DCs (age 8 and 10) can't swim or ride bikes

[iwouldgoouttonight]

It's more of a what would you do really. I feel like such a failure as a parent. If one child couldn't swim or ride a bike I might think that was their personality and they weren't a very physical person but as it's both of them I guess it's our fault.

They went to swimming lessons for about a year when they were younger (about 4 and 6) and they didn't enjoy it but I kept encouraging them to go. But by the end although DC1 had moved up a group they still both hated it, to the stage where they'd have only got in the water if I'd physically picked them up and put them in screaming and crying (which I wasn't going to do).

DP can't swim so I thought I'd take them swimming each week and teach them myself. They enjoy being in the water and DC1 has got to the stage where he can 'swim' under water and is very confident but can't do an actual stroke and can't lift his head out to breathe without putting his feet on the floor. DC2 can't put her face in the water despite lots of encouragement. She's done it once, hated it, refuses to do it again.

Similar with bikes, they both had bikes, we tried with stabilisers, tried with taking the pedals off and going down a slight slope to get them balancing. But every time they'd get upset, say they don't want to do it and everyone would get stressed. We tried one to one and also with them both trying together. They've now both outgrown the bikes they had so they don't have bikes and it doesn't seem worth buying another one for it to sit in the shed with them refusing to ride it.

DP and I both cycle to work so they're see cycling as a normal every day activity but they just don't want to learn. DC1 had bikability at school and he refused to take part there too.

I'm not as bothered about the cycling but I would like them to learn to swim but I have no idea how to go about it. I thought one to one lessons might help but they don't want to go.

They're really well behaved and as enthusiastic about other things, and will try new things. Eg DC1 went on a school trip to an outdoor pursuits centre and tried abseiling, kayaking, etc. and enjoyed it.

Any ideas?? Saying 'learning to swim is non-negotiable in our house', as some RL friends have said, isn't helpful, we know it's important, but you can't physically force a child to do it.

I know what you mean re the 'swimming lessons are non negotiable' brigade OP. I tried lessons with my two a couple of times and both repeatedly refused to get in. Screamed, cried, got out if put in etc. no punt of cajoling or bribing made a difference. Eldest was terrified of water near her face for years, so the standard national teaching plan didn't work for her at all, as that's pretty much step 1. She learnt at school so by the time she was 9 she could swim a length doggy paddle, which isn't enough but she's no longer fearful of water and I am planning to get her to do some more lessons re stroke mastery at some point soon.

Youngest was taken on a noodle down to the deep end by a swimming instructor ( yes I did complain) and was utterly terrified. Enjoys being in the water, but unsurprisingly, has refused all swimming lessons since then. He'll go with the school this year though, and I'm hoping that this helps.

I do share your experience that it's just not as simple as taking them to swimming lessons.

Assuming they are neurotypical if rewards are not working then you need better rewards!

Chart with a series of achievements (starting with something that they can probably do with a small amount of effort - swim 5m any stroke?) to where you would like them to get to (400m medley / 10 mile bike ride?) with "prizes" that go from "Would rather like that" to "would sell my grandmother for that".

Heard it all now, because I didn't bully my dc into doing the things they didn't want to do, but shelled out thousands for what they did want, I'm a slack parent.
Brilliant, only on Mnet.

Tinkly and Agoddess
Give your heads a wobble

I called my own parents "slack", not you Gilly. And they were bloody slack and as an adult I judge them for it.

gillybeanz - as a matter of interest, do you like swimming and cycling, or are these activities you can take or leave yourself?

But parenting is about equipping your kids with skills that will give them options and allow them to seize opportunities.

Assuming they are neurotypical if rewards are not working then you need better rewards!

@Mumoftwoyoungkids I'm not sure "neurotypical" is a very helpful term to apply to cycling and swimming (and considering the prevalence of the various SpLDs and then traits thereof on top).

And I KNOW that bribery is bloody awful parenting

(Individual) Horses for (individual) courses.

"For too long, we've assumed that there is a single template for human nature, which is why we diagnose most deviations as disorders. But the reality is that there are many different kinds of minds. And that's a very good thing.” - Jonah Lehrer

I'm going to take my dd swimming as much as I can in the holidays but I find it hard when the local pool is full of loud kids that keep splashing and pumping near the less confident that are trying to learn to swim. I'm lucky that dd loves being in the sea so we can go there as well as the pool.

