To think that some left-wing supporters are just so NASTY

[cathf]

This is based on posts I have read on here and a couple of very vocal left-wing friends I have on facebook.
I have truly never read a Conservative supporter personally attacking Labour in the same way.
I find it astonishing and if I am honest, a bit childish.
Recent examples include a website pulling Teresa May's living room apart and costing out every single thing in it, to a chorus of comments along the lines of how can she sleep at night when children are hungry and she has a £25 candle.
Every time the subject is raised on here, there is a long thread of hysterical comments about how nasty the Tories are. Yes, Tory supporters state their case and answer back, but they seem to be able to do it in a more restrained, mature manner than outraged Labour screamers.
There seems to be a lot of personal bile aimed at Teresa May, which I am at a loss to understand - just what has she done that is so terrible?
She is pushing through Brexit, but that was what the country voted for. Is she supposed to go against the country's wishes?
All of Labour's policies look very lovely, but none have any substance at all. My friend recently stated on Facebook she was supporting Jeremy Corbyn because he wanted peace not war. And? How is he going to implement that then? It reminds me of the 1980s T-shirts stating War is Stupid. Lots of nice words, but to implementation strategies.
It amazes me that supposedly intelligent people seem to be so brainwashed by this nonsense and think that flinging mud is an appopriate way to behave.
Is it just me?

Dannythechampion the fact that women in Germany and Sweden are now scared to leave their own homes at night speaks volumes!
Have you ever tried speaking to them?
Reading what they have to say?
Did you not see what happened in cologne on new year eve?.

There's a problem with that IFS data. If you have a look all the data is calculated before housing costs and the rises in income are calculated as being 3% at most with much of the largest rises going to the non-working.

Housing costs increased by much more than 3% a year. So the claim that living standards rose is very much problematic.

I don't know any German or Sweedish women who are scared to leave the house, and I do know people who live in those countries.

I also know that your first claim was about mass rapes, which again isn't supported by either the German nor the Sweedish crime statistics.

Cologne was a one off event, and very few of the people involved were refugees.

Sorry I should rephrase that, the size and scale of the attacks in Cologne was a one off event.

From 15 December 1992.

Abolition of wages councils and the threat to the lower paid.

www.heraldscotland.com/news/12577696.Abolition_of_wages_councils_and_threat_to_the_lower_paid/

THIS is what laid to the lower paid jobs which led to working tax credits.

Its funny that German and Swedish crime statistics don't support your claim. So no its not enough evidence.

The statistics don't support it, because the Sweden has not allowed crime stats to be correlated to immigration status since 2005.

"...The last time there was an official report breaking down crime statistics by immigrant status and origin was in 2005, for the years 1997 to 2001. These statistics confirmed that immigrants were significantly overrepresented amongst offenders, in particular in committing violent crimes. The foreign born were four times more likely to be suspects in homicide cases than those with Swedish origin, and 4.5 times more likely to be suspects in rape cases. Since then, Swedish criminologists and politicians have made sure that no new statistics have been released..."

www.google.co.uk/amp/amp.nationalreview.com/article/445237/sweden-crime-rates-immigration-what-are-facts

"The statistics don't support it, because the Sweden has not allowed crime stats to be correlated to immigration status since 2005."

But if letting the refugees ( which is recent) in had caused an increase in rapes more rapes would be reported overall, they haven't.

I lived through the Thatcher years (I'm 49). I was entirely cushioned from it, living a very comfortable life in a wealthy family in the South East. I was clueless, totally removed from what was going on. Nobody watched the news, my father took the papers to work, and left them there, and the tv we watched was heavily policed.

Even when I started working I wasn't affected, I walked into a job (friend of my parents natch), worked as a nice little secretary until I got married, got pregnant, left work. Life for me in the '80's and 90's was very good, XH brought home a ridiculous wage for what he did. I just didn't think.

Then we got divorced, I had to look after myself financially for the first time in my life, I discovered how tough life could be, and it was a huge shock. But not as big a shock as it was when I became ill 18 months ago. Now I am disabled, I live off benefits with zero chance of ever being well enough to perform any kind of work, hell I can't even look after my house myself.

