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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

AIBU to feel like giving up on the UK

171 replies

Fairysnuff321 · 26/05/2017 09:36

My OH is EU born, but has been living here with me and working , paying tax (go those who read the Daily Mail this may shock you)for 20 yrs. He has started his own business and is well respected in his industry. I've always worked in advocacy/counselling/support jobs, I am struggling to get back into work despite years of experience and training because of the lack of funding for these services.

I feel like accepting we have to leave the UK for the sake of our DD. I know so many people in this situation, and feel really sad that every day I hear stories like this...
"I work in the City as does my French partner: the European bankers, lawyers and asset managers are all talking about how London has changed for them now and are thinking it may be time to head home."
My husband feels the same.

OP posts:
lessworriedaboutthecat · 26/05/2017 10:49

I think Russia no offence to any Russians is on a whole different level of racism to most other places.

QuietCorday · 26/05/2017 10:49

"I work in the City as does my French partner: the European bankers, lawyers and asset managers are all talking about how London has changed for them now and are thinking it may be time to head home."

A Marxist may very well say that these people have taken advantage of an extraordinary situation whereby enormous capital flows have been allowed to free cross national borders without impunity to the detriment of workers outside the capitalist class.

In short, these people are the ones that have got fat off the cream of an almost anarcho-capitalist paradigm, and now that paradigm is changing. Considering that the paradigm lead to a scenario where profits were privatised and losses socialised, that Marxist may very well just say these people were a bunch of exploitative parasites on the back of European workers and those parasites are now upset that the party has ended.

I'm not a Marxist, but sometimes looking at situations from that perspective is rather interesting.

But I will say that London does not exist for the benefit and lifestyle riches of a transient global capitalist class. It is the capital of Britain, not a Monaco on the Thames.

Did it ever occur to any of these people that the thousands of British Londoners, many who have been driven out of the capital by the high cost of living, may have spent the last twenty years distressed at how their London was changing? Supercars racing down streets outside their homes, their quirky markets turned into corporate money pits, their areas gentrified into soulless wastelands of glass where hundreds of new build apartments stay dark night after night and are nothing more than a place for the global wealthy to park their money? Or their homes compulsory purchased from under their feet and the new development marketed to investors in the Far East?

HeyHoThereYouGo657 · 26/05/2017 10:50

Sad to hear that happened to you Mission .

PushingThru · 26/05/2017 10:50

I didn't suggest there is a utopia, merely better places - stop creating false binaries - the OP mentions her partner is French, so obviously I, and she, meant there.

seoulsurvivor · 26/05/2017 10:52

allegretto sounds like she was giving some examples to me.

A super liberal german friend of mine said she didn't want her kids going to a majority Turkish school because her kids would end up not speaking German properly. We were in a group of social workers, teachers and other generally liberal types who are very supportive of refugees and so on. I thought they would scold her and I was quite shocked when no one even raised an eyebrow. I don't think that would fly in the UK, not among educated, liberal people.

There always seems to me to be in Europe there is more acceptance of other races in terms of not minding them being there, but also a feeling of those people never being fully European or of that country. I'd say the majority of British people would accept English-speaking people who have grown up in the UK as British, no matter the colour of their skin.

NoLoveofMine · 26/05/2017 10:52

The reason I mentioned it was to highlight how different racism is across countries.

I completely agree. Although any racism is too much and can't be tolerated, I do think people who talk about how horrendous this country is and insinuate European countries are free of racism (when there's far more racism in them, and this country has, happily, far more variation in cultures and backgrounds amongst the people within it) are completely wrong.

Clandestino · 26/05/2017 10:54

but how on Earth would life have changed since Brexit for anyone working in the city as a banker, lawyer or asset manager?

JP Morgan are opening new office in Dublin. Several European agencies are moving out from London, taking with them more than 800 jobs directly (and let's not forget the indirectly connected jobs, such as catering, cleaners, transport, schools etc.).
If someone is still saying that Brexit will not change the face of the City or of London, they must be extremely deluded.

allegretto · 26/05/2017 10:55

allegretto sounds like she was giving some examples to me.

Yes, I know but when I comment on a person's post, I only refer to what that person posts. It's not fair (and rather non-sensical) to criticize my post as being ironic because OTHER people have at some time made generalizations.

mynotsoperfectlife · 26/05/2017 10:55

Interesting post, Quiet; thank you.

Cantseethewoods · 26/05/2017 10:57

Those French bankers will be going anywhere but back to France. Loads of them parked up in HK, taking advantage of a 15% tax rate. Mind you, HK has plenty of problems of its own so let's see.

PushingThru · 26/05/2017 10:58

"But I will say that London does not exist for the benefit and lifestyle riches of a transient global capitalist class. It is the capital of Britain, not a Monaco on the Thames."

