To think SAHM should get priority over childminders at busy toddler groups?

[HulkMama]

Just wondering how people feel about childminders taking groups of children to a free toddler group that routinely turns stay at home mums away because they are full?

It's a church run group so they don't want to turn anyone away, I get that, but if there isn't room for everyone should childminders be taking up the places that parents with their own kids need?

Childminders are being paid to look after the kids! I just want to get out of the house and have a bit of adult conversation!

Comments from childminders welcome. 😉

What about parents who work?, should they be denied entry because they can afford to pay for other groups?

If you can't get in, try another group or start your own if you can.

If it's a first come, first serve sort of thing, hang around the door till someone else gets kicked out and see if they want to go to the park with you and the kids.

But Owl the parent has the small child all day and all night

Exactly. Many child minders also are parents and are doing rhe role for that reason. They also have young kids and have them all day and night.

Riversleep I don't think children's centres are 'meant' solely for low income families are they? Where I live I've seen the opposite and people think that they can't go if they work. In any case I've been going to ours for 3.5 years and have never had to tell them what our income is so I don't see how they could know how wealthy anyone is! They mainly want to be full.

I'm amazed that there are so many SAHPs where you live op. In all of my group of friends/acquaintance I only know 4 including me. There's no way our local toddler groups could manage with only SAHPs, it usually ends up a third to a half cms and the rest grandparents and parents, with a very small % of those SAHPs. Often the cm represent way over a third to a half of the dc which is where there has sometimes been a problem where you pay by adult rather than dc in groups where every pound counts.

I've been pondering this, and am now wondering if all the times I went to these groups I was abusing the service as I was one of the mums who didn't want to make any new friends, I did not once see it as a benefit to me, I purely went for the dc.

So I wonder, with all this talk of who should get priority and what the group's are really intended for, if I would have been expected to give my place up to a sahm who wanted to use it for the social aspects for themselves?

Neo- oh so because some people are not kind, inclusive and welcoming of me once they discover I'm a childminder I should be banned from going?
How about we encourage people to break the barriers and accept EVERYONE. If someone is at a toddler group is it because they think it will benefit either their children, or themselves. No one would go if they didn't think they were getting something from it. So is everyone who attends selfish?
My anecdote highlights the lack of acceptance and threads like this certainly don't help.

My DDs go to groups with their lovely childminder. Why should my children have to miss out on groups because me and my DH have to work? Ridiculous! These groups are for children not adults

But equally for some of the examples here, why should three childminders be able to fill an activity group on their own then pay so little that the course isn't even self funding?

Dubious admittedly, this was a few years ago as my kids are thankfully too old for this nonsense now, but it was a childrens centre group advertised to be to help parents with EAL, and more specifically the Somali community in the area. They closed it because none of them came.

I was being flippant about the tax return but if you want to ban one group, then you cant really complain if you are banned for other reasons, which a lot of the mums who could well afford to pay to go to a group were doing.

It should be first come first served. So if you're late, you miss out regardless of status

I attended a group similar to the one teaspotter describes. There was a waiting list and places were allocated when spaces came up. I never discussed the exact allocation with the staff but there 1/2 of the group were childminders and 1/2 group were parents or grandparents. Thus dynamic worked well. My DC played with all of the children and I had contact with both groups. Because there was a register I could turn up when I was ready and anyone who didn't go for three weeks without saying they would be away lost their place. The childminders I spoke to were a great source of info for local child-friendly cafes and events. I'll admit there were some who seemed to ignore the kids a bit and chat amongst themselves but there were a few parents like that too!

My suggestion to OP is to chat to the organisers and see if there is such demand whether or not a different group could be arranged or the session divided into two sessions. Our local children's centre had to do this when they were turning too many people away.

These groups are for children not adults

Indeed. But apparently the children of SAHMs are more important than your children. It's another way of proposing that women who are mothers and work outside the home are somehow not "proper" mothers, and their children of lesser value.

The groups are not for children rather than adults.

