Seriously, what was ever so wrong with the EU that it has swayed life long Labour voters to vote Tory?

[Bearbehind]

As above really.

Some of the swings to Tory councillors are mind boggling.

What was/ is so bad about the EU that makes this worth it?

I'm also wondering why there's been no lib dem surge - can tim farron really be that unpopular? That's been a surprise I agree.

Labour don't get it anymore
My mil is a labour councillor and for a long time I have been trying to explain what working class people want. She doesn't understand that we just want fairness but we also want best for children. They have no policies and no ideas. It isn't an over night thing though. It has been going on for years and they have their head in sand thinking the past will take them forward. Big shame

babybarrister Fri 05-May-17 22:06:24

Yes lots of older tribal labour voters like JM Like JC himself were vehemently anti EU....why the surprise now? The party and its ethos has turned in on itself with lies and deceit and how ironic.

What would WS make of this! The very type of older 70's staunch anti EU men are in power , we are taken out of the EU but they think they have to bury this to survive. Imagine the difference if JC had come out as anti EU!

can tim farron really be that unpopular?

Yes. he really can, I cant think of anyone more un appealing to run the LD right now.

Sorry, no, I don't accept that. The Tories are rather further right of centre now than for most of their history.

You need to learn your history. The Conservatives are currently very centric.

Theresa may was a remain campaigner

Anyone watching newsnight? I'm feeling sorry for the labour campaign manager being interviewed, it's beginning to feel like watching a small insect being tortured, they don't even believe they'll win. They're fighting to win...it's a tough brief.

Well, Labour's Problem is that although they came up with lots of reasons to dump Clause 4, they never came up with a proper, feasible alternative. Fundamental. Go back to Clause 4 and come up with a decent non-Tory replacement and Labour could landslide. Amongst all those New Labour Intelligentsia there must be one or two ideas that could be thought of?

OMG - they mentioned Burnham as someone to learn from - could he perchance have beaten the tories because he's a moderate? Didn't wait around to meet Corbyn...

As for the rubbish about May being good at leading the Brexit negotiations when she's made the most appalling aggressive start...

Labour are a shower of shit

I think the thread may just end here..

Or we could try and look into the idea that Murdoch has somehow had easy jet spray some chem trails over the UK for the past 18 months.

My DH calls Jeremy Corbyn " the High Sparrow", nobody is going to vote for the high sparrow.

Oh my goodness i wish people would stop referring to Jeramy Corbyn as JC

Thats how my dad refers to Jesus Christ...its confusing me

I think it all boils down to who the country will trust and has confidence to sort out Brexit.

If JC gets in on June 8, how will the markets react?

If I am honest, I am looking forward to June 9, it will all be over

Negotiations in themselves require an opening gambit -TM has just laid out an opening first hand, with undeclared cards to one side. The EU negotiators are doing the same. Lots of side-games and tactics will be used by everyone. It would be very naive to think it's any thing else but that.

And that's for you duchess because you dismiss too much...

Thats how my dad refers to Jesus Christ...its confusing me

In momentum's eyes they are one and the same ...

twitter.com/stephenaharper/status/860493618708197377

No one wants to be governed by far left nutters. How hard is that to understand?

Life long Labour. Will not vote Labour this time and will never vote Tory. But corbyn and his mates can just stop with this how can you vote for the evil Tories bullshit. The left of the Labour party give not one shit about the poor and disabled. They have lost the moral high ground and should be utterly ashamed of what they have done. They carried on knowing they would lose and carried the vulnerable in their wake. I am ashamed of the left.

No idea.
It's all very depressing.
But these things are cyclical.
At some point everyone will be properly fucked off with Tory austerity, lack of NHS funding, fucking around with the education system, etc etc and Labour will have sorted their shit out (and hopefully binned Dianne Abbott) and there will be a subsequent swing to the left.
I just hope it doesn't take too long.

People keep going on and on about Corbyn, vote for the party you follow not the leader, those can change!

Well based on what burnham achieved, labour will probably massively resurge in the general election after this if they can bin Corbyn, McDonnell, Abbot and the rump currently in charge and elect a moderate with some charisma and decent polices.

And I agree that TM's 'I'll be a bloody difficult woman' is a truly shit way to start negotiations. Thatcher wannabe. Not convinced we are in as strong a position as she'd like us to think.
But I must be one of the very few who aren't impressed by her so far.
She's good at the sound bites but haven't seen much else from her yet.