To go against DH and labour how I want?

[ListenToYourself]

DH is dead against me having a home birth and shuts the topic down very quickly.

He doesn’t want me to have one and thinks it’s just too dangerous as the hospital is 30 minute drive away anyway.

It’s what I really want. I would feel so much better labouring in my own home, preferably in a pool, which MW has said I’m guaranteed to have access to, unlike the birthing centre where they may not be one available.

DH isn’t keen on the birthing in water idea either, even in a hospital. And says “but if you really must”.

I can’t really afford to rent one out on the off chance the birthing centre don’t have one available.

I’m willing to go into hospital at the first sign of trouble, no issues there at all. At least I got what I wanted - to try a home birth.

But it’s not practical, apparently. And he says even though I am the one in labour, how he feels counts too, since he’s my birthing partner and I don’t want anyone else there.

I agree how he feels does count too, but he won’t even listen to my MW who agrees that it is safe and it isn’t a big risk.

He just feels too anxious about it.

Where do I go from here, since he just won’t listen?

I would feel just so much more relaxed knowing I can try a home birth. I would love to

I haven’t RTFT but you are potentially BU.

I had no inkling that my baby would need immediate complex care. You just cannot know that.

Whilst I understand that you want to make the experience as pleasant as possible for yourself, I would put the baby first in this case and go to hospital. If you lived closer or this wasn’t your first, I could see your point.

Believe me, many many things can go badly wrong during birth and if I have the option of being right next to the best possible care - then I’m gonna be there

jeanvaljeans post is sensible. I would add though that you need to think of your own situation as compared to the average, which may tell you in more fine detail where you might stand on risk (although nothing is guaranteed).

In my case I was closer to a major hospital than average, was afraid of hospitals (situation can affect labour), and was seen by a team of very experienced home birth midwives (as opposed to ones that do a home birth rarely).

But it sounds as though you’ve decided OP. Best of luck!

No - I know - but I felt like DH was shutting down discussion too because I was just trying to discuss the actual issue with him, and he wasn't willing to engage in any movement on that position/topic. I couldn't understand it because he doesn't usually shut down discussion and that's the sense I get from the OP too. I don't think her DH is a controlling arse, I think he's concerned and sees it as non negotiable. Yeah by all means show him the post too.

When people think something is as important as this they often don't want to discuss from a position of "let's find a compromise in the middle" because they feel so strongly that their decision is the only right one. If somebody wanted to drive your child without a car seat, you'd be unwilling to enter into discussions like "What if we just drive slowly and carefully?" "What if we hold her hand?" "What if we let her sit on a cushion?" because it's absolutely non negotiable. But if you get into a conversation about why you think car seats are necessary vs why they don't want to use one, you might find the real issue and be able to resolve it another way.

If your MW is happy for you to home birth, I would go for it.

I had a hospital birth first time round. Absolutely necessary for me to be there because of foetal problems, but it was a horrible experience. Lots of interventions and near misses.

2nd pregnancy was much smoother and MW readily agreed to a HB. She told me they wouldn't have signed off on it if there had been any doubt. It was lovely (fecking hurt, but still).

I'm pregnant (with my first), I am a paramedic and I live approx. 10 minutes from the hospital. I will NOT be having a home birth.

There are NO ambulances on standby for home births. There simply aren't enough available and even if there were there is no deployment policy for this.

I have worked shifts where there have been no vehicles available to attend a possible major incident, all vehicles where tied up either on scene with patients or stuck outside A&E . I have driven 40 miles across country to the highest priority calls. Unfortunately this is the reality in the ambulance service at the moment, and sadly it doesn't look like getting better any time soon.

Whilst ambulance delays shouldn't have to be a factor you consider when planning your birth I personally think it would be silly not to.

I'm hoping for a birth in the midwifery led unit (attached to a full labour ward/ theaters etc) seems to me to be the best of both worlds and a safe compromise.

