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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

See all MNHQ comments on this thread

Original poster

AIBU - Nursery

331 replies

sk505 · 29/08/2017 18:36

My daughter is 16months and goes to nursery twice a week.
In our religion, girls' nappies are not changed by boys and girls must be dressed with dignity. nursery are aware of this.
Today, I went to fetch her and she was running around in just a nappy. No clothes at all. This was extremely upsetting as I know male members of staff walk through and around the nursery. I'm not making any personal comments or any judgements, but it is against our religion. It transpires that her clothes were all clean. Her spare clothes were available and she has been well behaved. No one knows why she was without clothes for over an hour.
AIBU to cause a storm over this,?

OP posts:
HaudYerWheeshtBawbag · 29/08/2017 20:28

I think you need to bin the "religion" Its bloody stupid!

wheresthel1ght · 29/08/2017 20:29

I am not sure why people are demanding to know the ops religion, it actually isn't relevant.

OP has given nursery a comprehensive statement of what religious convictions need to be adhered to and they have failed to comply.

OP - going off the deep end is pointless and will be counter productive. I would however be expressing, in writing, your disappointment at their flagrant disregard of this request and their lack of explanation. I would request a written response of the results of their investigation and plan to prevent further occurances of this.

Good luck!

simpaticasimpatica · 29/08/2017 20:29

OP are there only 5 of you in the religion?

Is that why you'd out yourself?

Mammyloveswine · 29/08/2017 20:29

I find it very strange that no-one knew why she was undressed! I suspect the key worker/person who left her in just her nappy wasn't around. Please update and let us know the outcome.

FWIW, I am also a nursery manager (albeit one in a school) and have had similar requests. We only have one male member of staff however I'd due to ratios he is the only one available to change the child then he parents agree to come in and change the child themselves. (The child in question is older than the OPs). I think it's just using common sense TBH, we have key workers and they do nappy changes-I would just ensure that the male was not the child's key worker to avoid conflict but appreciate that this may be difficult if there are more males than just the one.

OP just are right to query and remind the manager of your daughters requirements due to religion, do so politely but firmly and I'm sure the manager will be apologising profusely tomorrow.

Fandabidozy · 29/08/2017 20:29

As a childcare worker we would have to abide by the clothing requests you've made but we wouldn't be able to exclude any team member from changing nappies unless it posed potential harm to the child's physical or emotional well-being and even then it would be very rare (think incidences of trauma involving specific sex).

One thing I don't understand is that they were aware of this rule, no one knew why she was undressed but they were aware enough to notice that she had been for atleast an hour Confused

Nuttynoo · 29/08/2017 20:29

@blackteasplease - so no uniforms for your kids eh? You let your 5 yo's run around in skimpy bikinis do you? The problem isn't that the OP wants her children to dress in a certain way, it's that she feels a baby in a nappy has lost her dignity in some way.

Benedikte2 · 29/08/2017 20:30

I guess OP is (a) a fundamentalist Christian who dress their wee girls in long skirts and headscarves. All man made rules -- not in the the Old or New Testaments. Or
(b) Orthodox Jew. Not sure about (b) except it is equally mysogentistic and women are discouraged from driving and must cover their hair -- but elaborate wigs are permitted to do this.
Re the weather very hot in the South today and I'm sitting almost naked in front of a fan . Guess I won't qualify for Heaven

Sirzy · 29/08/2017 20:30

How is naming the religion more "outing" than talking about a 1-1 nursery which I am guessing not many of exist!

Mammyloveswine · 29/08/2017 20:30

So many typos! Apologies!

clairethewitch70 · 29/08/2017 20:30

Mormons are modest too, along with Christian Fundimentalists such as the Duggars. Does you Church have a creche or nursery? Could you get a nanny or childminder from the same religion as you?

simpaticasimpatica · 29/08/2017 20:31

wheres

It is relevant on the basis that she's asking the nursery to discriminate against it's male employees.

