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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

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Original poster

AIBU - Nursery

331 replies

sk505 · 29/08/2017 18:36

My daughter is 16months and goes to nursery twice a week.
In our religion, girls' nappies are not changed by boys and girls must be dressed with dignity. nursery are aware of this.
Today, I went to fetch her and she was running around in just a nappy. No clothes at all. This was extremely upsetting as I know male members of staff walk through and around the nursery. I'm not making any personal comments or any judgements, but it is against our religion. It transpires that her clothes were all clean. Her spare clothes were available and she has been well behaved. No one knows why she was without clothes for over an hour.
AIBU to cause a storm over this,?

OP posts:
Sirzy · 29/08/2017 20:44

At what stage with things like this, or using the example of a PP does the desires of the child override the parents wishes? If a child says "I don't want my clothes on" (unlikely at 16 months perhaps but certainly not in the near future) who do the staff respect?

At the end of the day things like religion are a personal thing so "forcing" it on a child can only go so far surely?

TimetohittheroadJack · 29/08/2017 20:48

Religion/culture aside, and given a ratio of 1:1, how can no one n the nursery know why she has no clothes on? Who took them off? It may be that the person had to wash their hands and got distracted or something, but for a whole hour?

blackteasplease · 29/08/2017 20:49

Christ, I mean something plain, not something with ridiculous side ties etc. The debate was about the amound of clothing, not the potential decoration. Kids wear trunks/ swimsuits in the pool for hygiene reasons. On the beach they can crack on and be naked if they choose and if potty trained or parents keeping a sharp eye that they dont poo, provided they are coated in factor 50.

There is a difference between the lack of clothing and decoration that is sexualising. Thongs are uncomfortable. But this is massively distracting from the point.

The nursery should have just said no to the ridiculous demands in the first place. So yes they were very unreasonable to take the OP's money.

blackteasplease · 29/08/2017 20:50

I'm out of this one now btw.

StarUtopia · 29/08/2017 20:51

just reminding you that it's 2017. Get a grip.

Indeed. Who forces their own ridiculously 'modesty' beliefs onto a baby and discriminates against men in such an open way.

If I were the nursery manager, I'd be telling you to take your business elsewhere. Poor child.

ReanimatedSGB · 29/08/2017 20:53

I don't care what specific brand of idiot superstition OP follows - I regard all religions with equal contempt and this sort of thing is one of the reasons why.
OP if you live in a family which imposes this sort of hatred on human (specifically female) bodies then you are, by definition, in an abusive relationship. Please don't raise a little girl in the house of people who will teach her to consider her own body as something shameful and disgusting.
And do bear in mind that childcare professionals can and will ignore your silly rules if they are putting your DD's physical health and wellbeing at risk - and if you continue trying to impose them, SS may become involved. It is not unheard of for SS to intervene in the case of extreme superstition which is harming DC, the freedom to follow whatever nonsense you fancy does not permit you to (eg) beat your children for transgressions, or starve them. Or insist that they are dressed in a way which is inappropriate for weather conditions and risks their health.

AnnMeredithPerkins · 29/08/2017 20:54

Aeroflotgirl

Yes I think its sad, that a baby has to be 'modest', they are a baby, and not sexual

This with bells on!!!

ShapelyBingoWing · 29/08/2017 20:57

I imagine the issue here OP is you've undermined yourself by telling nursery that these are religious views rather than cultural ones. I've worked with many religions and for the life of me I can't think of any that impose modesty on babies. Nor can I think of any religious texts that specify who is and isn't allowed to clean a baby / change a nappy.

When we dress up cultural beliefs and traditions as religion, we undermine that religion.

And as many people here have pointed out, nurseries are not legally allowed to restrict the duties of only male staff, no matter what the reason. No nursery can cater for your requests.

BackforGood · 29/08/2017 21:00

I think people are entitled to ask the religion, as this is such a strange thing to be complaining about. Unless a religion is 'recognised', then what is stopping anyone saying "You can't do X or Y 'because it is against my religion' " when they just mean 'I don't like you / what you are doing / the look of your clothes / the smell of the orange you are eating' or whatever....... anyone could object to what their colleague or neighbour does and say 'it is against my religion'.
However, is 'a Nursery with a 1:1 ration' really a thing ? I've never heard of this. If you could afford 1:1 care, then why not just have a nanny who you can dictate terms to more easily ?

