TO BE ABSOLUTELY THRILLED AT A HUNG PARLIAMENT

[rolopolovolo]

This is the best outcome by miles. No hard brexit. (The city now predicts soft Brexit or even no Brexit!!!) No more crazy ideas by either side. Compromise. Tories given a good slap in the face for this stupid election.

This is the first election day in a long time with a good result!

Agree with elements and juneau

Its really pissing me off this will of the people shit

And then May said something along lines of 'the British people want us to make a success of brexit'

Well

A) success would be a nice change

B) dur!!!!

Its really pissing me off this will of the people shit

We need to keep repeating our argument every time somebody comes up with this crappy line.

"1) Post the EURef, both main parties went completely Wibbly for the apparently Overwhelming Will of the People narrative, having invented some modern mathematics/biology synthesis which meant that 52% = 100%, and that 48% = chopped liver."
TheElementsSong (anything to do with the Periodic Table, btw?) I love the way you put it - and also, people seem to forget that just before the referendum, FUKIParage had already started making moves to say that if the vote was as close as 48% to 52% (in favour of Remain, though), the country should NOT abide by the Will of the People - I thing he even went as far as to set up a petition to this effect? Conveniently forgot it when the results were confirmed.

I voted in the highest remain seat in the country which returned a remain anti Corbyn Labour MP on an increase of 30%

How does that mean we voted to leave?

The Tories did better than many Labour Governments did. This is our system. If you don't like it push for proportional representation as people have been doing for 50 years.

Our system seems to be the best we can come up with and it works pretty well. Labour did not win. Didn't May get more votes than Blair for example when he won?
The Tories received more votes than in the 2015 and 2010 elections.

"But despite losing 12 seats and their overall majority, the Conservatives polled 13.7 million votes yesterday compared to 11.3 million votes two years ago when they secured 330 seats and 10.7 million in 2010 when they ended 13 years of Labour rule by becoming the largest party with 306 seats and formed a coalition government with Nick Clegg’s Lib Dems.

Mrs May’s Tories took 42.2 per cent of the vote this time round, again a marked improvement on the previous two elections which saw and just 36.9 per cent in 2015 and 36.1 per cent in 2010.

Astonishingly, this was only slightly less than the 43.9 per cent achieved by Margaret Thatcher in the groundbreaking 1979 election when the Tories trounced Labour, gaining 63 seats as they raced to a total of 339 and a working majority of 43."

After catching up on the business op ed pages from yesterday's Times (behind the paywall or I would link), Paul Johnson from the IFS is essentially in agreement with the thread title that the best Parliament, when there is no consensus, is a hung Parliament. "Too much new policy is bad policy".

Dumdedum yes, it's the marvellous Tom Lehrer's (Harvard mathematician and musician!) song about the chemical elements .

The thing is, every person in the country could have voted to remain in the single market whilst also ditching freedom of movement, and we'd still have no chance whatsoever of getting it.

TheElementsSong: "3) Conveniently for Brexiteers, this leads to a "Heads I win, tails you lose" situation. Because now any election result anywhere on the Red->Blue spectrum = The People Voted For Brexit."

Exactly so! The convoluted logic of the pro-Brexit mob as they try to pretend this was a vote for Brexit is quite something. I don't know who they're trying to convince - themselves or everyone else. Or perhaps both.

I live in a constituency with a Tory MP. He was a Remainer, but a few months ago said he would now be a firm supporter of Brexit. This is possibly because he is a breathtakingly cynical opportunist even by the usual Tory standards. The Labour candidate was pro Remain, though the party nationally now seems to be committed vaguely to Brexit, as far as I can see. The smaller parties were never really going to have a look in. If you were a Remain supporter, it's hard to see what your options were.

My feeling is that a lot of the Labour vote came from people who wanted to reverse cuts to the NHS, education and the police and who were also attracted to the tuition fees pledge.

