled. I'm a parent. I'm not entitled to use the wheelchair space.
As for the person with twins. I managed twins and a 19 month old. People help if you ask them.

YouAndMeAreGoingToFallOut I think so yes. But also anyone sitting in that space would be 'entitled' to remain there if a buggy came on board, as it is only a courtesy buggy place, not a legal buggy place. Though that would be rude and not reasonable!

Perhaps I should have said "do your OWN homework" then, Freudian, rather than demanding information from people you are being unpleasant towards. Google is your friend, and I am not your fucking secretary.

If someone gives up a seat for you regardless of which category you fall into it's polite to say thanks
Why are you still in the wheelchair space when a wheelchair user is trying to occupy it? If the person using the chair has got on the bus and manoeuvred into the space, not knowing who or even if anyone has moved, do you expect them to shout out to the whole bus?
You're being completely and utterly ridiculous.

Gilead. I'm referring to london buses. Where I live. You would have to exit the bus at the back where the wheelchair user would enter again they enter the bus at the back so you pass eachother. To just go on straight pass is majorly rude. I'm entitled to my opinion.

@FreudianSlurp You should test out the new buses on the 413 route (London). It's brilliant on the amount of wheelchair space.

The downsides are that:

• there are only 6 priority seats (4 of them are rear facing)
• the seats after the wheelchair space all have a huge step up to them (at least double the height of a normal step on a flight of stairs) from the walk way, so make sure that you don't fall sideways off your seat
• the drivers drive like maniacs acceleration and deceleration are very sudden and sharp so its quite hard to stay upright if just holding onto the pole with one hand

My "reticence" is that I have used so many different bus companies, i would not know where to start.

Your entire interaction with me is to tell me that I am wrong for wanting disabled access for all disabled people, and telling me that where I have seen it, it must be some kind of mirage, and if I cannot immediately supply names and serial numbers then it cannot exist. (It's gone 8 pm and I have a pan on the stove.)

I just don't understand your kind of activist - whenever I've campaigned for access, I've campaigned for it for everyone, whatever their disability, and not wanted to have some sort of heirarchy. Accessibility is accessibility, and I think it's seriously odd (and horrible) that you seem to be going the division route.

To just go on straight pass is majorly rude. I'm entitled to my opinion.
No it's not, and your opinion is very entitled. People do not have to thank you for that to which they are entitled and to which said entitlement is enshrined in law. You have many more seats that you can access. Some of spent half of the seventies trying to get those spaces. We worked damn hard and I'm not grovelling my thanks to you or anyone else, forty years down the bloody line.

(us)