DressedCrab · 29/08/2017 21:00

Poor kid.

bangingmyheadoffabrickwall · 29/08/2017 21:03

1:1 ratio at a nursery?!?!?!? Really???? I am doubting the truthfulness of your post.

In fact, I don't believe that the information you have provided is entirely true.

Doubt crept in when you refuse to answer questions about your religion especially as nobody can fathom as to what religion requires a 16 month old toddler to be 'modest'. You've denied it is Islam which understandably many people thought it was due to the requirement of modesty as an older girl and nobody know of any religion that requires this. So unless you can prove to me that there is a religion that requires a toddler to be modest .... I will say YABU.

Also a nursery with 1:1 is HIGHLY unlikely and unheard of. If you are paying for 1:1 why on Earth have you not gone down the route of a nanny or childminder?

Now if you said you for personal beliefs and reasons I would have had an ounce of sympathy for your post, but quite frankly you are very evasive in your answers and because of this, I and probably many, will not believe you and will say YABVU.

Prove me wrong by all means!

Gemini69 · 29/08/2017 21:05

I'm still baffled Confused

BluePheasant · 29/08/2017 21:07

Was she happy? If yes then what is the harm?

Why on earth do toddlers need to be modest? What utter madness. They are never happier when just running about in their nappy at that age!

Excited101 · 29/08/2017 21:09

Speaking as an Atheist, it needs to be remembered that religion is entirely subjective. One person's version of it is entirely different to someone else's so it doesn't matter if 'x's neighbour is y religion and doesn't do it the same way' and ideas vary so much.

I think it's sad that such a young child has these ideals put upon them but that is always a parent's prerogative and many religions, concepts and ideologies can be damaging to children.

For what it's worth, my Dsis works in a special school where none of the male staff are allowed to help with any of the toiletting of the children. I was horrified when I heard, I don't even think they can assist a female member.

JaneEyre70 · 29/08/2017 21:09

She's 16 months old and can't walk around wearing a nappy surrounded by other children. Some life she's having Sad. Why not just lock her indoors until she's 18 and can be found a husband to take over controlling her mind and appearance Hmm.

Out2pasture · 29/08/2017 21:11

I only have a university degree....female nappy changes followed by dressed with dignity I visualized the dressing process, kind gentle "let me help you" not the type or style of clothing....
Don't most toddlers love to strip down??

WobblyChair · 29/08/2017 21:11

YABU.

Calling these principles religious doesn't make them any less vile.

Poor child.

Poppyfields21 · 29/08/2017 21:15

OP I'm confused. I thought you moved to Cambridge in May but your daughter is at nursery in London now?

GirlInTheDirtyShirt · 29/08/2017 21:15

Op , your treatment of your baby dd is abusive, religion does not excuse that.

This, with bells on.

The very idea of "modesty" for a baby is utterly vile and has no place in a modern society. I feel sorry for your daughter, who is being brainwashed to believe her body is shameful.

Willow2017 · 29/08/2017 21:17

I think it's because nobody can recognise what religion would insist babies should be 'modest'.

It would help if she said what it was.

It wouldnt help understand why babies can't be babies and run around in 28 degrees of heat without layers of clothes on.

Plus no religion is above discriminating against nursery staff.

Miserylovescompany2 · 29/08/2017 21:18

It will be potty training time soon - should she be left soiled/wet because a female member of safe isn't available?

UnicornRainbowColours · 29/08/2017 21:22

Sounds like the Orthodox Jewish. Not that it matters! As a childcareer its respectful to respect religion and ppl on here are behaving disgustingly towards the op.

letsmargaritatime · 29/08/2017 21:23

Your post makes me glad I'm an atheist.

This

jakscrakers · 29/08/2017 21:25

As far as I am concerned you religion is your business and no one elses, but..... if you wish your child to be treated like this, then stay at home with her and raise her as you wish, If you go to a nursery, you surely cannot dicate this, that is above and beyond, and your right it is 2017 and therefore it shouldnt matter who changes the nappy but that the nappy is changed

neverhadanymarblestolose · 29/08/2017 21:26

I'm confused, if the staff knew she had no clothes on for a whole hour, and they also know that you have specifically asked for her to remain clothed. Then why did none of them put her clothes back on at any point during the hour they knew she was undressed?

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