Childcare issues, I'm quite upset by this, but think I may be in need of a grip?

[ChildcareWoe]

Long story short, I've recently gone back to work and have employed a family member (A) as a nanny/mother's help.

It's come to light recently, that on occasion, A's mother basically hijacks A's time with my DD (that I am paying for) and they all go on a family day out with me being none the wiser.

When I twigged what was going on, I asked A directly and there was a really awkward silence until she 'admitted' what was going on. She is a kind and sweet-natured young woman and I hate that she had been put in this position

As you've probably guessed there is back story between me and A's mother, she is quite a strong, dominant character and treats me (and if I'm honest, A too) as though she were in some way in charge of us. She adopts a dismissive and high handed attitude with me which makes our relationship quite difficult if I 'step out of line'.

I think she is making her arrangements to see my DD (whom in fairness she adores) through A rather than me, as to ask my permission directly would requite some humility on her part, recognising my status as DD mother, and that just doesn't fit with the dynamic between the two of us.

I'm quite upset by this and think she should make her arrangements to see DD via me, not through A, but I am not sure how reasonable I am being by getting all worked up about this...

The thing is, if she ever did ask my permission, I would gladly give it and I'm sure they would have a lovely time, so the end result would be the same. I have no issues at all with the standard of care given by either A or her mother and, most importantly, DD has a whale of a time. It's just me with the issue

So what should I do? Apart from this, the whole childcare arrangement is working out so well for everyone else, I wonder if I shouldn't just suck it up for the benefit of DD? It is essentially DD having a day out with family members who love her, so what's the harm?

I'm so cross that I've been put in this position though, all it would have taken was a quick call or text to run the plans past me, but instead I feel like arrangements for my DD have been taken out of my hands.

So, do I get over myself, or say something and risk spoiling both the relationship between DD and this side of my family, and also potentially my childcare arrangements?

Is this happening every time A is in charge? Because if so that would concern me, is A not sufficiently confident or competent to have your DC alone?

If it's only occasionally, that would worry me less but I would still expect to be told in advance where my child was and critically who was driving them.

A should be asking your permission to take your child somewhere out of the ordinary by the way, not her Mother.

I think your op was very balanced.

I totally get why this has bothered you. I would feel annoyed at their deceit. Presumably A would normally tell you what she'd done with DD in the day, so she was dishonest on the days she'd been out with her Mum.

Having said all that on balance I think you should put DD first and let the trips continue.

Agree with wording of first poster. I would also say that you expect her to run it by you first in future.

What would happen if you asked A's mother why she didnt ask you if it was ok for her to take your DD out.

Because if she is the sort of person she sounds like (I know one of those, but thankfully not in my family anymore) it is just as much about getting one over on you and proving her position as it is about seeing your DD.

I completely understand why you have a problem with it.

I'm sorry if I've missed it, but what have you said to A about it?

The trouble is, this is the latest in a long line of similar situations in which various family members have behaved in an objectively awful manner, yet it always seems to be my fault for calling them on it.

It sounds like A is lovely but to be honest, if your extended family is this difficult then perhaps paying a family member to provide childcare isn't the best idea.

Is the childminder a niece and the mum your sister?

Sorry I can't move on until I understand who these family members are.

It kind of is A's fault though - she needs to say things like 'we'd planned to go swimming/trampolining/ skydiving, let me just run the change of plans past baby's mum'.

I get other's points re not knowing where you child is at every moment if they're in childcare but equally I see what you're saying (splinters in bum from fence!).

If it were me I might be tempted to book a few classes that A and baby attend regularly in order to empower A to be the decision maker and give her a reason to say no to her mother if this is what you and she prefer.

I think you need to make it clear to A that she needs to keep you informed of what activities/outings she will doing with your child. YANBU

I would have to point out that A is being paid to work looking after your child, not to have days out with her Mum. That is what annual leave and weekends are for. Further, if your DD is not where you expect her to be, you need to be asked, and you need to know who is driving and what kind of car seat is being used.

You may have to revisit your childcare arrangements if this continues, and YANBU.

I see where you're coming from but from a slightly different perspective.

The fact that A's mother is seeking to see your child without your knowledge is worrying. I would be putting a stop to that, regardless of their relationship. That's manipulative and wrong.