A couple of months ago they finally had a vote in parliament about triggering article 50

This was a chance for mps to say what they thought

But they didnt, they just said what they were told to

Rufus, yes, it was disappointing to see so many MP's voting against their better judgement.

I now find myself nodding along to politicians like Ken Clarke and Michael Heseltine - old Tory Dinosaurs who I had no time for 20 years ago. Such a confusing time.

I haven't checked it out in detail, but heard headlines this morning of a cross-party collaboration for Brexit negotiations. This is what is needed. If we are going to do the bloody brexit and shoot ourselves in the foot economically for the next three decades - then lets at least have our best people working on it, regardless of political party. Hopefully, Brexit will be softer now. I'm still hoping for a EEA.

shoes

I would love cross party talks on brexit

I voted remain....we are leaving, fair enough (i still think its a fucking stupid idea but its done now)

But within days all the backbiting started

All the suck it up and will of the people

Its not a fucking sport...there are no teams (contrary to what some fuckwits believe)

The country would have pulled together on june the 24th if the main parties had worked together, if leave and remain had worked together

The media and the two main parties decided to divide and conquer , they have split the country in two . Egged on by cheerleading trolls

Well they fucked up, and they are still fucking up

You know what, rufus, for months I've been watching open-mouthed in horror at TM marching headlong into a Hard Brexit on the mandate of 52% of the vote.

You're so right - it's not a sport, and it's not winner takes all. We have a Parliamentary democracy, and it's up to them to sort this out now - using their best judgement, and keeping best interests of the country at the forefront.

I was still expecting the expected tory landslide until 10pm on Thurs when the exit polls came out. I am so bloody happy she didn't get her massive majority - now she'll have to be a bit more careful about lots of things - cuts, austerity, brexit.

I still don't want brexit at all - but hell, if we must, then let's try not to fuck it up so monumentally.

I completely agree shoe

I'll never understand why so many people say Brexit is a stupid idea and we will all be poorer for generations but hey let's do it anyway. What a bunch of lemmings. Fight it if you think it's a crap idea. If all the people saying they thinks it's crap took a remain line there would be a stronger public support for remain. The Brexit must happen now talk is a self fulfilling prophecy.

I know people will say "democracy" but there is plenty of evidence that the vote was flawed and poorly executed and campaign bordering on fraudulent. The case can be made if people can stop being sheep.

The case can be made if people can stop being sheep

I beg your pardon sheep?

A couple of months ago they finally had a vote in parliament about triggering article 50
This was a chance for mps to say what they thought
But they didn't, they just said what they were told to

This REALLY pissed me off, because MPs didn't vote in line with their constituencies (yes Anne Main I'm talking about YOU!). This constituency voted 67% to remain in the EU referendum, so did our MP voted against the triggering of Article 50? Did she fuck! She voted in support of it. Why do we bother having elected respresentatives who don't represent our views? And as for all the twats who returned her to parliament last Thurs - I have no words.

I presumed by sheep she meant Remainers who don't think it's a good idea and possibly Leavers who've now changed their minds, but are going along with what everyone else thinks. Rather than Leavers per se. Personally I do distinguish between the true believers and those who are going along with it. As Ken Clarke said.

Re MPs representing their constituents views, tricky issue. The question of whether your MP owes you their judgement or their best reflection of their views has never been settled.

Yeah i got that dog

Interestingly both the new French President and the German Finance Minister have said that the door is still open to reverse Brexit. I'd rather got the impression they wanted us to pack up and leave asap. www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/politics/brexit-uk-remain-macron-latest-comments-theresa-may-eu-uk-membership-talks-end-a7788616.html

They don't want us to leave - they want a united Europe, politically and economically. The get a bit shitty about us voting to leave, sometimes, but that's hardly surprising.

Middle, my hope is still alive. It is like the tiny white flutter at the bottom of Pandora's Box - but it's still there somewhere It ain't over till the fat lady sings.