To wonder wtf is going on in Wales?

[brexitstolemyfuture]

www.google.co.uk/amp/www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/politics/tories-labour-poll-wales-yogov-majority-seats-first-time-century-a7699776.html%3famp

Tories predicted to get a majority for the first time in a century. I thought this was fake news, but no it's real

Torys all the way for me

So can you tell me with absolute certainty that employment rights will stay the same post Brexit?

And can you show me some figures to support the contention that it was "uncontrolled immigration" that has caused th issu s we now hav with the health service?

As for unaffordable healthcare, well a large problem with the NHS is of course a massive increase in our population, due to the horrific policy of uncontrolled immigration, encouraged by the last Labour government.

Uncontrolled immigration and yet net migration from the EU was about 180,000 per year (from memory). Maybe the UK isn't quite as attractive to others as you think it is.

What about the immigrants holding the NHS up? Or doesn't your tunnel vision see them?

Someone that can't spell Tories. Great. What was that about intellect?

Titty

That's a bit silly isn't it. Typos on the phone I expect.

You spoil a good case by sounding patronising. That's a shame.

Why will the Tories (probably) win convincingly? Because the alternatives are unpalatable to so many people, even traditional Labour or Lib Dem supporters. It's the "better the devil you know" mentality. Neither Labour or the Lib Dems are seen as caring about people any more than the Tories do don't.

The truth is I don't think that Labour really even want to win at this point in time. They know that Corbyn would be a very unsafe leader for the UK, they know that the only thing he is really capable of doing is keeping them out of office for another few years. In five years, whether Brexit is a disaster or not they will be able to claim that the Tories have fucked it up. They will be able to elect a new party leader, someone more in the "New Labour" mould, and sweep the boards in 2022 in much the same manner as they did in 1997.

Labour don't want to win at present. Brexit will most likely be toxic for every politician and party involved in it. It's much easier to stand at the sidelines and criticise than it is to make Brexit work.

If Labour seriously wanted to win power, they would make a commitment to give the UK a referendum on the final Brexit deal. A referendum to take the deal, leave without a deal or to remain in the EU. The Lib Dems, Greens and Scottish Nationalist/Socialist Parties would probably be willing to do a deal in marginal constituencies so that the "remain" voters weren't diluted.

I'm not saying that this is what I think necessarily should happen, but I think it is the only realistic option for Labour to be elected in June. Which I don't think they really want.

Could it be that Labour took its heartlands for granted for just too long?

Scotland deserted them, maybe Wales next, and perhaps some seats in the North of England. All the places which Labour thought were theirs by divine right.

So can you tell me with absolute certainty that employment rights will stay the same post Brexit?

Can you tell me with absolute certainty that employment rights won't stay the same post Brexit?

I'm Welsh, live in Wales and all five of us will vote Labour.

*Could it be that Labour took its heartlands for granted for just too long?

Scotland deserted them, maybe Wales next, and perhaps some seats in the North of England. All the places which Labour thought were theirs by divine right.*

YY.

This is the big, glaring problem with Labour.
They took the proles for granted & focused on courting the 'right-thinking, left-leaning' luvvies.

Do this for too long and the masses push back - and there's far more of them than there is of the metropolitan chattering classes.

Can you tell me with absolute certainty that employment rights won't stay the same post Brexit?

of course not but the omens aren't good are they?

www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/politics/brexit-safety-standards-workers-rights-jacob-rees-mogg-a7459336.html

www.mirror.co.uk/news/uk-news/tories-trade-union-bill-bad-7888749

They took the proles for granted & focused on courting the 'right-thinking, left-leaning' luvvies.

you mean people who champion equality and social justice?

working class voters need to ask themselves "what have the Tories ever done for us?"

you mean people who champion equality and social justice?
working class voters need to ask themselves "what have the Tories ever done for us?"

Apart from the fact that working class voters also champion equality and social justice:

Quite a few did quite well out of Thatcher wrt being able to buy their council houses at massively reduced rates.

Tories are the natural choice of many blue collar working class voters too.

On a personal note, the tories have lifted me completely out of income tax this year.

Or are you assuming that 'the working class' are entirely dependent on benefits of some kind? Tax credits etc?

Apart from the fact that working class voters also champion equality and social justice:

indeed - the working class trade unions do - the same unions vilified by the right.

Quite a few did quite well out of Thatcher wrt being able to buy their council houses at massively reduced rates.

short termism which has led to today's housing crisis. Wonder how their kids and grandkids are doing?

Tories are the natural choice of many blue collar working class voters too.

Voting against their own interests, unless of course pandering to big business and austerity help ordinary folk.

On a personal note, the tories have lifted me completely out of income tax this year.

Good for you. Enjoying 20% VAT and higher food bills?

Or are you assuming that 'the working class' are entirely dependent on benefits of some kind? Tax credits etc?

Where did I say that? I am working class.

What brilliant news - go Wales!

working class voters need to ask themselves "what have the Tories ever done for us?"

No, they are asking themselves what Labour and the EU ever did for them. They are one of the poorest areas of Europe. They cannot see what benefit the current political set-up gives them. Civic centres and dragon sculptures are nothing compared to having a job in the here and now.

The majority don't even understand the political structures. They think their MP will deal with dog shit.

No, they are asking themselves what Labour and the EU ever did for them.

NHS, National Minimum wage, sure start. EU provides funding to poorer areas - look forward to Tories filling that void after Brexit.

thr majority don't even understand the political structures

Ffs Titty are you Dianne abbotts or Thornbury?could you be more patronising!

I think the people of Wales are going to get a big disappointing shock in the not too distant future.

The Tories do not have your interests at heart, they do not give a stuff about you. You have been manipulated and deceived. Nobody is immune to the right wing press but some people believe more lies than others.

I hope you are under 25 otherwise no excuse.

I think the people of Wales are going to get a big disappointing shock in the not too distant future.

Sometimes you gotta learn the hard way.

If you want out of the EU vote Labour, they want it just as much as the Tories but they're far less likely to screw you over.

The Labour Party left their traditional supporters years ago, and a metropolitan Londoner does not represent the average Welsh person.

The Labour Party left their traditional supporters years ago, and a metropolitan Londoner does not represent the average Welsh person

New Labour had to appeal to Tory voters to win in 97. I'd be interested to know how millionaire Oxbridge Tories represent the average welsh person.