To not understand why people don't understand men cannot be raped by a woman?

[TurquoiseChevrotain]

I've read a lot whenever this comes up on here or elsewhere, that it's 'terrible' and such an outdated view. Why is it? Why can't people understand what rape is? Men can be sexually assaulted by women, but not raped.

Stealthing can also be classed as rape as it transforms a consensual act into a non-consensual one.

All these scenarios which try to argue otherwise seem so tortuous - a whole group of women holding down a man, a teacher who gets pregnant after somehow forcing a twelve year old to ejaculate...

Well, no. A much more likely scenario is a woman penetrated by a beer bottle. I wish this was rarer than it is.

Why? Is it worse for a woman to be penetrated with a penis than with anything else?

Well obviously whatever happens its traumatic for the victim. No matter what sex they are or what was used or anything. I expect it is 'worse' for a woman to be raped by someone with a penis though as there is the added complications of possible pregnancy.

Yes, I accept that. It's the 'women can rape men' scenarios that always seem to require a huge amount of contingency and extra support from other women which I find a bit ludicrous.

Why? Is it worse for a woman to be penetrated with a penis than with anything else

Pregnancy and STD's (including ones that can kill you) make it worse.

overnightangel

Have you read the thread? That's what's under discussion. The fact that in UK law a penis is required for the crime of rape.

Man is asleep , has an erection. Woman takes of advantage of this whilst he is on his back? Is that not rape? Just because a man has an erection it doesn't mean he is consenting to sex

Emma Watson would be all bloody over this - 'I stand with the raped people, who on this occasion were women but can equally be men in many situations'.

No, overnight it doesn't - so she would have sexually assaulted him, wouldn't she?

I'm not sure it's useful to get into discussion about whether it's worse being raped with a broken bottle, or risk a dangerous STI or pregnancy.

I don't think you can grade these things on seriousness, because of all the different variables on a case by case basis.

And, of course, it does throw up the question of a legal woman with a penis. If a legal woman, but biological man, with a penis, raped another woman. Would that be classified as sexual assault. What if the woman got pregnant?

@Datun that's rape. A penis was used.

"Man is asleep , has an erection. Woman takes of advantage of this whilst he is on his back? Is that not rape? Just because a man has an erection it doesn't mean he is consenting to sex"

No. sexual assault but not rape. Because she did not penetrate him.

The legal definition is important because (you'll see it all over the Internet) when someone who experienced anything other than unwanted penetration by a penis describes their experience as "rape" you'll get a bunch of knuckle-dragging pedants chipping in with "No, actually, you weren't raped, because..."

OP, you may think "I don't care what victims would prefer to use. I never said that was an issue." but plenty of others do use the legal definitions to police the terminology victims are "allowed" to use.

If you had "rape" = "offence involving penetration" and "sexual assault" = "any offence not involving penetration" then that wouldn't happen.

For those who think a penis is important (although as pointed out above, it's possible to get pregnant or catch an STD through penetration with an object, and plenty of rape victims can't get pregnant, so not sure there's something magical about penises) then you could have offences of "rape involving penetration by penis" and "rape involving penetration by something else".

If he raped her with his penis, I would hope so! And then we do start getting the 'women can rape too because for example some women have female penises' nonsense, don't we.

@SeekEveryEveryKnownHidingPlace no one is saying that men can't be raped.

People seem extremely invested in insisting that women can be rapists. I wonder why that is?

OvernightAngel

No it is not rape. As people have repeatedly explained on this thread. There is very good reason for the specific legal definition of rape.

Are you thick?

So if a woman lowers herself onto an erect penis without the man's consent it's not rape? Are you for real?

The reason feminists bring this up is because there is always some idiot popping up with "women rape people too!" on threads about rapists. It is quite nice to be able to stop the derail with "actually they don't because rape requires a penis".
It is incredibly irritating and happens on every single thread about male rapists.
Like a lot of seemingly rude/nasty/pedantic behaviour by feminists, there is a reason for it that you will become familiar with if you hang around on the feminist board for a while.
No-one thinks sexual assaults by women are less serious, but they are much rarer. 98% of sex crimes are committed by men. And I heard the other day that sex crimes now make up 20% of all cases

@overnightangel yes overnight, because that isn't what rape is. It's literally like saying someone was kicked, when really they were punched. They're different things. Why don't you get that?

So if a woman lowers herself onto an erect penis without the man's consent it's not rape? Are you for real?

It's SEXUAL ASSAULT! I don't understand what part of this you don't understand! (Well, the penis part, obviously, but why is this so difficult for you?)

Turquoise I know, I expressed that badly - of course men can rape men as well as women, I was more thinking of EW types suggesting that women can rape men and it cuts both ways blah blah.

So if a woman lowers herself onto an erect penis without the man's consent it's not rape? Are you for real?

It is sexual assault. But how would that happen? It sounds like the kind of bollocks defence lawyers say, that a man fell and "accidentally penetrated" a woman. I'm not sure why you are using such a strangely passive example.

TurquoiseChevrotain

Oh yes, of course!