And I finally discovered why people vote Left. Why Labour is so different to Conservative, why I was just so fucking WRONG when I sat there in my wee ivory tower, happily voting in the people who would go on to strip me and others of any sense of security, whilst selling off my country piecemeal.

But if letting the refugees ( which is recent) in had caused an increase in rapes more rapes would be reported overall, they haven't.

Haven't they?

"...In quantitative terms, the NTU data on sexual assault show a rising victimization level from the first survey in 2005 to the last reported year, 2015. The legal definition of rape in Sweden, suddenly a hot topic in U.S. political discourse, is irrelevant here. These numbers are from a self-reported survey of sexual-crime victimization with the same definition over time. The number of sexual crimes reported to the police has also increased in recent decades..."

(From same link as before)

From the article you linked to:

"Refugees who arrived during the migration crisis are too few in number to explain much of Swedish crime trends. Sweden’s crime-heavy immigrant neighborhoods emerged gradually through the accumulated effects of many decades of immigration."

adn:

"Finally, it is worth emphasizing that the focus on overall crime statistics avoids the actual question being discussed: the situation in immigrant-dominated areas with low socioeconomic status. Around 95 percent of the Swedish population lives outside these areas. Hence, it takes a lot for crime trends in the “ghettoes” of Sweden to dominate overall trends. Four fifths of the population in Sweden are not immigrants. The overall crime trend and the effect of immigration" on crime are therefore two different topics.

Read more at: ://www.nationalreview.com/article/445237/sweden-crime-rates-statistics-immigration-trump-fox-news

You really were VERY selective with the bit that you copied and pasted weren't you.
:)

"...At outdoor festivals such as “We Are Stockholm,” women have been groped. Public swimming pools have become venues for gangs of young immigrant men to harass women. Malmö has been losing its small Jewish population, and the Simon Wiesenthal Center issued a travel warning due to threats and attacks on Jews from Muslim immigrants..."

www.nationalreview.com/article/445169/sweden-rape-sexual-assault-non-muslim-immigrants

You really were VERY selective with the bit that you copied and pasted weren't you.

Well of course I was selective
I selected a portion which directly related to your point re lack of stats, but provided the link for full perusal.

"Haven't they"

As I said not according to the crime data, I notice as well that the legal definition of rape question is dismissed by the author, where as one of the reasons why the increase has occurred is that the legal definition has changed ( since 2010 I think) and as it now covers are broader range, and is also very specific, the number of offences has increased marginally.

As far as I can see the number of reported sex crimes was higher in 2010 than it has been in any year since. Well before the migrant crisis.

CopperRose

Is www.nationalreview.com one of your favourite sources of information? I just had a look to see what sort of stories it likes

Of course you were selective, you linked to a quote which made it look like the crime data was flawed, when in fact it does show that the claimed mass increase in the number of rapes has not occurred as a PP stated.

The other quote you have used is fine, there may be some crimes committed by immigrants, but again it doesn't back up the claim made by the PP who said:

"The mass rapes all across Sweden and Germany is enough evidence to tell us that having mass refugees come over, is not a good idea. "

Can I just point out that as a woman in Germany, I was not scared to go out this evening, and neither were my friends. So can we please stop this ridiculous scaremongering on "our" behalf. If the situation here changes, I'll be happy to let you know.

There have been so many cases of sexual violence and rape in London which are barely reported perpetuated by Eastern Europeans.

Did any of you know about this?

news.met.police.uk/news/man-convicted-of-pardeep-kaur-murder-in-hillingdon-234729

This could be any one of you. Any time, we are not safe.

The majority of sexual offences in the UK are committed by British nationals.

If Tory voters are so concerned about the safety and welfare of women why keep voting for a party that cuts domestic abuse services.

Most people my QC father prosecutes for serious sexual crime are Eastern European.

The figures are incredibly misleading because that includes the whole of the UK. If you look at cities things are very different.

A bit of sense regarding this

www.migrationobservatory.ox.ac.uk/resources/briefings/immigration-and-crime-evidence-for-the-uk-and-other-countries/

Its also worth noting that foreign born prisoners make up 9% of the prison population, in 2015 the foreign born population made up 13.5% of the entire population, which means that foreign nationals are under represented as a share of the prison population.

"Most people my QC father prosecutes for serious sexual crime are Eastern European."

Ah an appeal to authority.