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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

dd is only going to use gender neutral stuff for her dd?

604 replies

ioliverielinor · 24/08/2017 17:00

hiya,

just looking for views really. is this the new modern parenting? dd2 is expecting a dd herself and has said she would only like gender neutral gifts, i was a bit upset because i think there are some lovely girls clothes, i said will she never put her in dresses, she says no. im a bit surprised really, but yet she is happy to have her hair long, etc.??

just curious if this is the norm now? i have never really heard of it before, dd1 has 3 dc different genders and never had an issue buying them boys and girls items.

im not judging, but think its slightling strange? aibu?

OP posts:
Thread gallery
6
Anatidae · 25/08/2017 20:33

So you'd be happy with men in dresses? society governs how we dress, and it wouldn't be appropriate for men and women to dress the same.

In various bits of he South Pacific, men wear skirts (big, massive, burly guys. jonah lomu size guys.)

The whole POINT of examining gender is to strip away the daft stuff that constrains us, and leave the more sensible bits. So men can't bear children. Women are in general less physically strong. But there's no reason a women can't drive a truck, be a surgeon or be an engineer because none of those things are dictated by her immutable biology. Similarly men might quite like to wear a dress, why shouldn't they?

It's about stopping, at the very start, the insidious process that goes:

Girls wear pink frilly things
Boys wear jeans and trainers
Girls sit nicely so they don't get dirty
Boys run around md climb trees
Don't play with that microscope it's not for girls
Engineering is for boys - they like engines and dirt! Girls like playing with dolls.

And ends up with women socialised to be nice. To people please. To be decorative, to be silent, to be passive, to be objects whose worth is dictated by their appearance. While the boys do civil engineering, build bridges and earn the money.

Not putting baby girls in pink sounds so trivial, but it's one of the ways the above happens. Trying to be a bit less gendered about it is one way of helping. It's about removing those social constructs where they don't serve us.

If you need a penis to do it, it's a man thing, if you need female parts to do it it's a woman thing. alnost everything else is up for everyone.

heartstornastray · 25/08/2017 20:33

A man in a dress with his big hairy legs would not be a good look. Mens legs look best covered, whereas a women's legs are usually of a nicer shape and a nice dress enhances them. I can't believe i'm having this conversation. The world has gone mad. Shock

jessebuni · 25/08/2017 20:36

If she were saying to just get gender neutral things just in case of gender errors on the scan then that's one thing but it is a bit unusual to go completely gender neutral just to avoid stereotypes. I have a boy and a girl and I treat them the same. I chose clothes I liked be they boy or girl. Admittedly the girl wore more boys clothes than the boy wore girls. Anyway he had a baby in a pushchair as a toy at one point but he also has army toys. The thing DD wanted most when she was 2 for her birthday was iron man (I'm sure many of us also want iron man for their birthday 😉) Honestly I just let my kids wear the types of clothes they like and play with the toys they like. 🤷‍♀️

Anatidae · 25/08/2017 20:36

Seriously you should go to the South Pacific. The men there are ... manly ;) big guys. In skirts.

And men in kilts. They look pretty damn hot too. Right?

It's only societal conditioning that tells you men can't wear what they want. What harm would it do? It's like my rather Victorian grandfather used to have conniptions about women in slacks 🙂

A man in a frock is still a man. A woman in jeans is a woman.

Lweji · 25/08/2017 20:37

A man in a dress with his big hairy legs would not be a good look.

I love a good shapely man's thigh, I do. Hairy or not. It's a shame male beach wear covers most thighs these days. Sad

I'd vote for men's miniskirts.

Anatidae · 25/08/2017 20:39

Kilts. kilts, people

The Scots porridge oats man!

(Goes off for a cold shower...)

Tiger44 · 25/08/2017 20:39

I haven't rtft (not all of it anyway), but dresses are a pain anyway. Babies can't crawl in them properly, toddlers and girls can't run around, climb trees etc properly in them. They trip over them in soft play too. I think dresses have their place but they do encumber girls and stop them just being children that run around in mud and do all the fun stuff.

Jedimum1 · 25/08/2017 20:39

Boys and girls are different. I didn't enforce colors or designs on my DC and they indepedently chose clothes from very early age.
Not true. You might not have actively told them to choose certain colours or styles, but society has. Unless you have kept your children at home without TV, nursery, school, friends, family, celebrity magazines, etc... They have been influenced by their background. Our influence as parents only go as far.

gingergenius · 25/08/2017 20:39

@Anatidae I think I love you. Can I copy and use that to explain to those of mine who don't understand the difference between sex and gender. Thankyou

Tiger44 · 25/08/2017 20:39

Also pink used to be the colour to dress boys in!

