to be upset that I may not be able to afford to start a family?

[thebluedragon]

I'm 30. DH and I would like to start a family in the next couple of years. However, I have been researching costs (I'm a worrier and need to know that everything is in order before we start trying!), and I have absolutely no idea how we would be able to afford it.

We live in London which is so expensive anyway. After tax, I earn about £2k each month. DH earns roughly half that. After bills and outgoings (mortgage, maintenance, car, electricity, food) etc, we each end up with a couple of hundred to spend on ourselves. I know that we are fortunate and a lot of families manage on a lot less, but I just don't see how.

There are definitely some ways we could save money (e.g. batch cooking) and save a couple of hundred each month rather than enjoy meals out together). However, it's child care that I just do not see a way around.

I would have to return to work. DH would be happy to be a SAHD, but I don't think I would be able to pay all the bills and support three people on my salary alone. I've been researching the price of nurseries and the average in our area seems to be about £60 a day. This would be more than DH earns anyway.

We live close to our parents, but none would be able to provide daily childcare on a regular basis as they all work.

I could possibly earn a bit more by applying to promotions (if I got one), but not enough to support everyone comfortably. DH enjoys his job and even if he got a different one in the field it would pay roughly the same.

I am feeling really upset this morning. I thought we were in a great position financially and have a home etc (small 2 bed flat), but I just can't see how we could ever hope to afford childcare. I would love to hear from people in similar positions who have made it work. Sorry if I sound completely clueless! I don't want to rush into anything and, if we do manage to have a baby, I just want to be able to provide a wonderful life for him/her.

This sounds familiar. Age 30 I'd just moved back up north, renting and underemployed. Boyfriend is freelance. 7 years later I'm pregnant with first child. Here's some things:

I started a business that gives me better income security, with flexibility. In your situation I'd say boyfriend needs to get over it and do training. My boyfriend struggles to do things for him, but is motivated by 'us' and improving our lives.
I got over not being the main child care. Boyfriend (at the moment) is prob going be the mon to fri, with flexibility and relative support for his freelance gigs. I'm taking 6 months leave then heading back to work. There's a fairly strong financial imperative for this!
We got serious about our finances three years ago - we now run a joint budget and our financial picture has improved immensely.
There is no right time, but I was waiting for that 'yep' moment and it was literally like something clicked in my head. I think buying a house contributed to my feeling of security and also capability. It was possible due to relatives gifting a deposit, us sorting out our financial lives and being in the north where low income can still get you a 3 bed semi in an ok ish area.
Don't worry about being too late. The scare stats re fertility are based on data from the 17th century. The true difference is about 5% in conception rate between under 30 and over, for women in good health and not overweight. Over 40 gets more challenging.

I wonder if there would be so many posts saying the OP's DH should improve his situation if it was her earning the £12K and the DP earning the £24K. Usually, when women say they can't afford the childcare, they give up work.

But because the DP is male, he can't do that, he's got to get off his bum and find a better paid job.

NEWSFLASH: it's the 21st century and lots of women earn more than their male partners.

As for career progression, not everyone wants a "career", they just want a job to earn money.

If you move out of London you'll have the commuting costs which are very high, and nursery fees are very high wherever you are. Childminders are cheaper, but unlike the poster above, I think a nursery is better for a very small child. I worry that one person trying to look after 5 children is too stretched. I guess if you can find a childminder who only looks after your child but doesn't charge what a nanny charges it's not so bad.

If your DH is prepared to do the childcare, would he consider being a childminder and bring in a wage at the same time?

Oh and the budgeting app we used is called ynab, free trial but you have to pay for it. Used it 3 years and I've saved that fee 10 times over in improved financial life!

Start saving NOW. As much as you possibly can, every month. Whatever happens in the future, that will be something you won't regret.

Move out of London. It's what I did (despite coming from there and family being there.)
Many many people move around for work, and have done for years. If you stay in the U.K., it's never that far to visit.

I also think you need to push your dh to up his earning power because 1k take home per month is extremely low for a full time job. Or could he take on evening work to supplement his earnings?

