To think new mum's needs should come first?

[PostmanPatisacrappostman]

Aibu to think that life shortly after giving birth can often be downplayed?

I'm thinking in terms of visitors and what is expected of new mums. I sometimes see threads on here (I've seen it in rl too), everyone suddenly wants a piece of the newborn baby. They want to visit, hold the baby, sometimes even take the baby away for a while, and sometimes this goes against what the mum wants, but she's called precious and possessive.

New mothers are usually expected to have their door open for a string of visitors when she's knackered and recovering.

Thinking back to when I had my youngest. I'd had a very dramatic delivery, stitches, getting no sleep at all, breasts engorged and nipples feeling like they were falling off, bleeding heavily, baby blues and suddenly there was a queue of visitors waiting to take the baby. I even had my in laws round while the midwife was trying to support my breastfeeding.

Being introvert I find visitors exhausting at the very best of times and I'm convinced that coping with all the visitors in those early weeks set me off on a path to pnd.

I aid to dh that if we ever had another baby I'd ban visitor for the first few weeks until I'd found my feet. It wouldn't have been so bad but no one even so much as made us a cup of tea.

I know I'll probably be called a snowflake but I cannot think of any other time when you'd be expected to entertain guests constantly, it's fair enough if the mother wants visitors, and yes I know it's the dads baby too. Given the mum is the only one who's just gone through the pregnancy, birth and aftermath, aibu to think her comfort should be priority for a little while?

I think it depends on the conduct of visitor in question. I was dreading the PILs arriving about a week after the birth. My DPs were close and helpful. PILs were more distant geographically and emotionally. I need not have worried. The MIL arrived with a full roast dinner in bags and proceeded to cook for us all including my DPs and even stayed on to clean up and even ran the hoover round. I was surprised I had dreaded the whole visit thing

Never had kids and never want them so most of this is based on reading many threads here on MN.

1. On the whole totally agree that mothers needs are very important after birth. Every birth is different and every womans experience is different. Some have really hard, medically traumatic births and others seem really disproportionately upset that they didnt get the elevation to some supernatural spiritual plane of existence due to stressed out midwife was not the temporal equivalent of a spirit guide.
2. A mothers needs when it comes to visitors etc. to be balanced with expectations of what involvement you want family to have with child. People have posed here about births not really being acknowledged or mothers to be devastated that parents or in-laws are going on holiday (free child sitting of babies older siblings not available). So we have then a spectrum of expectations of people not being too full on for the mother after the birth yet also having to be available in some way. There is a gap there that means no-one is going to be happy. "Please be around but not too close" is a hard message to understand.
3. Family dynamics matter so when and how DPs/DHs family are allowed to see a child compared to mothers own DM is an issue. I think hospitals should have family rooms that let proud dads show off new babies without the mother being there if they dont want to be. So many people complain that Dads dont get involved with new babies. If they and their families are not allowed to share in the joy of a new baby in the same was as the Mum and her family then why complain later? The creation of a hierarchy of caring that places the father lower than the mother as opposed to being an equal just seems to create problems when the father is supposed to suddenly get involved later on.

I think a well publicised birth plan discussed in advance with all relatives with agreements made could be a way forward?

To not want anyone there whilst in hospital with DS?
http://www.mumsnet.com/Talk/amiibeingunreasonable/2975299-to-not-want-anyone-there-whilst-in-hospital-with-ds

Read this. Save everyone 6 hours.

Mind you it has to be said, the posters on Mumsnet are very diverse.

Take pregnancy/birth out of the equation for a minute.

Personally I can never get my head around people 'hosting' family for dinner.

In my life, my family just pop around for a bit of dinner and it's all very informal. It's just the way we are.

But I imagine the 'family host' type posters are all a bit too 'formal'? to say, "Oy stick the kettle on will you?" Or "Jeez I'm knackered now, do you mind if I get some sleep? I'll ring/text when it's ok for you to pop round again".

I guess some families/friends just communicate and act differently.

Surely even the most formal of families can manage "It was lovely seeing you, thanks for coming, we shouldn't keep you any longer" , Worra?

scottishdiem - the only useful thing to put on a birth plan is "have a baby". Everything else is so dependent on what actually happens

YANBU OP. It isn't to benefit the baby in any way and if it isn't benefitting you, they can wait.

Ollie, I do not agree with equality at all in the post natal ward. The mother's wishes come first. Fortunately most women love introducing the baby to the people they love and enjoy the company and support.

