To have not removed DS from tea room?

[OtAndBothered]

Went for day out to national trust abbey today with DH, DS1 (4) and DS2 (2). It's obviously very hot and DS2 was becoming cranky so we came out of the abbey and headed for a little tea room in the village. Sat down with cakes and drinks and DS became more agitated with the heat and started crying. I tried to pacify him but he became more and more upset so DH and I took it in turns to comfort him whilst also trying to each our lunch. It didn't help that the tea room was an old stone building so the cries were magnified and echoing.

Anyway an old couple stood up and started to leave having evidently not touched their lunch. The waiter said to them "are you leaving already? Is there a problem with the food?" So the old woman said "no but we came in here to relax and it's hardly a relaxing atmosphere unfortunately". The waiter replied "I'm so sorry about the noise" and shot us the most evil glare.

DH became agitated and embarrassed saying we should just leave but the alternative was to take DS outside where it was even hotter where he would have cried and screamed even more! I told DH we should just stay and finish our lunch and try and get DS to drink. Anyway eventually he started drifting off to sleep but then a loud noise woke him up with a start and he began screaming. At this point a younger woman slammed her cup down and snapped "for gods sake!". Her husband looked embarrassed and told her to "just leave it" to which she replied "I can't, the racket is giving me a headache! So much for peace and quiet!"

She shot me a look so I said "I'm sorry, he's obviously hot and bothered, it's not exactly relaxing for us either but it's even hotter outside so I'm not sure what you expect me to do?". She seemed to soften up and replied "no, I'm sorry, it's just that people come in here to relax and the noise is deafening, everyone is leaving for that's reason! Can't you take him for a walk or something?" .

Anyway I said "no sorry, as I said it's hotter outside and my other child is still finishing his lunch". With that DH overheard the waiter apologising to customers coming in about the noise. Afterwards DH said I was selfish and we should have just left but I'm not sure what anyone expected me to do! It was 32 degrees outside, he was crying because he was hot! Taking him back outside would have made him much worse and there were people "relaxing" out there too so surely we'd have ended up in more bother?!

I truly think the OP imagined everyone would line up to support her and her u reasonable behaviour. The majority did not so common sense held sway.

Excellent.

...her unreasonable behaviour.

Chloe, who on earth do you think you are that you can dictate what I post on? The Lord himself?

It was not an order, it was a suggestion. You seem very...fraught.

Oh oh it's the old corker: HTH.
Most amusing!

Wow judgement mum's are out today, so you suggest "ladies" that what you have a child and stay in doors not to cause anyone else the indignity of wow maybe hearing a child cry until what age?? 12,13? This is supposed to be mumsnet supposed to be a place where we are all mum's to babies and children yes children who cry, imagine that!!! Hang your heads in shame you bunch of self centred judgemental females how dare you!!! Have you never been somewhere with a crying child trying to sooth them and have to put up with the tuts the stares of other whilst feeling yourself getting hotter and more frazzled?? Feeling watched ready to cry? Guess not you were probably the ones doing the tutting and staring and making someone feel uncomfortable, climb down from your ivory towers seriously disgusted with all of you! Op I feel your pain don't worry about this bunch of bigoted idiots

This should surely be breaking news. The second coming is here. Christ has risen again. In the form of Chloe. On mumsnet.

Yes, Chloe is actully God. She messed up a namechange earlier and outed herself. You should've seen some of those AIBUs!

And yes you really should calm down, User - your level of vitriol about the OP is extreme and a bit scary. Go out and enjoy the sunshine. Maybe there's a nice NT cafe you could stop by?

Oh oh oh! AND another one, guys! Is someone trying to needle user by suggesting she might like to have a little rest? Hmm?

User is, in fact, making excellent points and making them well.

I think some people should look inwards and consider why they have such a need to flagellate the OP. The answers might be illuminating.

And the oracle hath spoken once again. It is indeed rather 'illuminating'.

Frankly I think the OP could cover herself in sackcloth and ashes and walk the streets of AIBU hitting herself with a flail while chanting "I am the worst parent of all time!", and there would still be people chasing after her to give her a kicking.

Yes, Chloe is actully God. She messed up a namechange earlier and outed herself. You should've seen some of those AIBUs!

53rd

They're clearly throwing their toys out of the pram because they want to rip OP apart unchecked.

Op I feel your pain don't worry about this bunch of bigoted idiots

mrsB never has a truer word been spoken

Yes, mrsb. Most of us have indeed been in that position . We picked up our screaming child and left. We didn't sit there thinking "Fuck you, all of you, if you don't like it you can leave".
Because that's the considerate, civilised response.
Nothing like your belligerent rant.

Well some people don't learn easily do they? The OP didn't despite one family leaving, a waiter apologising to customers about the noise of the child, another patron telling her to take the child out and her husband telling her that she was selfish. She still felt totally reasonable. So much so that she felt the need to ask users on here.