I am a strong swimmer but didn't swim until I was 9, I hated swimming lessons and it wasn't until we got a pool at home that I learnt to swim by teaching myself. Sometimes children need a different approach as lessons at a local pool can be quite scary for some. Lots of people now have above ground pools in their gardens, see if a friend has one you can use and let your children build confidence without being forced or told what to do.

We didn't start ds swimming until he was 8, after around 1 year of 1 x 20 min private lesson and 1 x 30 min group lesson each week he went from screaming when getting his hair shampooed to having his rookie life guard bronze badge and swimming 20 lengths in his pjs to warm up.

There were times he hated lessons, but whenever he did I'd say the course was already booked and paid for so he had to complete. He always got a badge, sometimes 2, at the end of the set of group lessons (due to private lessons helping technique) and that movitated him to sign up for the next set which he then had to complete and so on. Your 8 year old is old enough to do this now without tantrums at the poolside, I'd punish that behaviour with no tablet until the next lesson was completed without fuss, tough but he'd only do it once.

For his bike he learned at 8 too. We had tried before several times and failed. We got him a stunt scooter at 7 and his balance improved as he played a lot on that. The next time we tried on the bike we told him if he did it we would give him £50 holiday money (which we would have spent on him anyway), took him out and he was cycling within 20 minutes just because he wanted too. That summer and next he cycled everywhere, until at 10 it was t cool to ride with a helmet and we wouldn't let him ride without, then all his friends and him stopped riding.

He does swim with friends, and sometimes goes just to do some lengths, but hasn't been on a bike for years. I'd prioritise swimming over bike riding, but weather is good for the bike now so do try both especially with the eldest.

My 9 and 11 year olds can ride a 3 wheel bike and swim a little bit. They both have SN though.

Swimming could potentially save their lives one day so for me this would be more of a priority over riding a bike

I agree with others who mention about your DCs feeling possible embarrassment at their ages - especially with the bike learning as it's so visible.

I taught my DCs to ride a bike when they were aged 6 and 4. I dedicated 3 weekends to it. DD at aged 6 was already embarrassed about learning or going out on stabilisers. So, I chose not our local park where she was likely to bump into friends but a much less popular quiet one which was very flat. I treated it a bit like boot camp to be honest but I did take snacks and drinks with me I knew they liked.

DS at aged 4 had it cracked by the second weekend. DD was still struggling but seeing her younger brother able to cycle definitely spurred her on.

Regarding swimming they have both had group lessons from when they were little. DS wasn't keen but I told him that if he didn't learn to swim he wouldn't be able to go down the cool slides with his friends. DD was in stage 1 for AGES and didn't seem to be making any progress but once she got through that initial stage something has clicked and now she is one of the strongest swimmers in her class. I was pretty determined that they would both be good swimmers BEFORE they had school swimming lessons and would both be confident cyclists BEFORE doing bikeability in school. Because I remember being the child in school who was a rubbish swimmer when all her friends could swim. It was not nice. I was terrified of the water. My grandmother taught me as my parents had totally given up by that point.

ellie my dd has access to trikes at her new school and loves them, I wish I had somewhere to keep one at home and somewhere safe for her to ride it.

Tbh, if I'd only encouraged ds1 to do what he wanted, he would have been incapable of coping in a mainstream school for the first few years. He neither wanted to learn how to dress himself, wipe his bottom or do up zips and buttons, nor did he have the co-ordination to do these things without a considerable amount of active teaching. Without a diagnosis of a pretty severe difficulty, however, schools do not tolerate parents explaining their children find it too difficult and don't want to learn. Where you stop trying to teach your children lifelong skills and start letting them pick and choose really depends on your outlook on life, what you would like them to have access to in future, whether you believe the thing they are refusing to do really is something they will never enjoy and never get any benefit from learning, your children's skills and personalities, and the attitudes you are hoping to instil in them. Swimming and cycling are pretty important to a lot of people, but not to everyone. Neither attitude is wrong per se, it's how and why you go about it.

I don't swim well, I had a bit of an "incident" in a pool as a young child. My parents never took us swimming (youngest of 7, very poor parents) but it was a fairly cheap option in the holidays where we were able to use the pool as long as we wanted for 5p, so my older brothers and sisters would take me but they weren't very diligent in actually looking after me!

DH taught himself to swim in the river at the end of his garden.