I think you're wise to be thinking about all this because too many people plunge in to having kids without too much thought BUT having said that, you could feel there's never a right time

Our kids are grown up now, but to be frank it wasn't a whole lot easier 25 years ago. The only difference was houses were cheaper to buy, but mortgage rates were extortionate, so many people were paying proportionately much more on housing. Childcare was also expensive (no free hours at age 3 either) Also very short maternity leave so you'd pay full childcare over a much longer period (from 12 weeks to just shy of 5 years for our dc1 as she was a sept baby so didn't start school til almost 5)

I do understand how tough it is- we were both working in professional roles and still had to do evening/ weekend work for a period of time to make ends meet.

But your main priority has to be getting out of London. The London weighting can't be worth that much as neither of you are on amazing salaries so cut your losses, move somewhere cheaper; in your favour that would be practically anywhere else in the U.K.!

-I wonder if there would be so many posts saying the OP's DH should improve his situation if it was her earning the £12K and the DP earning the £24K.

If the situation were reversed and the OP was a female earning £12k wanting a baby but wanting to stay living in London, my advice would still be to try to increase her earning by retraining and to try to move out of London.

we left London as well.

The other thing to think about is whether you can tweak either of your working patterns so that you need less childcare - one doing compressed hours to earn a day off, weekend working, being able to do however small a proportion of your work from home. We've done all of these at different times and it really reduces your childcare bill.

Also, we found that when we had DC our world shrunk a lot for a while (less time and energy for hobbies, meals out, fewer and more simple holidays) so our outgoings reduced a bit without any effort.

Mulled Thank you. That's us! I love my job, am ambitious and want to progress. Each year I apply for positions that will increase my salary because I want to get to the top of my field some day (far off in the future). DH is happy to work just to pay the bills and get by.

He would enjoy being a SAHD. To those who mentioned cooking and cleaning, I know it sounds like I do all the work, but he does the majority of this anyway at the moment because he has a lot more free time at home after work. I often have to work from home in the evenings.

Ony That's a really good idea. Thank you.

Btw, the salaries I mentioned are what we bring home after tax. So yes, DH earns just over minimum wage.

Dh salary is extremely low that's your issue.

He must earn about £18k gross? In London that will go nowhere he needs to unskill.
How will you manage on his salary whilst you ate in mat leave if you only get statutory maternity pay?

Upskill sorry

If you're not willing to move out of London then the only option is your husband HAS to maximise his earning potential. Put the baby on ice for 12-18 months and give him to time to find another job/retrain whatever he needs to do. It simply isn't good enough for him to call all the shots and just decide he'll become a SAHD.....plus you don't have a baby yet, you don't know if he's going to even be a good father, when the baby comes you may decide you don't want him/her stuck in a flat with a crap father (which is way more common than you think)
All the pressure seems to be on you, to provide, save for your maternity leave etc. He needs to pull his finger out too.

Agree, start saving now. eBay/sell everything you don't want or need, meal plan so you only buy what you can need, don't eat out/takeaways, tea/coffee for work in a flask, make your own lunch if you don't already. can you've look at how you get to work, cheaper options? Car share etc. All sound small things but can really help.

I am on maternity leave now & hardly spend any money in comparison, I have no commune costs, £5 minimum daily for food etc.

Childcare is a nightmare cost could you consolidate your hours so you say for instance work 4 days a week. But it is a short term outlaw as children are eligible for free hours once they turn 3.

It can work, it does work, you will be fine!

Childminders are much cheaper than nursery

So where is his london weighting then?

Your outgoings seem quite a lot given there is only 2 of you.
Dp took over the finances for 18 months after ds was born. He nearly bankrupted us. When I took over he showed me a bill for nearly £600 for house insurance. And told me it needed paying straightaway. I spent the next few hours on price comparison sites and putting our details into those companies that weren't and going through the cash back sites to get the best deal. In the end I got it for £135 with £100 cash back. I think I save us £1200 per month over the following week swapping things around. Definitely call your mortgage company to see if there is a better deal they can swap you on to.

Definitely look at where you food shop and at vouchers that are available on line. I think I save at least £5 per week just on presenting vouchers at the till
Is your dh actually on minimum wage.
Given your dhs

There are a lot of leave London comments, which yes is an option, but do think about your career and if it is transferable out of London?

