to think that "two tier" birthday parties are mean?

[haventkilledtheorchidyet]

I have never had any parties for my children where a proportion of the invitees are invited for a sleepover, and the rest go home. My view has always been that these provoke bad feelings in the ones who have to go home, somehow thinking they are "second tier" friends.

My poor DS, it seems, has been invited to one of these parties and will be coming home when others at the party are transported back for a sleepover.

Your views on this? I understand that some parents want to do exactly what their children want, maybe can't fit all children in their home for a sleepover, etc. but AIBU to expect parents to do the adult thing and treat all partygoers the same on the day, and perhaps have a sleepover at a different time?

I'm not looking forward to seeing my DS after this party :(

Yes, I do monitor all of their social media.

I just think it's very odd that you're insisting anecdotal evidence means it's happening everywhere at all times!

Madmags..these days kids take mobile phones to sleepovers, and my experience and lots of other people's experience is that this happens....so it hasn't happened to you, that's fine..we don't need to argue about it. I'm satisfied that it happens plenty round here as lots of mums talk about it in the playground. Since when is my evidence anecdotal?

Another example is say ten kids went as a team to a sporting event. After the event it was noticed kids getting into cars together. One hour later it turns out two out of the ten weren't invited to an after party as the kids at the party were madly sending Snapchat's to those not invited.

Once they all get Instagram and friendship groups change, they use it to bully each other, especially if they have been invited to stuff that other people haven't. Girls especially.

True. Happens ALL the time. The more socially ambitious a group is, the more they do this. It's generally used to signal to all their followers that "oh look, we are cooler than you". Sometimes, they use a post to signal to one specific girl in their group that they no longer like her and are excluding her. DD1 used to belong to one such vicious group. Horrible.

Sounds thoughtless and possible nasty too.
Sleepovers are a waste of time, and I discourage them.
this 'best friends' description has to stop.
Great friends, of course. But why bang on and fixate on best friends.

They even set up groups with the title name being part of each bff..so Megan and Erin becomes Merine..and the quote will be "we are the bestest friends ever..don't know what I would do without you, you are always there for me etc etc"...and your DD us thinking "thought I was her best friend"? It's worse than being dumped by text..this is public humiliation.

It is horrible to be left out, more so as a young person. My dd's school friends have had birthday parties and she has not always been invited. She takes it well - or perhaps it is for my benefit. She is a people's person so does not cling to one or two friends.

Social media really does not help. 20 years ago young people imagined their friends having fun without them, now they can see it online. I remember school 'friends' planned sleepovers and discussed the fun they had in my presence. I remember how isolated and rejected I felt. I smiled on the outside but was crying inside. Probably why I have no interest in group friendships to this day. I meet people in one's or two's only.

and your DD us thinking "thought I was her best friend"? It's worse than being dumped by text..this is public humiliation

It's only "public humiliation" if your dd let it be. So what if she is not the bff? At least she knows where she stands now, so treat the friend accordingly -- not bff, but friend nonetheless no? The whole "bff" thing is bullshit anyway. They are kids just discovering who they are. It's normal to change friends. DD1 is 17 now and has kept just one friend from elementary.

I think it sounds mean. If a child wants a couple round for a sleepover do that, if she wants a larger party do that. The 2 shouldn't be combined on the same day though. Do the sleepover another time.

I think that's awful! Ds would like a cinema trip with friends & pizza hut plus a sleepover for his upcoming birthday. The sleepover will only be for 1 friend due to age and it being the first one he's had but it'll be on a different day to the cinema trip. I'd feel really mean sending the other kids home and keeping one 'special' one to stay.

I think it depends on the social dynamics amongst the attendees, as well as the numbers involved. It would not be seen as mean or upsetting amongst my DD's friends because there are clear, established sub-groups of friends amongst the girls in her class and, as far as I am aware, there is no girl with no friend.

Over the summer, A had a party, to which she invited all 15 other girls in the class. B and C remained behind for a sleepover, and Girls D through N went home. A, B and C are a recognised group - they are 'the girls who dance'. My DD and the other girls neither expected nor wanted to be invited to the sleepover, because they are not 'the girls who dance'. They are 'second tier' friends to A, B and C, just as A, B and C are 'second tier' friends to the various friendship groups formed by girls D through N.

I am fine with DD learning that in life, there will be people you like more than others and there will be people who like others more than you. It doesn't mean that you, or they, are lesser people, you just have different interests, different personalities, etc. and as long as you treat everyone with courtesy and kindness (e.g. not inviting 13 of the 15 other girls to your party), that's just fine.

It is different for the DCs of TabbyMumz and others (including perhaps the OP) because the friendship groups seem to be changing and invitations to things like after-party sleepovers are being used to signal who is in and who is out of the friendship group. It's a pretty crass and unpleasant way of doing it, but children grow up and change and friendships do end. If this has really developed into bullying, rather than just children moving on to new friendships, then really, the DCs are better off out of that friendship anyway.