We prioritised swimming lessons when DSs were small. DS1 always loved it and still does at age 17. DS2 had times where he really didn't want to continue but we persevered. Being honest there were cold and dark winter nights where we could all see it far enough.

It has however been fantastic for years that they are strong and confident swimmers. They enjoy boat trips abroad where you can jump into the sea from the boat, swimming from rocks back to the beach etc as well as trips to water parks with friends. It really makes your holiday that much more relaxing when they swim well and enjoy the water.

It's really only me that lets the side down as I can't bring myself to jump in and I wish I was more confident, but I swim okay out of my depth and I know I can float. Knowing I can float probably gives me the most confidence and might be the best place to start?

I'm glad you've started thinking about the possibility of dyspraxia OP. I know it's a different thing, but from my experience with DS and reading, when a child is otherwise unproblematic behaviour wise and just has one or two specific areas they kick up a fuss about, chances are that child isn't just being awkward for the sake of it, it's a case of "can't" rather than "won't" (DS turned out to have dyslexia - he is getting there on the reading front, just later and slower than his peers).

I think you're also right that one-to-one lessons with someone other than you or your DH is a good idea - you're both probably too emotionally close to the situation.

I very much doubt it's a "parenting fail" - there is much more likely to be an underlying cause that you just haven't got to the bottom of yet, especially by age 10 or 11.

I agree that learning to swim is a pretty long term project. It's not something parents can do on an odd Saturday afternoon in the pool or during a summer holiday session when the pool is full of teenagers.

Quite often children start lessons at 3 or 4 and finish not that long before finishing primary school. Starting a bit later probably isn't a problem and the smaller the class size, the quicker you will learn, but it really isn't a case of a term or the odd session here and there will do it. So actually committing the time and money to it is crucial.

Sadly I have noticed that not being able to swim is one of the signs of poverty these days - kids who leave primary school and who only had one term of lessons provided in huge groups at primary school rarely leave being competent swimmers, not surprisingly. It is the regular lessons in small groups over an extended period of time that allow people to become competent - and by that I mean at least 50m with a proper stroke, because swimming without a proper stroke is so tiring, it is much harder to keep up over time and is inefficient. Most of us aren't in a position to teach a proper stroke or to build up gradually in the way trained swimming teachers are, which is why lessons are good....plus the fact that kids are usually more receptive to the teacher than a parent.

OP! Glad to hear that they are no longer terrified of water. As others say, they are old enough to grasp the importance of swimming. They will need to persevere to achieve success, but actually your perseverance in putting the time and resources into it will make the difference between it happening and not. It can be your achievement as much as theirs. All the very best with it.

Less has been said about mastering cycling. For many people, unless you live in a cul de sac where children play out on bikes, or are constantly somewhere where biking is easy and hassle free, it often simply doesn't happen. As I said, after failure over 2 summers and with Bikeability looming, we paid for 8 lessons and this cracked it. DC didn't cry and wait and refuse in the way they would have done for us. The teacher knew the techniques to build confidence and knew they could achieve results. It was subsidised by the council and I think cost £120 for 8 lessons...in my mind it was money and time well spent and gave my DC a big boost. It would have been grim being the only child in the year not able to join in Bikeability. And since then, DC has cycled around holiday parks when we have been away and found great pleasure in that. They still are not good on big hills or very long distances, but I didn't need an Olympic athlete, just someone able to join in and who in later life will have the option to use a bike for exercise or transport or pleasure. Yes, I do see swimming and cycling as life skills, but I also see them equally as life opportunities which open doors for kids - and I think most of want most of these basic doors to be open to them do t we.

Gilly I'm so sorry I wasn't referring to anyone on this thread - have read about half the comments and haven't judged anyone as slack or otherwise. I'm just recounting wallowing in my own experience of my parents not encouraging or taking us to any activities, apart from my dad having a phase of taking us swimming once a week when we moved near to the pool he'd swum in as a child. Luckily the pool was near school as well, so I did get taught to swim. Sorry!

I didn't get the hang of swimming until I was 16 and went to adult lessons so I could learn to do 25m as part of my DoE award. I had lessons at school from y2 to y6 with my infant/ first schools having pools on site, and access to the council pool at juniors. I was willing, but completely failed to pick up technique from an instructor shouting from the side, so week in, week out, I'd thrash around and be burned out after 5 metres. Having an instructor in the water to actually show me what to do made all the difference.