mowgeli · 29/08/2017 20:32

Ok so then you're not being unreasonable if you have agreed these conditions inline with your values. I respect you for answering the probing questions as honestly as possible whilst protecting your identity.
See how the manager responds tomorrow and remember you are their client. As annoying or as petty as it may seem I can compare to my feelings about cows milk being horrendous and i refuse my son the chance to eat or drink it. Nursery know, nursery agree and I would be seriously cross if he was given it since it goes against my values and it upsets his stomach.
Fair play OP you have done well with a barrage of criticism

bostonkremekrazy · 29/08/2017 20:32

Like PP Notreallyarsed I don't think a baby is any cooler in just a nappy than in a thin vest or t-shirt and short set.
In fact i hardly ever strip down to nappy.....i think baby is more comfortable being picked up and handled with clothes on rather than clammy hands against skin......

blackteasplease · 29/08/2017 20:33

Wtf can't a 5 yo wear a bikini? At that age I'd omit the top because it's not doing anything, but yes my dd wore bikini bottoms at that age on holiday. There's nothing to cover!

Uniforms don't by nature discriminate, or shouldn't. The law is that it can't be more onerous for one sex than the other, as per a work place. Imo it should change to boys and girls both free to choose trouser uniform or skirt uniform or (my preferred) a simple, comfortable trouser type uniform for all - shorts in summer.

mowgeli · 29/08/2017 20:34

It's not discrimination it's her choice.
I am not discriminating against women by having a husband am I? It's my preferences.
Same as it's my preference for my son not to have cows milk. If I am paying for a service I have the right to choose who provides it.

feeelingbad · 29/08/2017 20:34

Your post makes me glad I'm an atheist.

^ THIS

Wow, religion or not, banning males from changing nappies is wrong, it just smacks of assuming all men are going to do something inappropriate.

Babies and young children do not need to dress 'with dignity'. Just a nappy is fine, especially during warm weather or messy play.

AldiAisleOfCrap · 29/08/2017 20:36

This reply has been deleted

Message deleted by MNHQ. Here's a link to our Talk Guidelines.

diddl · 29/08/2017 20:37

If she has a key worker looking only after her then it shouldn't be too hard to find out what happened!

mowgeli · 29/08/2017 20:38

We are going off on a sexism and sexualisation tangent whilst forgetting the original question was if it was unreasonable for the OPs daughter to be dressed in her opinion and not as originally agreed.
If it was agreed then, no she isn't being unreasonable. It's easy to stick our fluid values on others but this isn't actually a sexualisation scenario as I first thought but more a disobeying of agreed behaviours. Man or woman girl or boy white or black religion or not this was not what was agreed. We have to remember that when doling out our anonymous opinions to someone who is concerned online.

minisoksmakehardwork · 29/08/2017 20:39

@sk505, as your thread has somewhat derailed, I will address your original point.

No, yanbu to be disappointed and to raise this with your nursery. Causing a storm without knowing how it happened won't help though.

You made a request and the nursery agreed to comply. Was it noted anywhere in contracts, special requests etc?

On a basic level, whether any of us agree with your beliefs or not, the nursery did agree to uphold them in your absence and have badly let you down. You do need to know how and why this happened and reassurances of the steps they will take to ensure it doesn't happen again.

However; you may have to look for alternative childcare if they can not longer uphold your request due to staffing, changes to their running etc.

Nuttynoo · 29/08/2017 20:40

@blackteasplease - All bikinis? Even thongs? side-ties?

All uniforms discriminate against girls in some way (tighter jumpers, skirts, uniforms only going up to a certain size even while boys' uniforms go up higher, shorter shorts).

PurpleMinionMummy · 29/08/2017 20:40

How can they not know when they have 1-1 care?

Ameliablue · 29/08/2017 20:40

Aside from any religious aspect. I would be concerned about a nursery that is supposed to provide 1:1 care but yet a baby can be left for an hour while people noticed her clothes were there but nobody checked why they hadn't been out on. Where was her 1:1 care during this time?

Tiptoethr0ughthetulips · 29/08/2017 20:42

I'm glad I'm agnostic, truly baffled by modesty for babies. My DC removes and refuses clothing regularly, embracing the freedom of being a toddler and to my mind that is natural.
You're creating issues and barriers where there need be none. I think perhaps it's best you remove her from the nursery and either provide the care yourself or have someone from your religion do it.

SnickersWasAHorse · 29/08/2017 20:42

it just smacks of assuming all men are going to do something inappropriate

Or that they have something more important to do.

Anyway, part of me thinks this is dreadful bollocks and how a hate religions that restrict women.
Yet another part of me thinks is this any different to a parent saying that they want their child to be vegetarian and not eat meat at nursery.

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