Seriously, what was ever so wrong with the EU that it has swayed life long Labour voters to vote Tory?

[Bearbehind]

As above really.

Some of the swings to Tory councillors are mind boggling.

What was/ is so bad about the EU that makes this worth it?

I don't think Corbyn is a knob, he's not flash like Blair. Think we are seeing politics as America does and voting for one person rather than a party, we are not choosing a president and am fed up of people saying they weren't going to vote for Corbyn, I had to explain that only people in his constituency had that choice.

blowing, I'll glady read any reference you find that explains my question.

Sadly, as ever, this has only been explained in your head, not in actual reality.

The EU is not uppermost in everyone's minds. The EU is not the only thing people vote upon. Simply put - it's not always all about the bloody EU.

marking place
because
I know exactly why
but am too pissed to type it tonight

I was always a Labour supporter. Mainly from an education standpoint. The Sure Start Centres were fantastic and education has gone from bad to worse under the Conservatives. However we moved from one conservative area to a labour area to be closer to family. The conservative area was lovely. Clean well looked after etc. the labour area we have moved too is dirty (dog dirt literally every few paces) little growth, the park so run down. I thought it might be a north south thing but at the weekend we went into a neighbouring town (conservative) and it too looked well looked after and seemed to be doing far better for itself.

Was fine until Maastricht treaty.

Maybe there are a whole generation of voters coming through that are no longer a die hard breed of labour voters based solely on the miners strikes of the 80s- you can't only hold a grudge so long and all that...

People are not moving to the right, the Labour Party has swung rather dramitically too far left ! The Conservatives are just a tiny bit right of centre currently. People feel they need a safe pair of hands with brexit and they also want to distance themselves from the far left lunacy seen recently - i also believe that some of the leftist drivel from the US is becoming more and more noticed over here ! The Berkley riots, Antifa who are actually extremly facist is their methods, Transexual lunacy seen in Canada etc... we just want stability !

fortnum
People are not moving to the right,
which planet are you on ?

as populations age they move right
every continent except africa is ageing

Its the Corbyn factor.

Most people are middle of the road with a bit of a left or right wing bias. People generally do not like extremes.

The two parties that have dismally failed? UKiP and Labour under Corbyn, which is infiltrated by the extreme left. No surprises there.

"What was/ is so bad about the EU that makes this worth it?"

This, Bear. The not having a clue and point blank refusal to even consider the reality of the situation, by all in opposition.

The EU is insolvent. Yet on they, and their supporters, blindly go.

Under Maastricht, no EU state must exceed 60% of GDP in debt. Yet heres the latest table.

ec.europa.eu/eurostat/web/products-datasets/-/tsdde410&lang=en

And for those that may be ready to consider the bigger picture, this was from back in 2013.

www.telegraph.co.uk/news/worldnews/europe/eu/10006992/The-debt-ridden-EU-stares-bankruptcy-in-the-face.html

Perhaps Estonia, Romania, Latvia etc would like to step up to the plate to save this dying, bankrupt experiment? Apparently not.

Whats this got to do with local elections? Its the consistant blinkered EU view being spouted by the deniers.

"as populations age they move right"

Id agree with that. Thats wisdom, experience, knowledge and spending a lifetime paying for something, that brings the appreciation that theres a cost to everything. Entitlement is certainly for the young.

The Conservatives are just a tiny bit right of centre currently.
Sorry, no, I don't accept that. The Tories are rather further right of centre now than for most of their history.

It would be nice to think people are smart enough to realise they aren't voting for Corbyn, they're voting for the party. After all a leader can change within a party as shown by the conservatives. But people are quite hung up on Corbyn so sadly maybe not all that clever

*Bear I have seen thread after thread though with you asking for things to be explained and posters who are articulate and clear and intelligent
( unlike me) take lots of time to do exactly that to be met with the same comments over and over again.

I dont think you need it explaining again I think you need to learn to listen in a different way and put yourself in other peoples shoes.*

This, in spades, seriously Bear you will only get some peace or sense of resolution when you ask yourself why we can't answer as you are so closed off you won't listen. The answers to these many, many threads you start are out there. You need to seek help.

infinite it's most odd you hunt me down wherever I go

You are pretty hard to avoid tbd you start threads on this topic constantly and its like watching car crash tv you know you should rise above it but you just can't. I started out believing you genuinely wanted answered and tried to tell you reasons your vitriol and abuse was originally upsetting, then caused mirth but now I am actually worried about you.

Tbf that should be

People are constantly being told how crap Labour are so think theres no point in voting for them as noone else will.

I wouldn't vote Tory ever but I won't be voting for Corbyn.

Labour needs to sort itself out.

Until they do I won't be voting for them

Turn out was awful here at about 20%. To me it just proves people don't give a shit about local elections.

People are constantly being told how crap Labour are so think theres no point in voting for them as noone else will.

Well, they've got a fucking point!

Not really

Btw our election was for a mayor. I voted for the person who actually a) gave a shit enough to tell me about their policies and b) had policies that were realistic and well thought out and would benefit my local area.

Not really

Disregarding this morning's result, and the general consensus on places like MN which have a broad spread of the electorate ( and arguably, leans left) please elaborate - how can you possibly come to that conclusion?! 😂