To think that just because we have a good income we shouldn't give our children whatever they want?

[YesMadamDeputySpeaker]

My DH and I both grew up in low-income families. Thanks to the power of a good education, we both made it to university and now have a very comfortable lifestyle without needing to worry about money. We're able to take the DC on regular holidays, have a nice home, cars, etc.

Even before we actually had children, we had always pledged to give our children the sort of childhood we didn't get to have - such as taking them abroad on holiday, and making sure they have lots of nice things.

However, I've since come to realise that there is a difference between 'not having to worry about money' and 'getting everything you want because we can afford it'. As I said we had very little money when I was growing up, yet I still had a happy and extremely love-filled childhood. I've grown up appreciating hard work and the importance of school, and not taking things for granted.

DH, on the other hand, is very much of the 'you can have whatever you want' mentality. Our eldest daughter (13) wants to go on a (non-educational) school trip next year which would cost in the region of £650. DH wants he and I to pay the whole thing ourselves, thus giving her a luxury our parents couldn't. I feel like it didn't do me any harm to have to save up for things I wanted as a child - in fact, it probably made me appreciate them more - and so I suggested we pay half provided she pays the other half using savings. DH disagreed heavily.

Our younger DC don't tend to ask for much, but DD and her brother (10) constantly ask for new gadgets/clothes/toys etc. I feel terrible because we have a disposable income meaning they could have most of the things they want, and I would have loved that as a child; yet I don't want them to grow up feeling entitled and like mum and dad will always pay for everything for them.

I also work in a very rough secondary school in an area with high rates of poverty and inequality. This is perhaps another reason why I am reluctant to let my children have everything they want, when I work with young people every day who cannot afford to have food or clothes bought for them.

Finally, I feel like a total hypocrite as every time I say any of this DH points out the fact that I spend quite a lot of money on items for myself as well. I feel like such a terrible person. I just want my DC to grow up appreciating the value of money and hard work but I don't want them to not have things they want just because I didn't - I'm bracing myself for suggestions that I'm projecting my childhood feelings onto them.

Am I being unreasonable or do I have a point here? Any thoughts gratefully appreciated

Instead of saying no, why don't you try to teach the value of money. So it would probably only work for the eldest. Work out how much you think you spend on clothes for her, travel to school, school lunches etc. Say £200 pm. Give her that money at the start of each month. She can spend it on whatever she likes; but if she wants any clothes, non educational trips etc then she pays, if she has no money left during the month she has to make her own dinner. If she does well and manages to save towards the trip, either agree to half or to treat her to something else. Not sure if you would expect her to pay for school uniform or not. I guess that's your decision.

I'm not sure how well this would work with the 10 yr old, maybe a similar process but keep the money yourself and tell him he's only allowed to pay x amount on treats/toys/games per month. He can spend whatever he wants on stuff, but once the money has gone it's gone. I don't think buying his own clothes etc would work, but things like gadgets, sweets after school etc. It would obviously be a small amount per month.

It also teaches them not to blow all their money within the first week. Might take a while, but being able to budget is a good skill to have.

I'm with you OP. Or DDs have paid 50% of every school trip. We've given them options use Birthday Monday, do jobs with a list and a value - things like keep your room tidy, fill then washer, dishwasher etc. Or sell things.

They are now 15 and 16 both have Saturday jobs and certain things they have to buy themselves - makeup designer cloths, expensive phones, concerts etc.

If they want a t-shirt from a concert they understand how hard it is to earn that money and also understand there is no magic money tree.

I think it's really important that they don't become entitled or spoilt.

We can afford to do things and are happy to support and encourage our kids in every way but I really don't believe giving them everything on a plate helps them on their life journey.

Even Bill Gates says he is not a magic money tree for his children. I understand he and Melinda are planning on giving them the best education going, but after that, his children are fully expected to work for a living (albeit they get the benefits of that top-rate education, connections, family name etc). The Gates wealth is going to go into the Gates Foundation for good causes (currently they are working on eradicating malaria)

Good thread, valid questions!

I have a 12-and 14 year old, they get £5 a week but I also pay for bowling/theme park with their friends every now and then.

Last inset day, DS went to Thorpe Park (I paid entrance fee) but he brought his own packed lunch (as did his friends)

He babysits for extra cash

They can go on school trips, and do extra curricular stuff, but I only bought them an X box when they were 11/13 (joint X mas present)

We drive a 10 yr old car (a good reliable car, just a bit old) and have Android phones, and shop at Lidl.

We are not frugal, just what I hope as "sensible", they don't expect me to buy them expensive trainers/gadgets.

It's a hard balance to strike: deep down I'd like to buy them everything, but I know that would not actually do them any favours...

It is much nicer to say "yes" to a school trip if they don't automatically expect it!

In your shoes, I'd say yes to school trips but hold off a bit with trainers/gadgets etc.