London hasn't been the cultural capital of the UK since the 90s. I wouldn't live anywhere else in Britain though. Vast swathes of the rest of the country have been transformed into sheer wasteland and still the pitiful cunts go out and dutifully vote tory and brexit Just get out of this godforsaken place while you can.

MissionItsPossible · 26/05/2017 11:04

JP Morgan are opening new office in Dublin. Several European agencies are moving out from London, taking with them more than 800 jobs directly (and let's not forget the indirectly connected jobs, such as catering, cleaners, transport, schools etc.).
If someone is still saying that Brexit will not change the face of the City or of London, they must be extremely deluded.

Again, this refers to uncertainty. People are uncertain about their jobs. People are uncertain about what the future holds. Uncertainty. I get it.

Cities and countries change all the time. London in the 50s is not like what London is now. I get it. But people are saying that since the referendum London has changed and what I would like to know which nobody has been able to give me an answer to (because one most likely doesn't exist) is how exactly London is different post referendum than it was pre-referendum. What changes have occurred? Why is it no longer "the place that it was". Why was it a different place on June 23rd than it is now since June 24th?

HeyHoThereYouGo657 · 26/05/2017 11:06

Thanks for that allegretto !

Possibly because I am dyslexic but hey, carry on !

allegretto · 26/05/2017 11:07

Why was it a different place on June 23rd than it is now since June 24th?

  • Uncertainty is one of the reasons why it is perceived as being different - it can make our outlook more negative. And yes, I know that perception is subjective but that doesn't mean it doesn't count.
  • increase in racism post- Brexit. Whether or not you are a victim, the knowledge that it has increased, again makes you feel more ill at ease.
www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/crime/brexit-hate-crimes-racism-eu-referendum-vote-attacks-increase-police-figures-official-a7358866.html
artycakemaker · 26/05/2017 11:08

My SIL who works in HR for a major institution has been told she and her entire team are being moved to Paris to start managing the complete withdrawal of said institution.

That's not uncertain, that's pretty specific. And she is not one of those greedy bankers either. Middle management.

PushingThru · 26/05/2017 11:09

This reply has been deleted

Message deleted by MNHQ. Here's a link to our Talk Guidelines.

allegretto · 26/05/2017 11:10

Possibly because I am dyslexic but hey, carry on !

Oh sorry, you attacked me. I pointed it out but I shouldn't have done because I didn't know you're dyslexic? What has that got to do with making an unfounded statement about me. No matter, I won't make it again. Hey, carry on.

MissionItsPossible · 26/05/2017 11:11

Because the gross, the thick, the bigoted and those who revel in their own ignorance reckon they're running the place now and are letting it known. I suppose we should all just wait patiently for these thick, fat wastes of oxygen to slither off back to their stinking prole holes and let decent people live, right?

Someone certainly sounds gross, thick and bigoted!

LittleKiwi · 26/05/2017 11:12

We've left (we're both Irish). No regrets. Sad, but there you go.

Brexit, increase in outspoken racism/xenophobia and constant talk of "scroungers", political situation being so dire with no prospect of improvement, cost of housing in the SE, lifestyle in the SE (or lack thereof), lack of jobs outside the SE (for us, anyway) were all contributing factors but of course the deciding factor was a good job coming up somewhere else we wanted to move to.

Clandestino · 26/05/2017 11:16

But people are saying that since the referendum London has changed and what I would like to know which nobody has been able to give me an answer to (because one most likely doesn't exist) is how exactly London is different post referendum than it was pre-referendum. What changes have occurred?

Feeling of uncertainty isn't enough for you to create a change in atmosphere? I'd be fucking feeling like a big change if I were living somewhere where my job is very likely threatened by a move to a another country. Even if I were a cleaner or owned a sandwich shop somewhere in the City.

PushingThru · 26/05/2017 11:17

Did you go back to Ireland, LittleKiwi?

EssentialHummus · 26/05/2017 11:20

Very simply OP, do what's best for you and your family and please don't feel you need to justify yourself on here or elsewhere. We're in a similar situation and it's an incredibly difficult decision to make.

MissionItsPossible · 26/05/2017 11:21

Feeling of uncertainty isn't enough for you to create a change in atmosphere? I'd be fucking feeling like a big change if I were living somewhere where my job is very likely threatened by a move to a another country. Even if I were a cleaner or owned a sandwich shop somewhere in the City.

Not really no, and I'm not being flippant about this either, maybe it's just my personality and the way I look at life. Life is an uncertainty. From the minute you wake up... or even if you do wake up at all. And yes I would feel stressed but it wouldn't make me look around my city and think "This has changed. It wasn't like this before June 24th".

allegretto · 26/05/2017 11:23

it wouldn't make me look around my city and think "This has changed. It wasn't like this before June 24th".

What would? I'm not sure I understand you. Obviously the geography doesn't change overnight but prevalent attitudes can and do change the way you see where you live.

pilates · 26/05/2017 11:26

Fairy, where is this wonderful country you are thinking of going to which will be better than the UK, just wondering?

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