I only say this as I had a great City career in London, outside of London I can barely get a basic accounting job I'm overqualified for everything. I earn less now than I did when I first graduated at 21. Its depressing but I do live in a much better house than I could have had in London.

I think in your shoes I would be looking at ways of maximising earning income in London. Can you get a better paid job with decent maternity, can DH get a better job, his salary sounds extremely low for London? Then I would be saving, saving, saving. Not only will it build up your savings but it would also get you used to living with/on less which is helpful during the maternity years.

With regards to moving... I would be really willing to. I don't like living in the city. I would love to live rurally, but I'm worried that there just won't be the positions there.

I work as a teacher. There are lots of opportunities for progression in teaching in London. For example, there are often assistant head positions coming up, which I could apply for over the next couple of years. However, other areas just don't have the funding for these sorts of positions. So I do need to factor that in.

But it's encouraging to hear that other people have made it work by moving. It definitely is something we could look into.

Your DH seems to have unreasonable expectations or doesn't want kids..

He's on £12k a year? That's lower than the median entry-level graduate salary of c.£17k a year in London. And he wants to live near family in London. But none of this family will be providing any childcare. This isn't sustainable or feasible I'm afraid.

Either he needs to get a full-time job that pays a reasonable amount, or you need to move to a cheaper location, or he needs to commit to being a full-time dad but that means you need to apply for every promotion going, and you need to save money by doing everything (cooking/cleaning/laundry/childcare) in house.

Lots of families do this, but I have unfortunately only seen the last option work when it's the woman who stays at home. I'm sure there are lots of stand up SAHDs, just haven't seen any.

I work as a teacher. There are lots of opportunities for progression in teaching in London. For example, there are often assistant head positions coming up, which I could apply for over the next couple of years. However, other areas just don't have the funding for these sorts of positions. So I do need to factor that in.

Really?! Teaching is one of the jobs I wouldn't be doing in London! There are assistant head jobs everywhere-have you actually looked?

Er, I'd be saying to anyone, woman or man, earning 12K take home full time in London that they should be looking to do things that will increase their earnings. I don't know how you can afford to eat out much at all, and that IMO should be the first thing you cut right down on. Perhaps your DH would be more motivated to up his earnings if it was a case of eating beans on toast at home each time you would usually have gone out for a meal.

Sorry posted too soon
Given your
dhs salary would he consider taking on another job. Has he looked at other jobs in his field and what they pay.
As you seem to think your dh will become a SAHD he cant be too fussed at not continuing his job. As a SAHD could he get an evening job so you have childcare covered

I worried too and we didn't have a baby until we were sure we could manage (just) on just one salary. Six months after the baby was born the working partner had to take a 10% pay cut, 5 months after that another 10% pay cut.

On paper we couldn't get by, but in practice we did. We paid the mortgage and the bills each month and we lived on what was left over. It meant second hand clothes and toys, no holidays, lots of very frugal cooking (i think I invented the MN chicken that feeds a family for a fortnight) and the officially 'SAHP' working evenings and weekends in fairly menial jobs whilst the working parent took over at home but we got by and never had recourse to paid child care. And despite the lack of money I count those hard-up years as the happiest of my life as we pulled together to create a loving family.

Sit down together and budget and then make plans. As long as you can keep a roof over your head and eat regularly everything else will work itself out.

The teachers London waiting if you're in inner London is only about £5000 more per year (on M6)-I bet you're spending way more than that in rent?

rollon I confess I haven't looked in any great detail as DH has been so insistent that he doesn't want to move. That's reassuring though if there are so thank you! I will look properly!

I do know that for the price of our small flat, we could have got a 4 bedroom, newly refurbished house in York or practically a mansion in Wales... But it's the day to day costs that concern me. Our mortgage isn't that high. I would be able to find a job in any area, but DHs field of work is quite technical so it would be hard for him to find something outside of a big city. So I would still end up having to support us all...

I think definitely DH needs to find a better paid job. I will talk to him. A problem is that he is very trusting. His boss keeps telling him he is about to be promoted and get a pay rise, so when I bring it up, he says that he's about to get this pay rise so he'll wait to see if that will help. However, he has been waiting for over two years...