Our 14yr old dd just got back from learning how to dive, and gaining her PADI certificate, in Lanzarote with school. The trip cost around £1000 which we paid but she had to save up for her spending money. This balance is what worked for us.

I don't think £5 a week is mean, especially when you're covering all the other costs for them. Our dd gets similar, plus has a weekend paper round which pays her another £30 a month. We pay for her phone contract, toiletries, basic makeup, clothes and if she's going out with friends will give her extra cash on top. She has the opportunity to earn more if she chooses by doing more chores.

Just because we can afford it, doesn't mean it should just be accepted that we will afford everything they desire.

We have little money ( our 14year old gets £15/month!). In our circumstances, a trip like this would be a birthday/Christmas present not just from us but both sets of grandparents too. In your circumstances, I think I would give chores to do around the house to pay for it. That seems like a great compromise.

am 'mean' and 'unpleasant' then so be it (though I think you'd find plenty who disagree, including my children and partner), I would disagree

Then get your child to use her Xmas and birthday money to pay for her school trip if your husband and children are all for it. My apologies, I got the impression from the op they disagreed with you. Something about your husband disagreeing with you heavily?

As for you having an amazing childhood, why did you pledge with your husband to give your children " the childhood you didn't have?". Why would you do that if yours was so amazing?

School trips at that age are always learning and development opportunities, even if strictly not curriculum focussed.

YABU not to pay for that.

My parents could never afford to send me or my siblings on any residential school trips..

It's one thing I always remind my DC as they go away almost bi-monthly (it seems!)

I'd also add why did you post this

'm bracing myself for suggestions that I'm projecting my childhood feelings onto them

When any suggestion of it is met with " I had an amazing childhood"? What childhood feelings? All you've done is post repeatedly about your childhood and how it didn't do you any harm.

For me, I have issues with anyone who is mean to children. Making a 13 year old use her Xmas and birthday money to pay for her school trip when as a parent you can easily afford it is mean in my book, and nearly everyone else's. As said, there is a mid ground between you and your husband,

I think OP is getting a bit of a hard time, too.

So £5 doesn't buy a cinema ticket etc - but surely many adults wouldn't afford to go to the cinema each week either. You'd save and go once a month or something. It's a treat, but not an unattainable one. And if for some reason there were two trips in close succession, you could rejig finances to go, but make cuts elsewhere. It's the sort of small level budgeting that teenagers could do.

Trips are much more money, and once it's coming out of savings, it's not noticeable in the same way, so doesn't really teach the same lessons. You don't notice missing savings immediately, unless you were already saving for somethign really specific. Teenagers don't think 'oh if I go on this trip, I won't have as much money in my savings account for a car in four years time' - it's much more abstract. They won't have the same appreciation of what £300 would buy, now or later; it's all just numbers beyond a point.

You could increase her pocket money slightly, and encourage jobs, babysitting etc, and give her more chances to budget with her money. I think it's sensible, as long as she's not really out of step with her peers.

I agree with you on the expensive gadgets front - she doesn't need them at 13.

However, I couldn't imagine asking a 13 year old to pay for a school trip, especially when she gets a meagre £5 pocket money a week! I'm actually impressed she manages to save any of that. Sounds like she's budgeting well.

Initially, I would have said, you pay for the trip, let your daughter save for the spending money. But really, given how little she gets in the way of pocket money already, I don't think that would be appropriate either.

We give our dcs frugal pocket money at 25p per week per year of age. We buy them toiletries and clothes, and pay for school trips which are for the whole year, not the ones like skiing which are optional. Big things like laptops are birthday presents bought with birthday money from many relatives). They earn money through part time jobs when they are old enough.

I notice on this thread that people spend a lot more on entertainment than we do, maybe city living is more expensive. My dcs will entertain themselves by going to friends houses, going for walks. Cinema is often a birthday invitation, rather than a weekly or monthly thing.

I think it's good that the dcs see it as normal to earn some of their own money from about age 15/16. They enjoy their jobs and the sense of independence it brings.

I think if the school trip is expensive skiing rather then museum trips and swimming, I'd be happy for them to earn half the cash through household jobs and such.

Similar situation to you op but my dc only 2 so haven't had to overcome these hurdles yet.

I have seen the effects of spoiled children in my dh niece and nephew - who've had every trip / holiday /hobby paid for, brand new mac books, iPhones etc.

They've grown up assuming that they'll get well paid jobs but haven't got the grades at school to get those jobs, they think the average salary in the UK is £40k etc etc.

I think your dc should get one trip a year, but I'd they want more they have to earn it - doing extra chores in the house, maybe washing neighbours cars or gardening, dog walking? At 13 I did a paper round, I don't know if that's considered too unsafe these days?

Anyway I can't speak from experience but I it's up to you and dh to ensure your dc knows the value of hard graft and doesn't think the world owes them a living. So I think your dh is BU. Good luck.