I got the motivation to go and do it because I couldn't swim properly with friends and my choices of activities on y9 camp were very restricted. Learning to swim confidently allowed me to do a watersports trip in sixth form, I've met friends through aquanatal, I kept active in pregnancy and used it to rebuild my fitness after while still affected by SPD. It was well worth learning and has had many benefits that I'd have missed out on otherwise.

Bouyed by my success at swimming and going from a length to a mile in less than a year, I decided at 19 that it was about time I learned to ride a bike. I spent my week's salary down at Halfords on Saturday afternoon, and wheeled my new bike home. Sunday afternoon, I went out to some private roads and practiced and got the hang of it. I don't cycle with great confidence, but at least when friends suggested things like a ride around the reservoir I could join in. I have got free transport for local journeys available (which did give me a bonus day's supply work which I'd otherwise have had to turn down when the car was serviced )

Not being able to swim or cycle is exclusionary. It's socially difficult to learn when it feels like you've been left behind. Private lessons are a good idea, and a third party professional takes some of the emotion out of it. My DCs are much better at trying in swimming lessons than when I try to advise them.

I do wonder if I have dyspraxic tendencies, my throwing and catching skills barely exist and I struggle with organisation/ time keeping/ tidiness. Some people seem to need more time to gather the coordination for things like swimming and cycling even if it's not a SpLD.

Good luck with the lessons.

Agoddess

Completely my fault, didn't read properly, apologies.
Tbh, in your case I agree, parents should give their children opportunities to try a wide variety of activities.

I thought you were from the school of swimming being essential and bullying dc into doing it.
Apologies again

Not teaching your children to swim is negelectful in my opinion. If they don't want to - tough.

My posts earlier which were reported and consequently deleted stem from my witnessing a toddler drowning next to me in a public pool.

I'm hawkeyed around my own kids in water, I'm educated about coastal rip currents, the potential underwater obstructions in a peaceful looking inland waterway and so forth. I kayak alone and even as a good swimmer I'm still frosty every second.

Perhaps a better idea is the educational videos then about how impossible it is to spot a drowning kid in water, that's what I meant really. The lifeguard rescues.

The toddler in my local pool was just behind me. He was one of those kids that never stay still and I'd noticed him running round the pool and his Mum giving chase, so just assumed as he climbed into the staggered steps at the shallow end that she was on his case, so I looked back to my own kids.
(I tend to watch all kids in the pool as well as my own, I bet the lifeguards give me silent daggers as it's their job not mine 😄)

Anyway he'd gone under right next to me because I'd assumed she was with him. I heard her shriek and as I turned round he was sinking out of his depth, silently and without flailing, as drowning normally does.

He survived mind you. But that's why I think parents should teach their kids to swim without fail. Never mind bloody cycling, that's not a skill that's going to save your life, or someone else's life, one day.

I absolutely don't agree that I'd only have to punish my children once for refusing to get in the swimming pool.

They both had near phobic responses to it, one seemingly innate and one the result of being taken down the deep end by an instructor when he was 4 and being utterly terrified.

Time has enabled the older one to be able to swim. Still not there yet with the younger one. Punishing their fears is a ridiculous way to go about things. Anxiety isn't rational. Suggesting that a child can just stop it is really horrible.

Best of luck OP. I hated swimming lessons, swimming pools are so loud and echoing, I always felt the coaches were shouting at me. They were but it took a long time for me to understand the difference between shouting in anger and shouting to be heard so it was all so difficult. Just throwing it out there in case that's part of the issue.

Agree with PP that they have to want to do it - making them may be possible but not fun for anyone. At this age, peer pressure is probably the best way. Holidays with pools and other children, places where they can go off alone on bikes and have independence would be fun for them, to get things started?

Screaming on the poolside does sound excessive for a ten year old though - most ten year olds would be embarrassed about that unless they had a phobia that meant they didn't care.

Swimming and cycling may not be essential life skills - but as you and your husband both enjoy them, probably your kids will too, so they are going to miss out massively on loads of fun as they get older if they can't

We are allowed different opinions it doesn't make a parent neglectful if they don't teach their dc to swim.
None of mine can swim, nor are they interested and as grown ups now can learn if they wish to.
Neither has any wish to and dd doesn't want to either.
They don't appear to have missed out on anything.
I can ride a bike and two of our 3 dc can too.
Dh and ds2 don't/can't ride bikes. They too don't think they've missed out on anything.
Neither are necessary imo, nice if you/ your dc want to, but you are hardly neglectful if they don't.