I find it interesting that all the HCPs on here are recommending or opting for hospital births.

Food for thought OP?

I had a homebirth for my first last September. Do you have a homebirth team? Ours did information sessions where they give you a low down of how it all works and what they can do in the event of an emergency etc and you can ask questions. I was set on a homebirth and this session persuaded my husband who was worried about if something went wrong. I hired a birthing pool and set it up (obviously empty) at 36 weeks so it was ready to go then we just filled it as I went into established labour. Any questions you’re welcome to pm me. I agree your partners option matters but ultimately you’re the one who has to put in the hard work and if you feel more comfortable at home go for it. I loved it, and because I was so relaxed I didn’t even need gas and air, I had no pain relief at all and it all went brilliantly.

...I know HCP's who've gone for hospital births because they work in a hospital and are comfortable in that environment (their words!)

I also know midwives who have given birth at home.

Being where you feel safest and most comfortable at that time (this can change) seems to be really important.

Do what's right for you. My first labour developed complications and I ended up with an emergency c section.
My second was a planned c section but my DD needed a lot of medical intervention straight after birth.
Both of my children might not be here now if I hadn't given birth in hospital. However I have at least 5 friends who have had successful home births (admittedly not their first ones though)

Well, in a strict sense it’s neither your birth nor your husband’s birth: it’s your baby’s birth. Unfortunately we can’t ask the unborn baby what it would prefer. But a rational unborn baby would pick the hospital.

In 2014, the Royal College of Obstetricians did a study that showed that the day in which you are born is an extremely dangerous day: ‘The risk of dying on the day of birth (0.43 per 1000, or 430 micromorts) exceeds that of any other average day of life until the 92nd year.’

If you had a five year old and knew that, for some reason, the day they turned six was statistically the most dangerous day in their whole childhood, where would you spend the day? I would probably be lurking around outside A&E, or at least the hospital car park!

Have your baby in hospital. The possibility of remorse if something goes wrong at home isn’t worth it (because you will always worry that you didn’t do everything you could to make the birth as safe as possible for your baby).

My DH is a medical professional (not for humans though). He convinced me to go for the MLU attached to the hospital rather than our local MLU because he has seen so many of the complications possible for births. To be fair he would only be called to births where stuff is going wrong so slight bias compared with human HCPs where most births are attended...

As it turned out I had a fast 1st stage (under 2 hours) then got stuck pushing for 2.5 hours before ventouse got DD out easily.

She'd had some slight hr drops, meconium in the waters and had the cord wrapped round a foot - so I was transferred across the hospital from the MLU when the waters went - would not have enjoyed bumpy ambulance ride at that point!

We have a different dilemma if we manage another - potential not to make it if 2nds are faster - but neither of us is keen on a home birth - however DH would be much better equipped to deliver a baby than most DPs - provided he wasn't working!

Your body, your birth.

I only read that far.

100% wrong.

It is not the mother's birth it is the baby's birth.

I think you need to have a proper conversation with your husband and work out the reasons you wasn’t a home birth (because I want water birth doesn’t sound like a good reason to me as you’re not considering other factors of a home birth such as the dangers, the fact you’re 30 mins by ambulance away but your ambulance really isn’t going to rock up like an Uber I’m afraid
Your husband is probably worried about your abs your baby’s health risks which outweigh that if a water birth (perhaps he’s not keen at all because that way you may change your mind)

If you’re prepared to talk openly and make decisions together then make a firm choice

Do remember though that you’ll be a good 45-60 mins away from potentially life or death decisions if anything dies go wrong and of all the people I know who have had babies a hell of a lot wasn’t plain sailing, particularly with your first baby

Don’t listen to fizz either you’ll end up with no husband if you do ... very unhelpful comments!

PS OP, very glad now to have seen your update. Even if it isn’t as good in the hospital as it would have been at home, you’ll know that you sacrificed some part of your own comfort and happiness (maybe unnecessarily) to minimise the risk for your child. And that’s what motherhood is all about, isn’t it?