But this is not the experience of everyone. Some births are more traumatic than others physically and, or emotionally. Women who have suffered previous miscarriage or still birth, survivors of sexual abuse/assault, those with unsupportive family members and those who just feel too tired/weak/sore to see anyone should have their wishes respected.

when i had my daughter the hospital wanted me to stay in but i refused my second night in hospital due to not even being given a drink never mind any food, i got discharged at 10pm and got home and settled, then every morning between 8.30 and 9am i was woken to the sound of my door buzzer and turned out to be my MIL!! (everyone knows you need sleep) i had alot of stitches and could barely walk and even getting out bed was a struggle. i wouldnt mind visitors but i was fuming that i was getting woken up at that time, she only came as she had a newspaper!! we have never bought one but dont understand why she couldnt put it through the letter box or leave it outside the door, we lived on flats so the main door was always open until 12 for the postman to get entry. luckily i havent spoken to her in 6 years now (very long story) but its up to the mum to decide if she wants visitors and how she feels after having the baby. if i had to even have another i would explain that im more than happy but i need my rest so would rather they came between certain hours

Well that's what I think too OlennasWimple

They should also be able to tell them to help themselves to tea/coffee but I'm astounded at the amount of Mumsnetters who apparently can't or won't.

Would it be so hard to just really LISTEN to the new mum? Surely this flustered, overwhelmed, physically injured, exhausted woman isn't up to much game-playing? She'll tell you the truth when you ask?

Of course you're dying to see and sniff the freshly-baked bubs. Chances are you will, whoever you are, before they hit university.

So use all those adulting skills to ASK and LISTEN to what the new Mum needs, and do that. Stay away a bit longer till she sorts herself out? Come around with food or the hoover and stay just long enough to do some good and have a quick peek? Settle in to cuddle the Mum and help her debrief about the birth for a couple of hours? Check what you can buy at the shops for her that she realises she needs and leave it discreetly by the door? Host the drop-ins so she doesn't have to?

Basically put your own needs after those of the new parents and baby, not before. Can't think of a personality type or cultural norm that would be offended by this approach?

This is where living in America really paid off. I got my own room in hospital for five days. There was a nursery for me to send the baby to and the baby went to nursery every single day at 10am for the paediatrician visit. I had wifi and my laptop so no issues with getting on skype to call people. Nurses and HCAs came and every 30-45mins for various reasons giving me ample opportunity to cut off lengthy phone conversations.

It was 5 days of bliss. I went home and my DH was on skype all the bloody time to his parents. Phone calls would last for four house on skype. It was awful.

Worra some women are so conditioned to put other's needs first that they can't prioritise themselves even when they are knackered and in pain.

Well yes Dione some are and some aren't.

Equally it would seem some husbands/partners are or aren't brought up to fear their own mums and dads, when it comes to not upsetting them.

As I say, a very diverse crowd on Mumsnet.

I was lucky in that all visitors I had were considerate and didn't stay very long. Lovely friends brought me nice moisturiser etc which was nice.
But when i had DS3 my in laws 'told' DH they would be coming down for weekend 3 days after I gave birth on Wednesday (they live 4 hour drive away, so naturally come for a few days when they do come). I suggested they wait til DS was 6 weeks old, when we could all go out and do stuff etc, but NO.

So turned up Saturday morning at 9am, I was a wreck (funnily enough, I wasn't looking/feeling great cos I had been up all night with a 3 day old plus 2 other pre schoolers to look after . . . so yeah). FIL made a crack at me being in pyjamas, then he and MIL sat down on couch and expected to be 'entertained' while I made them tea and got biscuits (they didn't bring any food or anything)etc . . . then after an hour of this (unsurprisingly I was not a great hostess) they went to visit FIL sister who lives about a 15 min drive away. As they ate a lot of the food I'd pre made I thought oh good they'll bring something for lunch. They came back after an hour to a crazy house with 2 active small children, a newborn and me and DH desperately needing sleep, again empty handed. They then sat around expecting to be amused, feed etc, so I suggested (any hostess graces I had were now gone funnily enough!) they take the 2 oldest to the park. MIL made a face like she'd been sucking lemons but they went and I was asleep when they came back, which I think gave them the pip. Then told other relatives I wasn't very friendly or in a great state.
GRRRR this still riles me up and it was nearly 5 years ago. They have 13 grandchildren, all older, so it wasn't like they hadn't been through this before.

And to add to the diversity...

Some people tell awful stories of brash/bullish grandparents who demand immediate regular access to grandchildren and never take the parent's feelings into account.

But after some deeper digging about why two independent adult parents would allow this to happen, it sometimes transpires that money is at the root of it, and they're happy to sell themselves out to their inlaws/parents for private school fees or huge trust funds/mortgages.

As I say, a very diverse crowd here.

Not wanting people to come in, expect to be waited on and ignore your wishes regarding your baby is NU at all.

Refusing to allow anyone, even grandparents to visit for a "few weeks" is VU. Laying down groundrules before visits is the best way to go. An hour tops for the first week, and only then for grandparents and your siblings. No hosting will be done so if they want a cup of tea they had best be prepared to make it themselves and one for you too. That if the baby needs feeding it will be fed, regardless of whether who ever is cooing over it at the time feels that they havent had a long enough cuddle. And stick to the rules, including going back to bed with baby once their hour is up if needs be.

