To want to bang my head against a wall. Why don't people understand they're voting for a party, not a person?!?!

[mrsw14]

AAAGGGHHHHHH!!! I really could scream, I'm so sick of people saying they can't bring themselves to vote Labour because they don't like Jeremy Corbyn. Oh ok, so condemn us to 5 more years of Tory hell instead because you don't like 1 bloke you've never met
It's the PARTY that would be running the country, not one man and god knows what will happen in the future, the leader of the party can change!
Sorry, it just infuriates me that people can't see the bigger picture

mangomay talk about dumbing down the issues. I don't care that he's vegetarian, vegan, allergic to animal products, morally against eating meat, doesn't like the taste or texture or whatever his reasons are.

The reality of it is he can't lead a cohesive conversation at the moment without undermining himself or his party. His allies are even worse. And we want to elect them to run the country? I'd have concerns about most of them running a shoe shop.

voteforpolicies.org.uk/

I posted this on another thread too. I think everyone should try this before voting. It gets you to chose which policies you agree with before you realise which party they belong to. Then at the end it presents you with a pie chart breaking down which parties your chosen policies correspond to and so suggesting who you should vote for. There may well be other similar sites. It's great as it strips away people's underlying predjudices and allegiances amd makes them look at the ACTUAL POLICIES!

unlimiteddilutingjuice agreed. She was an incompetent Home Secretary. She never hit her targets, huge blunders and scandals throughout her time there and has single handedly destroyed the morale of the police, borders and prison officers.

Yes we are voting for the party, but the Labour party is not functioning well and has an incredibly weak shadow cabinet. You can say Corbyn is a symptom, not the disease?

voteforpolicies.org.uk/ - Below is the 2015 survey.
The 2017 survey has not yet been released but it will be soon

I don't think they are competent.
Did you not see DA on her radio interview discussing police numbers?

That is a completely naïve view which ignores how the balance of power between the legislature and the executive has changed. You're blindly looking at how parliament works in theory and ignoring the fact that it works very differently in practice.

In theory we all vote for our local MP who represents their constituents and the Prime Minister is simply the leader of their group in parliament.

In practice we vote for our MP who is standing on the manifesto of the party written by the central leadership - Corbyn and his team. And a vote for your local Labour candidate is an endorsement of that manifesto and the policies he and his team espouse and therefore an endorsement of Corbyn's leadership.

The executive is now much more powerful than it should be theoretically, so if Labour were to win he would be very powerful. Although the Queen is our head of state political leadership of the country usually comes from the Prime Minister, which would be Corbyn. Considering that leadership is not something he has shown to be one of his strengths and we're at a crucial political juncture the ramifications of putting Corbyn in that position is something that voters would be foolish not to consider when voting.

I'm afraid I think it is you and not the people you are criticizing who is failing to fully understand what you're voting for.

Labour are going to lose his election.
The question is, how badly are they going to lose by?
If you want to see the Labour party elect a good leader after June, wont a massive cull of Labour MPs make this much more difficult? Limit the choice somewhat?
I think it depends on the local candidate too - if your local Labour candidate is someone you would like to see helping to rebuild the Labour party, and if they have a chance of winning, why not vote for them? Otherwise what we'll be left with is a tiny opposition, with all the sensible Labour Mps gone.

I'll have a look at that link now. However, last time it told me to vote UKIP which does not in anyway fit my outlook. Don't know what I said to make that happen...

I'm avoiding voting labour because of the policies they are throwing at the wall, hoping some will stick. I can't see a £10 minimum wage working, and if parking is free at hospitals you'll never ever find a space/the current free bus will stop running/the hospital will go broke.

^this election, not his!

BINGO! Do I win a prize?

On every single thread of a similar nature where Labour is discussed, Labour/Corbyn supporters usual defence is that everyone is being swayed by the media. It is always the media's fault.

No. I have my own eyes. I am not a sheep. I see and hear Diane Abbott being useless on the television and radio. I see and hear Emily Thornberry being useless on the television and radio. I see and hear Jeremy Corbyn being usless at PMQs on the television and radio. I see and hear John McDonnell spouting nonsense on the television and radio.

These people are coming across as inept and out of their depth and with pie in the sky pledges, some of which sound quite good actually, but which are completely uncosted.