In reality I suspect that a birth which would make for a smooth and easy home birth would be a pretty good one in hospital too (but I say this as someone who has had two difficult births, with major haemorrhaging, so no expert!).

Another medical professional wading in (sorry)
There is not a chance in hell I’d have a home birth even if I lived 5 mins down the road. I’ve seen it all go wrong too.

Several comments along the lines of "it's not about you, it's about the baby" and "it's not your birth, it's the baby's birth".

F* that. It's as much about the mother as it is about the baby. She is important too. She is at risk too. Of course the baby's health and safety are crucial. But that doesn't mean the mother's wellbeing isn't important at all. The whole philosophy behind a home birth is the idea that the mother is more relaxed and has a better chance of a straightforward birth without complications for herself or her baby. Obviously plenty of people have pointed out that there is a risk of complications.

But I wish people would stop implying that a woman considering a home birth cares more about herself than her baby. That is not the case and it's frankly insulting.

In reality I suspect that a birth which would make for a smooth and easy home birth would be a pretty good one in hospital too (but I say this as someone who has had two difficult births, with major haemorrhaging, so no expert!)

Or a home birth leads to a smoother birth in some cases?

I'm a midwife and I'd seriously consider having a home birth with my first. I've known midwives AND obstetric registrars have home births. So it's simply not true that all medical professionals are anti home birth.

It's a difficult one when you live so far away. As a first time mum you're likely to be sent home once, if not twice before you're admitted. Unfortunately, I have heard stories of people being sent home and then giving birth in the car. In that scenario, I'd argue being at home is much, much safer and travelling backwards and forwards in early labour a long distance isn't fun.

And yes, there are lots of horror stories out there. But they are the minority. Most home births transfer in because of slow progress not because of some scary emergency. And there risks to giving birth in hospital - more likely to have higher intervention etc. There is an element of risk in all choices relating to childbirth.

I can understand your partner's anxiety regarding the distance. But I'm afraid I have very little patience for men who put forward strong opinions on pain relief and I have been blunt with them in the past that it's not their choice. What on earth has he got against something as innocuous as water? Very bizarre. Hopefully when it actually comes down to it he won't care but that is just bonkers. I've had men be very anti pethidine, epidurals, instrumentals but never against water.

He needs to understand that pain relief is your choice and his role as your birth partner is to support you.

I was very keen to have a water birth. For my first, I hired a water pool and took it into hospital with me. However, I never got to use it (no medical reason but things were a bit quicker than they expected, my husband was sent home and by the time they took me seriously I was 8cm dilated and in no state to start assembling it).

Second time round, I decided to have a water birth at home. This was suggested by the midwife when I was asked how I could maximise my chances of having a water birth (we had moved house and the nearest hospital had a water pool which could be used for pain relief but not for delivering the baby, and they wouldn’t let you take in a pool). Also, there was only one pool, so obviously it was first come first served). Like the OP, we live 30 minutes away from the nearest hospital.

I was judged to be low risk and had to agree in advance if the midwife had any doubts I would go into hospital. I also had to accept that there would be no pain relief except gas and air (though I could have ordered pethidine in advance if I had wanted that). I was lucky in that everything went according to plan and it was a much more pleasant experience than the first.

To be honest, I’m not sure I’d have had a home-birth for my first child (and it didn’t even occur to me) but I was very glad I had one for my second.

Good luck, OP, whatever you decide.

Or a home birth leads to a smoother birth in some cases?