As someone with toxic relatives, where my poor Mum had to do a lot of unpicking of nonsense I was spun, keep a very close eye on this

I'd be annoyed with a. She's in a position of trust and a paid one at that. You have to have total honesty from someone looking after your child and she's lied by omission.

I can see why this rankles. Your nanny clearly realises she is being expected to keep quiet about the trips with her mother. If she is in charge of your DD, then she should certainly be open and honest with you about what is going on.

It sounds like A's mother is quite a strong character, and A does not want to stand up to her in this.

You need to let A know, that if her mother asks her to go out with your DD, in future, she needs to let you know, otherwise it is a betrayal of your trust, and you really need to be able to trust your nanny.

It's not the fact that they are going out together, it's the withholding of the information from you.

I completely understand where you are coming from and would be upset in the same position, that said I think MrsBellefleur hit the nail on the head with how to tackle this.

Also, you said you would like to have a better relationship with A's mother. Maybe she can sense that you are uncomfortable around her but doesn't know why and so feels this is an easier way for her to see your DD? Why don't you phone As' mother and tell her you are aware what a lovely time your daughter has when she sees her and could you arrange something for when you can be there as you aswell because you would really like to join in and get to know her/her side of the family better?

I have to agree with a PP who said that given you know that your family do not respect your boundaries, choosing one of them (albeit one of the nice ones) as your childcare was not a good idea.

Whatever you do now is going to cause fall out.

A) you do nothing and have no trust in your childcare
B) you tell A's mother and A that this arrangement cannot continue and there is a huge blow up
C) you terminate A's employment and there is a huge blow up.

Personally I would go for C because then at least there is a clean break and your DD wont be caught in the middle.

If somone is looking after your child, as a job, I think it's fine to expect them to give you some idea of their movements. Not a minute by minute schedule and who they are seeing but "we are thinking of the zoo in Bristol on Thursday". I wouldn't be happy to find out weeks later that my child was taken to the zoo, soft play etc Not saying she took your child to Bristol zoo but any trips out of the mundane everyday schedule should be mentioned.

I've used a nursery and got weekly reports, including naps, food ate, what they got up to.

Is it possible to introduce some kind of daily or weekly conversation about what they've been up to.

How do you know the mother is taking over though? I get you are knarked but abc I mean this constructively op if you have this similar situations with other family members coukd you be a bit overly touchy?

Absolutely not saying you are just looking all round the issue.

And remember your dd is happy having a ball and you trust these adults.

Another angle is it possible that A S mother is trying to make up with you through your dd?

Navy she didnt say that she wanted A's mother to go cap in hand, but that that is how A's mother would view it. She said that asking for permission is something A's mother will never do as she hates handing power to someone else. There is a power game but it isnt the OP that is playing it.

And if it was no problem, why did A make a point of not telling the OP?

I would expect my nanny to tell me if my child was going on a day out and would be very annoyed if they were keeping anything deliberately secret from me. I think the fact that they are family is a red herring.

A is your employee and should be asking you for permission for all significant outings that your child is to go on. If A gets a request from her mother for an outing you should tell her that A's mother needs to deal with you about this. If you put some formality into the situation it makes more sense.

I only meant if you're paying then surely you also have the express right to say what happens, regardless of whether it's family or not?

If A's mother is stepping in and taking over, what are you paying A for? Is she using that money to pay for their family days out?

I'm a Nanny and while the boys are in my care, I have to take them to prepare approved and booked activities as well as parks, messy play etc at home. I'd be sacked for taking them on a day out with my family who then took care of the boys.

You're paying her to do a job which she sounds like she isn't doing properly. If you had a Nanny or childminder or Nursery would you accept it from them?

Nothing good comes from paying family or lending money to them.

YANBU.

But I do think you are minimizing A's role in all of this. She is the paid CM and you should have been able to expect honesty from her. She has deliberately gone behind your back and tried to cover up who your DD was spending time with and what they were doing, The fact that you would have been happy to agree doesn't really make a difference - you were not asked, you were not given a choice and both of them have undermined by not respecting your status as the mother.

I should say I have had experience of toxic family relations so I am perhaps being a bit harsh, but I would be holding both of them accountable for their unacceptable behavior. There is a clear lack of respect and that is fundamentally the problem here.