Many Labour MPs refused to work with Corbyn on his front bench. Corbyn has a history of totally going against the party line throughout his political career and it is folly to suddenly become leader and expect your MPs to toe the line when you never did. it doesn't work like that.

My opinion of Labour is based on these people's own performance and their own words, not by any media spin. Although I suppose you could blame the media for just giving them airtime.

Labour have brought this on themselves. They elected the wrong Miliband and then elected Corbyn. Good Governments need strong oppositions to ensure the best result for the country. If the Tories are buggering up the country then Labour have had a considerable hand in it for letting them get away with so much due to their total lack of opposition.

And I am NOT a Tory voter.

Actually you vote for your local MP who is a person not a party. However you know that if your MP is aligned with a party then he or she has chosen to conduct themselves in accordance with the principles set out in their manifesto. The manifesto and policy is set and governed by the leader of the party and so by voting for your MP you would be voting for the ideals set out by Jeremy Corbyn. They might change leader, but it's usually very unlikely, especially in Jeremy Corbyn's case where he has already resisted challenges to his party leadership, he is clearly holding on for dear life up there. So with Jeremy Corbyn in charge, he would be setting the party's policy, he would be in charge of leading negotiations with a bunch of very irritated and agrressive EU leaders who are trying to get the best deal for themselves and screw the UK.

Let's face it, he can't even galvanise his own party so goodness know what an awful job he'd do of negotiating Brexit. I can easily see why people would chose not to vote for an MP that has aligned themselves to a party that has such a terrible leader.

Jeremy Corbyn hasn't got it him in to run a tap, never mind a country. He says an awful lot of what he would do, however he says it on the basis he would never actually get in and have to follow it through. He'd be resigning before they could pack him up to move him into number 10. Combined with Diane Abbott?!

I will be voting on someone strong enough to see us through Brexit and beyond.

I don't watch TV news, I don't read newspapers, I listen to LBC and research from there.

Tony Blair was promoted above the party, the leader to bring new life into the party, if they had a modern day (untainted) charismatic candidate they would be milking it for all it's worth. All parties would.

Because should Labour win he will become PM and it's become increasingly clear that he can't lead or organise his own party so how can he lead the country? Campaigners are being told on the doorstep in solid Labour seats that they can't vote for a party in such disarray and it's being dismissed as some kind of right wing conspiracy to portray him as an idiot - he doesn't need the media to do that, he's perfectly capable of doing it himself!
It's the same old blame game that arose during the referendum - assume voters are too thick/complacent or heartless to make their own mind up and have their own opinions because they dare to think differently to you without actually looking seriously at why they feel like this.

pickleme that means you chose the UKIP policies. That's the point of the site I'm afraid. for you

Because I could never vote for a party who think that Corbyn would make a good PM, they are idiots to believe that and I won't vote for Idiots.

I vote for a person - my MP.

What party the candidates belong to is an important factor. Both policies and how it is led.

Ask a teacher, a nurse, a police officer whether they rather have Corbyn or the Tories

Don't you treat local and general elections differently Auntie Stella?

There is a definite attraction in voting for a party headed by someone with principles, which is not something you can accuse the Conservatives of. My issue with Corbyn is his support of Brexit. Fortunately I am in a constituency which is essentially a Lib Dem/Conservative fight so I have no problem in deciding who to vote for.

I disagree that he's weak. I think people are believing what they read,

So where do you get your own opinion from OP? Where is the average person supposed to get theirs from?

And anyway - whatever your or my personal opinion of the media is, it's certainly no big revelation that a party's front man's image is going to sway the vote. And yet there he is -at the front swaying the vote away from the party. They put him there. It seems to have been a big mistake. It's logical to wonder therefore how many other missjugments and big mistakes they'd make if they got in power.

It's very difficult to separate out the leader and their party. As they're the person meant to be driving through the party's agenda.

This is even more difficult for Corbyn as he doesn't have the support of his MPs. Without their support, what has the electorate got but the leader? Faceless back room men?

The consequence of voting Labour is getting Jeremy Corbyn, who is appalling in every single way imaginable. I certainly won't be voting Tory either.

When Dianne Abbott is....Ahem....the way she is and JC says she's "alright" I could not bring myself to vote for Labour. It's not because I listen to persuaded argument it's because I actually have ears and heard Dianne Abbott and JC say these things. They should be on a stage, not a soapbox. People aren't sheep OP. They recognise a pair of total no hopers is all.