I belong to a childminding group and we meet twice a week in a village hall. We pay for the let of the hall and are fine with that. The children we look after have parents who pay tax - some of which subsidises the free toddlers sessions within the same building. We set up our own group because we were fed up with SOME of the SAHP at the free sessions. We knew we were being judged if we had the audacity to chat and any bad behaviour from the children we looked after was deemed to be because they weren't with their own parent and we didn't really care as long as we got peace.

They forgot we were the ones turning up year after year while they would come along for a year or two then stop when their kids were old enough to move on to nursery. I look after one child - shortage of work in the area at the moment - so earn nowhere near minimum wage. Should people like me be expected to stay away from groups because we're paid £4.50 an hour (less expenses) . I love my work and believe parents use a cm because they want a home from home experience.

In our village the free sessions are now down to two a week from five because of dwindling numbers. We've had parents asking if they can come to our group to get company for themselves and their children.

There is a certain type of parent who have the - oh you're just the cm mentality - we care about the children and take them out to let them socialise with others. Get yourself to the group earlier or start your own group somewhere you don't have to brave public transport and queues.

It works for us!

I think it depends on the group to be honest. I used to help run one that was staffed by volunteers, we relied on a parents rota to get the hall shipshape at the end of the session. The childminders refused to go on the rota, which annoyed the others attending, especially the parents who had more than one child at the session and who were happy to play their part on the rota every couple of months. Eventually we offered the childminders the opportunity to run their own sessions and to hire all our toys and equipment. They jumped at the chance, despite the fact that it made a lot more work for them. I never managed to work out the logic of that.

Ultimately it is up to the organisers of the groups as to who that group is aimed at and who they let in. If the church really wants to provide a group for disadvantaged SAHMs then it is up to them to limit access to those people. Since they aren't limiting access to SAHMs or parents only, and operating a simple first come first served policy, then one can assume they intend their service to be available for all. It is therefore pointless to argue on an internet forum about who should not be allowed to attend.

BTW, most church groups are run neither 'for the children' nor 'for the parents'. They are run to satisfy the church's requirements for social outreach, spreading the word, and to encourage new church members.

But equally for some of the examples here, why should three childminders be able to fill an activity group on their own then pay so little that the course isn't even self funding?
That is for the organisers to work out. They should have priced the activity accordingly. The fact that three CMs were able to come and fill the group so that it wasn't self-funding shows that the organisers either didn't mind or were very naïve and will have learned a valuable lesson about pricing.

I'm amazed that some people seem to think that CMs should self-police these toddler groups to ensure that everyone except for themselves and their charges can go.

Disclaimer: I am neither a CM nor have I ever used the services of one.

I would suggest the church group charge a small fee this might put the child minders off a bit. If they are paying for umpteen children. Their must clearly be a demand for other sessions in your area

Yabu.

I'm a home Edder so we get bummed in plenty of ways already but toddler groups don't seem to affect us.. however.. I can see Ops point.
Childminder gets tots dropped off. Older siblings are dropped at breakfast club. SAHM drops older ones at school to arrive at playgroup with childminders already queuing. SAHM can't get there any sooner due to school drop off times.
I do recall going to a group once that always had 11 childminded children in the queue before any mum's had a chance to get there.

Having a nanny or sending your child to a childminder is about having as close to a home environment as possible. It seems to me as others have said you should arrive earlier. Do you really we should start discriminating against certain groups of people??

WOW!!!!! Just WOW! Another situation where people who work are shoved down in priorities for those who do not work! I am speechless! I haven't read all the comments (my blood was boiling too much) so apologies if thisbhas already been said but.. ....what about those childminders are also SAHM working from home?! I am very interested why you feel you are more important than other people and children who have as much right as you to socialise?!?! I can't imagine why you dont have a circle of friends to socialise with?!

Why would you think that? YABVU.

I got together with a group of friends who had babies and we met in each other's home once a week, rotating it round.
Didn't bother then with toddlers groups.

HULK - nobody forced you to have a child