My DD will be 16 on her next birthday, so "parties" as you are describing on here are a thing of the past for her, but throughout primary school, from the age of about 7 MOST parties she went to (and threw) had some people who stayed over and some who didn't. And they all understood the dynamics. So my DD would have always friends A, B, C, and D to stay over, who were local, plus her cousin, plus one other friend who went to a different school This was every party up until she was 12 or 13.
Sometimes her parties were quite small, sometimes bigger; depending on what we did and what our budgets were at the time.

Some of her A-D friends were also in other groups, and one or more of them might be invited to sleepovers the rest weren't.

It was never an issue.

There are a LOT of threads on here about children who aren't invited to parties full stop, and lots of debate about small vs whole class parties.

But some kids being invited to sleepover and others not is a new one on me as being a bad thing.

It was completely normal round here and friends we know from other areas do the same too.

The only possible difference is that for most of those years, none of the children had phones, or if they did, none of them had snapchat or instagram accounts.

That only seems to have come in over the past 3 - 4 years, and my DD was a teen by then anyway. But I don't think a primary school aged child should have those accounts in any case.... I think you need to be 13 or 14 (or even older) to have them. (that doesn't stop parents from setting their DC up with the accounts, but I don't think they're actually supposed to have them).

I really don't see the issue. It was common growing up. All your class mates and kids you knew outside of school came for a big kids party. Then 2 or 3 of your best mates came back with you to stay over. Then no kids are left out

Did he already go to the party? How was it?

I would never do it, because I think the only time this is acceptable is when there is a very clear reason why (e.g. one kid coming from out of town), or the friendships are so clear cut that it would be expected and not hurtful (e.g. a group of 4 children that is made up of two BFF couples, and this is completely accepted, known by all, and non-problematic).

At my DCs ages I would never do it because I would not be sure I could trust them to tell me this is ok and would not hurt anybody, what I mean is, my children do tell me who is closest friends with whom, but sometimes this does not seem to be factual (there was one time when my DC1 insisted child A was not his BFF, but it was clear to me child A did consider himself my DC1's best friend, IYSWIM)

The stuff about resilience is a bit silly, we would all be hurt if we were to discover we are tier B when we thought we were tier A, these things are unproblematic, I think, only when your position comes as no surprise to you and it is not an issue or when there is another obvious reason for the exclusion (as countless threads on here from adults hurt at being excluded prove!!)

I recall a party that included getting a lift in two cars, one group went off & had more fun, one group went home. It did feel like second tier friends like you stated, but in them days you got over it.

Same as weddings. Some people only inivited for the after meal stuff.
Dont sweat it. Not a big deal.

DS and DD have gone to many parties like that and both have been the only kids to go home, while the rest had a sleepover. Didn't bother them at all, as they knew there were reasons for not being able to stay. One child told DS that he couldn't stay because he didn't really like DS, so DS just shrugged his shoulders and moved on. But not before telling the kid that he wished him all the best, then moving on to making other friends.

They've (my DC) been taught that life can throw some crap at you, but how they deal with it is the important bit. It's like this: life is full of problems, so are we going to sit and moan about them, or are we going to do something to try and solve those problems???

It's so much easier to be miserable and moan about what we have happening in our lives, rather than being happy and fully appreciating what we do have, such as family, health, life, shelter etc.

Instagram/Snapchat is a separate issue from the two-tier party issue.

My DC are younger than this - only the eldest has had or been to any sleepovers, and they're all boys which seems to make a difference. Certainly it's always been either they all stay over God bless that mother or only one does, which I think is clearer and cleaner.

Ds turns 11 soon he wants to go laser quest and have a sleepover. He's been told he can only have 4 for the sleepover so only 4 for laser quest too. Have also given him option of more at laser quest and sleepover a different weekend. Wouldn't send some home and have some stay over.

DS has been to one of these, but the sleepover was the night before the party, so non-sleepover kids were none the wiser.

I think maybe this is the way to do it, if you want to be cognisant of children's feelings.

I have never heard of anything like this for children, it's dreadful! We had parties where cousins were staying for the entire weekend (so before and after the party), but if you have guests you can't tell them to go home because you want to start the next stage with the chosen few. How ridiculous.

Fantastic parenting here: "yes precious snowflake, you invite the pleb for the afternoon to get presents, and then you select the ones who will be honoured to have a sleepover in our castle whilst the others go back home". Who the hell does that?
I could understand you keep one child because the parents are away/ busy, but inviting an entire group. It's just rude. Have a sleepover another night.

I love how people keep mentioning inviting kids just for the gift, as if a party doesn't cost anything!

a party costs as much as you want it to cost.

Instagram / Snapchat isn't separate from the two tier party issue as such, as usually what happens is tier A use it to be mean to tier B, by highlighting that they got chosen for the sleepover in the first place. I agree they shouldn't have access to these things, but as soon as they get a phone, they set up the instagram / Snapchat account. They don't need parents to do that.