so Brexiteers, are you happy to be paying £10 BILLION a YEAR to the EU now?

[ssd]

good grief, thought this was about saving money??

oh and the sovereignty, of course

The vote was leave the EU. I respect that even as a remainer. I have no problems with a reasonable transitional period but what I and many people and business want is some certainty so we can plan so long delay is not that gerat for anyone. We need to know where we stand.

Maybe stick this on the side of a bus...

In the general election people voted for many things and voted for MPs and a party. It is ridiculous to conflate the voting outcome with the voting in the referendum.

What kind of certainty are you looking for Cardinal? Considering they are at rhw beginning stages of negotiations, what do you want them to give you certainty of?
Businesses deal with risks and uncertainty all the time. Certainty is a part of business life. What the government can give is clarity about the direction of travel and what it is working to achieve.

We need to support this country. We need to help the government succeed in getting the best for the people of the UK. Let's get behind the people negotiating. Surely, leave or remain, we all want this country to progress and be strong.

Yy another, couldn't agree more. Read tonight a whistle blower who wouldn't sign off dodgy eu accounts said they want to punish us.

I feel some People want us to fail because they want to say I told you so.

But op for me it was never about saving money but about political transparency. Some people feel Westminster is a den of inuiquity but that somehow the eu lot operate on a holier than thou level immune to corruption. I don't believe that I don't want another layer of dodgy government... I want our layer and as much political transparency as we can have.

Considering that major projects often take 7-10 years to come to fruition, the sort of certainty we could be looking for, is what does the Government want to see in seven years time? E.g. do we need to be obtaining land to build new customs sheds to prepare for new tariffs? This is just a starter before we start cutting the turf. How long will it take to get the IT infrastructure in place? Sometimes things can be speeded up by throwing more people and money at them (not always). Do we have the people and money? What sort of sums are we looking at? What sort of training will be required?

What plans have they to tackle the question of the NI border? We have heard a lot about what they don't want, but not much detail of what they do want.

I agree periguna, large huge changes need forward planning and resources..... Infrastructure needs to be in place first.... Cart, horse, Blair, =brexit

The electorate of this country voted for a referendum on membership of the EU. In the referendum voters decided to leave the EU. Our parliament of both the HofC and the HofL decided to enact A50. Our countries population reelected a government that has agreed to leave the EU. Then our parliament voted to end of the European Communities Act.

Its happening people, deal with it.

Large projects need scenario planning and accounting for risks and uncertainty.

Uncertainty is a given when dealing with such long time periods. What you are asking of the government is unreasonable because that is part of the negotiations and depend on the other parties. The government has said it wants a good trading relationship and does not expect to be punished with high tariffs. The government thinks it is not in the interest of the EU to levy high tariffs because we import more from them than they do us. So, I would argue that you have a fait understanding of what the government wants to achieve. It cannot give anymore certainty than that until an actual agreement has been reached.

I do feel that some people want this country to fail and that breaks my heart.

Well said Anotheroneofthese

Goodness, another, for all your talk of democracy, you have a very supine and non-critical, non-informed stance vis a vis government. I'd expect to hear an empty-headed, Putin supporter to talk like that but not someone genuinely vividly concerned with democracy and politics in the UK.

You keep talking about long term plans. Well, all the leaks that are emerging from the DExEU suggest that is exactly what is lacking. And Teresa May's most recent speech boiled down to a tacit, between-the-lines admission that A50 was triggered too soon, not leaving the UK enough time to make those oh-so-secret long term plans.

Amazingly, we don't have a deeply entrenched history of crypto-government in the UK. This is a rather worrying development. And one I, personally, do not like.

So bollocks to the advice to close our eyes, go to sleep like good little children, and sit by passively whilst a whole load of disaster capitalists slip in on the coat tails of an undefined mandate and commit larceny with the the UK's assets and democracy.

I do feel that some people want this country to fail and that breaks my heart

Do you mean people in this country?

Who?

Oh man now I'm doubting myself

Should that be whom?

Nah its who isnt it

Wow, a new tactic. Another and his many yesbots.

Shame he really shows himself as a bot by repeating lies.

I do feel that some people want this country to fail and that breaks my heart

I know who. The wreckers who are delighted that we are set to lose - at the very least, a significant chunk of - the finance and service sector, which accounts for 80% of the GDP. Bye bye NHS.