This is one of those threads where the OP has the view that she has the right to be in the public place as much as anyone else and to enjoy herself, regardless of the impact on anyone else.

In my view, anyone whose party will cause extreme upset and spoil the enjoyment of others should not be there. If one of their party behaves in a way to spoil the enjoyment of others then they should leave. Yes, that compromises their own enjoyment, but I think people should be prepared to do that.

In this case, OP and DH should have taken it in turns to sit outside or both left. If other child was still eating, one could have stayed with him and other left. The fact it was hot outside is not relevant - it is up to the OP to cope with her family and manage the situation, not for everyone else to suffer to allow the OPs family to have a meal.

I am of the view that if your family cannot behave in a way which won't spoil the enjoyment of others and you are not prepared to exit if they do, then you shouldn't go in the first place. It is entitled behaviour to expect others to put up with behaviour which spoils their experience.

And to the parents who say that in that case they will never be able to go out or go anywhere nice.....so be it. If there is a short phase when you have to stay at home or plan so that you are not in restaurants or cafes with a very noisy or lively child, then you will have to. You are not entitled to be anytwhere you like as a matter of right, if your party spoils the enjoyment of others. Yes, it's a shame for parents of small children to have to plan ahead more, to go for options they might not love and to sometimes miss out......it is one of the short term consequences of having small children. And those who are not prepared to accept that but think other people who have looked forward to a pleasant meal or drink or whatever should just have to put up with a child who runs around or shouts or cries for extended periods are being selfish. There are plenty of outings and places people with small children can go - they may well not be as appealing as other places, but they are the places to go until children have reached a stage where they can behave in an appropriate way. And yes, we can all misjudge this and be caught off guard with poor behaviour/crying or whatever.....fine, but then leave, rather than subjecting others to hours of it.
Rant over! The entitled selfishness of such behaviour infuriates me. Small children and their normal behaviours in appropriate places, or even in inappropriate places, if responded to quickly don't. It's the parents!

So much so that she felt the need to ask users on here.

Nah...y'think? Do you even know what AIBU stands for?

What would the OP need to do so that you felt satisfied she had changed her mind, User? Clearly saying that she acknowledges she was being unreasonable doesn't cut it for you, so what would? What could she do to make you think "ah, fair enough - she sees why that was wrong now, it would be mean to keep putting the boot in"?

At what age does that end Chocolate?

So in this scenario, for everyone to maintain enjoyment, someone has to leave. Either the OP has to leave with child and the people eating lunch in the restaurant can enjoy their meal.....or those eating lunch in the restaurant need to leave in order to avoid a headache and allow the OP to continue to enjoy or at least eat her lunch.

So who needs to take responsibility for this? Is it the people who are responsible for the child or those who have nothing to do with the child? How anyone can think that the public ought to leave, or that it is okay for the OP to stay for a sustained period of time with a wailing baby amazes me. I can only assume that the Op has decided that her enjoyment counts for much much more than anyone else's. That is what her actions suggest and it is very difficult to interpret them in any other way. Yes she was in a difficult situation and leaving would create other problems to deal with.....but they would be her problems, not made into those of others who unwittingly found themselves subjected to lengthy wailing for which they bore no responsibility whatsoever.

Maybe if she said, ok, it was a ludicrous idea to take to small children to an abbey. It was ridiculous to think my children would enjoy being bored out of their tree in extreme heat. I was silly to have parked the car so far away. I was selfish to not try to comfort my child. When my child didn't settle I was rude and arrogant not to leave. When the first couple left I was arrogant not to have left myself instead. I was rude to the other lady. I was beyond unreasonable to have pigheadedly remaining eating my cake for 20 minutes while the business had to apologise in advance for the behaviour of my child. I was negligent in not doing more to soothe my toddler who was clearly distressed and uncomfortable. I accept that I was a tiny bit silly and will rethink our future stately homes visits. I will apologise to DH for the misery I subjected him to. I will let the kids enjoy being kids in future and not put them and others through the torture of being 'stately homes' parents.

At what age does that end Chocolate?

Every parent must make their own judgement about their own child and the situations they can cope with and can be in without ruining others enjoyment. It is individual and most will get it wrong sometimes - not a disaster, if in that situation, people are willing to consider others and if needed, remove their children. With children up to perhaps 5, anyone might find that they need to do that if their kids have a bad day. Others may find that their children's behaviour isn't good enough for much longer and may have to be prepared to leave until a later age.

Isn't it the being prepared to leave if other people's enjoyment is being severely compromised that is key, rather than being so determined to have your own rights to be in the place, regardless of the effect on others, that is important. It's when people insist on staying regardless of the behaviour of their party, because they are so sure they have a right and entitlement which exceeds that of others that there is a problem.