To want to bang my head against a wall. Why don't people understand they're voting for a party, not a person?!?!

[mrsw14]

AAAGGGHHHHHH!!! I really could scream, I'm so sick of people saying they can't bring themselves to vote Labour because they don't like Jeremy Corbyn. Oh ok, so condemn us to 5 more years of Tory hell instead because you don't like 1 bloke you've never met
It's the PARTY that would be running the country, not one man and god knows what will happen in the future, the leader of the party can change!
Sorry, it just infuriates me that people can't see the bigger picture

YANBU. I don't like the far right Tory camp. I'm a centrist and would rather vote for leftist policies.

I can see the bigger picture thanks. I also, believe it or not, understand how voting in this country works (the very thought...). It still doesn't change the fact that the Labour Party Leader, who would also be PM, is completely incompetent. His shadow cabinet is incompetent and therefore the party is unlikely to be elected.

Billsykesdog: Why would I ask a teacher or a nurse or a police officer who I would vote for? Why would I limit myself to voting in the interests of a few groups who want policies which benefit them but might not be particularly interested in policies that benefit the rest of society?

Do t you think they are pretty clued up on what is happening in the rest of society? Most of us are pretty restricted in our experience of the world. We tend to gather in groups of 'people like us'. Teachers Nurses and Police officers see all kinds of people, and generally are invested in a better overall society.

mrs You do know who introduced tuition fees in the first place? That was Labour. You do know who introduced private finance into the NHS? That was Labour.

Quite honestly, the NHS is in shit street no matter which Government wins because the strains on it are too much.

You think Labour is going to solve the NHS? When NO previous Government has? The NHS has to change big time but no one seems to want to grasp that nettle. If we want to continue a free-at-the-point-of-use NHS then a shed load of money needs throwing at it and it needs reorganising.

Labour cannot fund the NHS and education as they say they should or that the public wants without increasing income tax. Which is not a vote winner, sadly. Indeed, they've already said they won't increase tax except for the top 5% and that won't raise anywhere near enough.

Our labour MP is not a Corbynite and has done his literature without a single mention of Corbyn. He has focused on local issues and his own record.
I'm voting for him because he is a brilliant local MP and because I think we need an opposition party and at some point ( hopefully sooner rather than later) Labour will have to regroup and work out their issues and they will need decent MPs to do that.

Picklemepopcorn I don't think that gives nurses, teachers and police officers a better view on how our society should be run. I generally find that they are lacking in economic experience which is crucial to running a successful country.

OP you 'spoke to someone who knows him' and it helped you form an opinion. Great for you i'm sure and very helpful. Not necessarily unbiased mind you. And not exactly practical for the whole of the country to speak to someone who knows him.

The point still stands - people see and hear JC and DA on the media and they form their opinions of them. Not good ones on the whole. Even if he is amazing, it's no good being a wonderful politician if you can't seem to get the majority to see it? He's NOT popular. He's dragging the party down. The labor party are leaving him where he is for a general election. It's their own damn fault that they'll loose.

Do t you think they are pretty clued up on what is happening in the rest of society? Most of us are pretty restricted in our experience of the world. We tend to gather in groups of 'people like us'. Teachers Nurses and Police officers see all kinds of people, and generally are invested in a better overall society

I find this comment very depressing. In my view, this is one of the ways the LP has gone wrong - this view that the "masses" just don't know what's in their best interests, and need to be educated and told how to think by their betters.

Well techniquely you are voting for a person - your local candidate - not a party, a government or a PM. Yes they do wear a badge for the party they sign up to. However, if Labour formed a majority their leader would run the country. And it really does matter that Corbyn, McDonnell, Diane Abbott et al would be as disastrous at that as they are as an opposition.

Its a terrible choice this election. May will win but our democracy will be the weaker for having such a weak and incompetent opposition to hold her government to account. Makes the days of coalition look like a walk in the park.

What BillSykesDog said.

Also I'm married to a police officer. He wants neither. Unfortunately that's how a lot of people feel. I think politics in this country are all sorts of broken.

I don't like Corbyns, Abotts or McDonalds policies/plans so I won't vote labour because of them. To left for me.

I don't have loyalty to one party. I vote depending on what policies I agree with. (Except SNP. Will never vote for them)

I feel that things work best when the parties switch regularly. When Tony Blair got in with his landslide the tories jad been in power for a decade. Then Cameron got in and Tories will probably be in power for best part of decade. It will then switch back to labour. (Unless a new party emerges) I think this keeps a strong opposition which our system needs.

One party can't be in power for too long.