The people who can afford to fund shady institutes that exert way to much influence on the government arguing for a 'hard' Brexit that will profit only disaster capitalists.

It rather upsets me, too.

(Please note use of understatement there rather than florid, OTT, empty platitudes.)

SunSeptember I hate to be rude but I can't understand your posts.

This thread is clearly one for those who want to shout and scream about a democratic decision. That is why those with an alternative view keep silent and let people like some on this thread rant and rage.

The country voted to leave. It's time to move on. Rehashing the doom and gloom of exiting is getting tiring. Yes, I voted to remain and even I am sick and tired of the never ending complaining and undermining of some who voted remain.

It is time to move on - and discuss what happens now. and be involved in what happens now.

There are several options to be pursued. Pressure needs to be applied for the least damaging option - and that includes ensuring that people are engaged enough to hold the government accountable and transparent . That is what "control" means, surely.

I have no time at all for those who think "control" means behaving like a child, counselling others to surrender their conscience, intellect and responsibility as political citizens within a democracy and refuse to engage in a debate as to what we do now.

Abdication of responsibility is not "patriotic" or "taking back control" . it is the exact opposite.

You cannot define for others what it means to engage in the debate or take responsibility. The biggest show of responsibility was exercising their vote. They did it in droves. People who had never voted begore showed quite clearly that they were not abdication responsibility and spoke in the way that matter.

Some people who voted remain think the only way of engaging and holding the government responsible is through endless shouting, ranting and raging. They want a never ending pre-referendum debate.

The most effective way to engage and to show responsibility is by casting a vote. A vote speaks far more convincingly that trying to out do each other through claims and counter claims, etc.

The people engaged and spoke when it mattered. It is time to move on. The Parliament spoke and carried out the will of the people.

What more engaging do you want? Engaging as defined by those who voted remain? Is it only the views and behaviours of those who voted remain that matter?

One thing that is clear over the past 2 years, we have shouted down alternative political views so much that they have turned into the silent majority. Rather than vain arguing, they choose to speak with their votes.

Clearly, most people want to leave. That is the fact.

I wonder how the management of the car factories are getting on with the idea that The government has said it wants a good trading relationship and does not expect to be punished with high tariffs.

They run Just In Time systems, which means that they stock very few parts but bring them in as required. So, what does the 'good trading relationship' translate to for them? What tariffs, might they have to expect, in order to work out costings and work out how much stock to have in the warehouse? Here I would expect them to plan for both a best case and worst case scenario. So do they put land aside to build a new parts warehouses, or do they attempt to source parts locally, which would enable the JIT systems to still work? If so, do they encourage those firms to train staff? Decisions, decisions. I think they want some flesh on the 'good trading relationship' and an idea of the likely timescale. That's not being unpatriotic or talking the country down - that's not their job - their job is to run car factories, and these are business decisions, which I am quite sure they are already making.

May's speech the other day was primarily for a domestic audience, but not one for business people.

Of course, it's OK for us members of the public to not worry our little heads about it and trust the Government.......

Pressure needs to be applied for the least damaging option

The problem is that remoaners remainers want to apply pressure to stop us leaving the EU, they have no interest in the least damaging option.

I love the fact that a lot of the posters telling me what it the UK public should do, don't actually write as though they have spent any time in the UK. Oh, whose interest is it in to shut up and stop worrying our little heads about Brexit?

You do realise, don't you, that every time you post, in your not quite correct English, a Leaver thinks: "Hold on a minute, why are these people pretending to be UK voters, and saying Brexit is fab?"

Your English is good, very good. But it's not native, in fact, it's not even "I've been living in the UK, shagging a UK resident" good.*

I do wonder if, with every post, another Brexit unicorn dies.

*I was once told by a German teacher that the best way to learn a language was to have a vested interest, of the romantic kind, to fire the learning.

Thecatfromjapan - and I love the fact that there are a lot of people currently living in the rEU posting on here telling the people in the UK how we should have voted but hey, of course it’s not in their interests at all.

You do realise, don't you, that every time you post, in your not quite correct English, a Leaver thinks.....

You do realise, don’t you, that if a Leaver had posted that then you would be all over it like a rash.