Cutting people out completely damages relationships, so its best to manage the demanding ones rather than going OTT and banning them altogether.

Totally agree. I had a traumatic time but everyone visiting, judging... if people are supportive, great. Often it's much more formal though and the last thing you need.

Sorry didn't know that there was a thread about this.

It probably is more about the behaviour of some of my relatives. Not hard to imagine that some people are pushy and don't take hints.

The other thing is perhaps that we have a large family so lots more visitors. All I know is in those first few weeks there didn't seem to be a time when people weren't here.

We definitely weren't selling ourselves to anyone for money or free childcare. Quite the opposite they ask us for favours.

I loved having visitors. It broke up the day and forced me to get dressed. Also gave an opportunity to sleep.
I don't believe half the stories on MN about MILs. It seems fashionable to have a ludicrous story about how pushy they are. I always think what would people be commenting if it was DM instead?

I'm an introvert and get even more so if I'm in pain and/or very tired (DH has described me as being like a wounded animal - I apparently physically make myself smaller and gravitate towards corners).

After DD1 was born, my relatives (various aunts and uncles) and a few family friends had visited (for short periods and well fielded by my DH and DM - we were living in the granny flat next to DM at the time so visits actually happened in her house, and she'd pack me off "home" when needed). But I was quite hurt when it dawned on me that two weeks later other than a couple of texts none of my friends had visited.

DH had a quiet word - and it seemed that being aware of how introverted I was and that I'd had an early and traumatic birth (including DD being in the Special Care Unit when I was sent home), they had all been giving me space. All I wanted to do was show off DD!

Yadnbu! With dd1 my ils arrives 5 minutes after wed got home from the hospital. My parents an hour later. The ils left only to have mil phone dh from the car sobbing about how it wasn't fair that she wouldn't get to be as close to dd1 as my mum! I was forced to go to a family BBQ the next day, have all extended family within the first week. It was a nightmare. With dd2, I said from the outset that people needed to wait. Mil insisted that she HAD to see the baby on the day she was born, because she'd seen her other gc on the day that they were born. She didn't care what time it was, she had to see them. I told her if the baby arrived in the morning then she could, but if she were a late arrival then she couldn't. Baby arrived late evening and I text to say she'd arrived safely, dh was picking up dd1 to come and meet her but no visitors as I was knackered and it was getting late. They werent happy but met her 24 hours later - honestly, what difference did it make? On the way home, after dropping dd1 back to my mums, dh was phoned by pil who were insisting he should have told the extended family. Dd2 was 3 hours old! Pil were annoyed that we'd left it late so they announced to all the aunts and uncles. My parents and pil were invited to meet the baby the next day in two slots so that they wouldn't all arrive together. Then they wrre asked to give us some space. We didn't have extended family (by which I mean dhs aunts and uncles) for two weeks. It was bliss. I needed that time to recover. Dd1 needed that time to bond. No one liked it much but I don't care. I put my needs first instead of catering for everyone else's. It's the first selfish thing I've ever done and it was brilliant.

I think it's understandable but I get your point. In the third day after I had my daughter over twenty people turned up to visit. They had to make them stand in the corridor. It was really quite stressful as I was very ill. In addition I had 28 large bouquets of flowers sent to the hospital and hubby had to ferry them home and sit them on the patio as the smell was over bearing and the nurses could only take so many. They literally covered most of the patio.

However had no one turned up I'd probably have been quite concerned also. It is what it is.

MY PILs were round the day after we got home from hospital. I was exhausted, in a lot of pain and thought I was up for visitors.

They each had one cuddle, then I said I was too wiped to continue the visit and asked them to go. They went. My SIL tried arguing but my glorious, glorious MIL said no, I was the mum, I was the one who'd just given birth so it was my right to throw them out.

In hindsight I really should have said no visitors today but oh well, live and learn. I've already said to the OH that if we do have another, I want at least three days to establish breastfeeding and bonding just the two of us.

I think it's expected to have close family & friends descend on you in the first few days & I found it in equal measures exhausting & lovely.
I didn't run around after anyone, but I do like showing off my newborns.

After my son I had my in laws, my parents, both mine & my husband's siblings, plus all their children in the house at once & that was way too much. Kids all clambouring to hold the baby, noise, mess, just pretty awful to be honest so for my next birth I had single visits only & it was much calmer.

I think the mum has to set the pace for visits but should allow them, visitors can provide distraction & help when you need it most!

When I had my 2, I asked for people not to come and visit me in hospital. Then, even at home we didn't invite anyone round for at least 2 weeks. There's plenty of time to meet the baby, it doesn't have to be the moment it is born!