Turquoise0wl · 25/08/2017 20:39

@heartstornastray - I can't believe your saying the crap your saying.

heartstornastray · 25/08/2017 20:41

What an awful sight that'd be. I don't like men in shorts either, especially those long ones that show off the calf, usually with the obligatory tattoo. Ughh.

ItsNotLit · 25/08/2017 20:42

Some parents "worry" that by dressing their child in something meant for the opposite gender, they may SHOCK HORROR become GAY in later life

Really? I don't think that's true. Why do you think this? Genuinely curious.

heartstornastray · 25/08/2017 20:42

I'm entitled to my opinion turquoise

Turquoise0wl · 25/08/2017 20:43

@heartstornastray - never said you weren't, but it's still a load of crap!

Lweji · 25/08/2017 20:43

I'm entitled to my opinion turquoise

Sure. Except you presented it as fact, not "IMO".

gingergenius · 25/08/2017 20:44

@Tiger44 yes - pink was the colour of MEN in the 19th Century. All to do with the colour of their red coats they war in service (Crimea etc?) which faded to pink after washing/time, so pink became the colour of a 'real' man.

Turquoise0wl · 25/08/2017 20:45

@ItsNotLit - you really have never seen that? You know, a dad being horrified that his son wants to be a fairy for a fancy dress party? It actually quite frequently boils down to the fact they'll be seen as 'feminine' and 'gay'. You really are pretending you've never seen that?

Abbylee · 25/08/2017 20:45

@lewji yes. I was trying to say that. I'm sorry. My children wear what they want. If little girls like pink, wear it. But if my mil feels happy buying my DC gender-ish clothes, why should I hurt Her? Her gifts are gifts, not necessary items. There is a bit of selfishness in gift giving. My grandmother bought what I wanted and what she wanted me to have when I got married. I realiked she liked giving and I hugged and thanked her.
My niece told me that pink is okay after I laughed in surprise. She knows that I love her dearly and I'm not trying to make her daughter a ?.. the women in my family are mainly in STEM occupations. The one who is an accountant is a girly dressing lesbian.

Dd didn't wear ds hand me downs until teenager. This is a pretty ridiculous notion to my mind bc pink used to be the boy color 100 years ago! People can dress anyway that they want. My hairdresser wears dresses when HE is not at work.

Confidence, education and handwork is what makes most people successful, not clothes colors. maybe ds is right. It's a gimmick, but I think it's just the echo chamber media stirring up stuff as usual.

Jedimum1 · 25/08/2017 20:47

I told my MIL that my 2yo DS was really cute roleplaying with dolls at nursery, so sweet. She was "he doesn't, does he?". I was puzzled. She asked me if I was ok they let him play with baby dolls. I said that it's roleplaying and it's very normal anyway, fathers nowadays also get involved in childcare you know? Plenty of male nursery nurses too? She was all ok, ok... But I could see she didn't think it was very normal.

Anatidae · 25/08/2017 20:47

Course you, ginger

'Sure, deck your limbs in pants;
Yours are the limbs, my sweeting.
You look divine as you advance --
Have you seen yourself retreating? '

Ogden Nash.

It's only recently that women in trousers was 'ok.'

Boys used to wear pink, because pink was a dilute version of red, which was seen as manly. Girls wore blue, seen as a weaker colour and possibly also due to associations with the Virgin Mary, who is often portrayed wearing it.

If it's not constrained by your immutable biology then it's a societal thing. And unfortunately our society has historically placed men over women.

Tiger44 · 25/08/2017 20:49

@gingergenius yes that is true and then in the 1920s boy babies were put in pink because it was thought that pink was a strong colour and girls wore blue because it was a delicate, dainty colour.

Anatidae · 25/08/2017 20:50

I'm on a sewing group and the number of times people will say 'is this too boyish?' For a fabric is SO depressing. For stuff like a dark blue Hawaiian flower print. It's crap. And yes, they often say that the father worries it will 'affect' the child and make them feminine 🙄

It seems more prevalent in the USA than here..

famousfour · 25/08/2017 20:50

I find this whole debate interesting - I was not raised in a 'girly' way although I certainly had some dresses and a barbie or two. It was just never a thing. So it has not occurred to me for it to be a thing. And I will confess to having a liking for a nice dress for my daughter much as I like a nice jumper for my son. I dislike the undercurrent in some of this that 'girly stuff' is bad.

That said pink frilly stuff is not to my taste for me or my children nor are baby hair bands etc. And special 'pink' versions of things give me the rage, and I can't quite articulate why since I am not a pink avoider.