Yes, exactly my point. I’m sure that a birth that is basically going to go fine (a vaginal birth with no major complications for mother or baby) might well go better at home. It’s still going to be painful, the outcome is still going to be miraculous — but maybe there’s a real improvement in the quality of the experience. The problem is that the moderate experiential upside in SOME (or even most) cases is offset, in my opinion, by the disastrous downside possible in a smaller number of other cases.

i.e. I can’t imagine that a very good birth is so much better than a moderately good one (would have been thrilled with either, personally) that I would want to risk a medical emergency at home. In my first pregnancy everything went perfectly until it didn’t, so there was no warning. And second time round, I found hemorrhaging on an operating table while being transfused with with cross-matched blood to be stressful enough; even if they had got it under control during or after a hospital transfer, I wouldn’t want to be dealing with the traumatic mental aspects of it now. (In neither pregnancy was there any risk to the baby because they went pretty quickly to a section in the first labour, and the second was an ELCS.)

But** this is just the opinion of someone who is naturally risk averse...

My point is more that in some cases a home birth avoids the bad things happening in the first place that become a medical problem - interventions leading to other problems etc. It’s not just about a nicer experience for the mother.

I’m not saying this is always the case - some things would go wrong whatever. But the fact that serious bad outcomes are not that different in absolute terms for first births and no worse for subsequent ones means that something is going on.

I'm glad you've decided to go to hospital OP

I do agree with @ZaphodBeeblerox though that you seem very mistrustful of the hospital environment - I'm sure there's a reason you've not mentioned but you maybe need to unpick that before your birth.

I left after about four hours when DS3 was born, but it was quick, easy birth, he latched on immediately, my milk came in immediately, and I basically knew what to do. My first birth, twins at 36 weeks with a retained placenta and PP haemorrhage, I was discharged after three days and it was too early. Really because my milk hadn't come in, I couldn't feed my babies, and it was very stressful trying to work that out on my own while in pain and also weak as fuck from the blood loss. No one wants to spend time in hospital, but I don't think it's a bad thing to stay in for a few days after.

Having said that, I'm sure your birth will go fine and you'll be bringing a lovely little baby home in no time!

I can understand his fear of the home birth as it is a scary unknown thing and he's understandably worried about you. However it still isn't to to him and he should know that. Just the worry itself is understandable.
Not wanting you to have a water birth though is just weird and controlling! Why?

*But the fact that serious bad outcomes are not that different in absolute terms for first births and no worse for subsequent ones means that something is going on.

I'm in a cantankerous mood tonight and I don't want to start a fight but "something is going on". Are we in Daily Mail/ other tabloid territory?

I am medical. I have seen the worst possible outcomes of birth gone wrong.

If people are genuinely 100% okay with accepting that if things do go wrong (and they might not) that they chose an option where all
medical help (bar a midwife who on their own can't manage a shoulder dystocia not responding to the first steps/a catastrophic PPH/ placenta praevia/cord prolapse/ airway obstruction in the neonate etc) is absent then that is their choice.

To imply that "being comfortable at home" is more important than considering every possible adverse outcome while ensuring that the resources to deal with those outcomes are in place is in my opinion naive.

But hey, we are all entitled to our opinion? If anyone is unfortunate to be part of the minority where regret is an adverse outcome then you can bet they don't consider their experience to be insignificant.

I say that as someone who quotes papers/justifies many of my decisions with evidence base but I'm sick of poorly executed studies being used to justify the most dangerous part of a child's life being reduced to a fulfilling maternal experience.

Rant over!

Awaits eviction from mumsnet....

I used to do medical stuff too so don’t try to use that as a trump card. Ot doesn’t mean you have an exclusive ability to consider evidence and risk when making a decision. I hate it when people use the Daily Mail reference. So faux sophisticated.

Anyway, you might see earlier that I looked at the study and used that as a starting point based on individual situations and said that in OPs situation that I wouldn’t do it.

How do you explain little/no difference in outcome for second births despite all the medical help being around? And you seem quite disregarding of the better outcomes for women that result from second births.

I repeat it’s not just about a fulfilling experience. In return for your snotty post, I am sick of medical people who don’t listen.

I hope you don’t blame any second birthing mothers who get a hopsoital related infection etc (hint I don’t but the logic of your post might infer that you might).