It's not just Corbyn is it. It's the whole machinery behind him that pushed him to prominence along with Abbott et al. The Labour Party seems so out of touch with its core voters at the moment. Corbyn is not a man of the people, he is as much part of the Westminster establishment as the next person and yet the party chose him, so that means he fits the Labour party's view of itself. Corbyn is how the Labour Party has chosen to present itself to the country.

OP stop being so patronising about voters. Labour members/voters who still cling to the current leadership need to get real: they are unelectable.

I am a public sector worker from a large family of public sector workers. Obviously no fan of the Tories.

Corbyn is not electable. Now is his senior team. He comes across badly in speeches and interviews. The MPs have no confidence in him. He and the leadership were shit during the referendum and have been poor opposition to the Tories, when opposition has been much needed. The party is divided and the leadership is determined by people with views at odds with the electorate.

I don't like any of the candidates for election or the parties, so voting will be fun . All of them are just out for themselves, regardless of how pretty sure their words may try to be.

In my view, this is one of the ways the LP has gone wrong - this view that the "masses" just don't know what's in their best interests, and need to be educated and told how to think by their betters.

This in spades.

Sometimes people are being polite and giving a glib answer because they don't like being browbeaten.

There's been a lot of bullying and demonization in politics lately, it's possible for people to get tired of being called a monster or a nazi because of how they want the deficit or our relationship with the EU handled.

Am I supposed to ignore the fact that Corbyn indulges antisemitism and cosies up to terrorists for a pose?
I was tempted to vote Labour despite him but I disagree with my local Labour MP on a local issue so, no , I can't vote for Labour on policy or personality.
And you are naive, op , if you think personality is irrelevant. Sounds pretty desperate to me.

Personally I think it's idiotic to blindly vote for the party you always have even though it has zero credible leadership. Of course the party is made up of many who would be 'leading the country' but if the few at the helm couldn't organise a piss up in a brewery why would this be ok??

I don't mean to be patronising and I'm certainly not saying that every Tory voter is voting so because they dislike Jeremy Corbyn. However, I'm seeing time and time again a huge amount of people on here, on other forums, on social media clearly stating that they are not voting for Labour simply because they don't like him. Fair enough, if you base that opinion on facts. However, the fact is that many aren't doing that and I am allowed to find that frustrating.
I have personally suffered from Tory cuts, as have many around me and I will never understand the mentality of those who vote the Tories back in having already personally suffered and knowing they'll continue to suffer, just because they're not a Corbyn fan.

But VivienneWestwoodsKnickers, electing a Conservative MP to Westminister isn't going to add to the opposition in Holywood, is it? I get that it may "send a message" to the SNP, so I do understand your parent's dilemna, and I could understand voting for a Conservative MSP in the Scottish election.
The Conservatives are keen to conflate the two though, as they know it works to their advantage. The leaflets through my door have a big picture of Davidson, and heavily feature the issue of independance, without addressing many other issues well at all (including Brexit). It was the same before the council elections as well - very little mention of local issues, just playing up to Ruth Davidson's (effective) opposition in Holywood.

But if anything a huge Tory majority in Westminister, pushing through with an extreme version of Brexit (and even maybe no deal!), is going to make another referendum, and a Yes vote more likely, not less.

ShatnersWig is spot on.

I've always voted Labour, thought I always would. But the current lot are a shambles. I have eyes and ears, I've not been told anything by the media that I can't see for myself.

Telling voters they have been brainwashed is just patronising garbage and only serves to alienate those whose votes are needed.

Ask a teacher, a nurse, a police officer whether they rather have Corbyn or the Tories

So far it looks like they prefer the Tories over an incompetent moron who's ruined the Labour and make it unelectable.
This is a man who can't be clear about anything. This is a man who doesn't listen to his own party. While most of Labour voters, from what I could understand were against Brexit, he openly supported it, despite all messages about the negative impact it will have.
Seriously. You can't ignore the leader (so called in this case) if you are voting for a party.

It isn't just Tory voters who aren't voting for Labour though. It is traditional Labour voters too, like me. I wouldn't dream of voting Tory but I doubt I'll be voting Labour either.

I just don't agree that you aren't voting for the man (or woman) who would be our Prime Minister and represent our country. Of course you bloody are! Why did Theresa May get so much grief for being 'unelected' then?

Teachers, policemen etc, can vote for who they want to. Just like the rest of us.

Agreed stitch.

I don't want to get too into it but some of the things Labour have done, or knowingly stood by amd allowed, mean I will struggle to vote for them ever again (and will never again trust any political party as long as I live).