To be quite shocked at how some people speak to their kids?

[IndiaGrace]

Today I went to the shops. DD was in nursery so it was a very rare child free outing.

Shopping centre is located in nearest city, in what is quite a rough area but it obviously attracts shoppers from miles around.

I lost count of the number of (presumably) parents I heard speaking in really nasty ways to their kids. I'm not talking losing the rag and telling them off. I mean one woman hissing "shut up and leave me alone" to a wee girl in a trolley who must have been about 3 or 4. Another one saying to her small son "you're so annoying just stop talking" - a few examples of this. "Stop asking me for Stuff, you're doing my nut in" etc.

Now I understand that tempers get frayed. It was busy, people are fraught. Sometimes when my DD (who is two and tries my patience plenty) is yammering away when I'm trying to concentrate, I resist the urge to tell her "shhh" and if there are times I do need to tell her to be quiet, I will gently say "shh, you need to be quiet now" but it would never occur to me to nastily tell her to shut up or to leave me alone etc.

I suffer from very low self esteem, have done all my life, and I'm determined my DD will not grow up to feel the same way. This might be colouring my view as to why I feel so strongly. Is it as big a deal as I think it is? Or am I being over sensitive about it?

This is something I have noticed a lot since DD came along. It really gets my back up. I wouldn't say anything though. Generally they don't tend to look like the kind of people to respond well to that kind of confrontation.

I've had one of those days-recently started new job, moving house, elderly grandmother in hospital for the millionth time and as the medical one everyone looking to me.

My two eldest children have been on the chocolate come down because I stupidly let them have an Easter egg each after lunch. The twins are going through a destructive phase. DH is working until midnight tonight and we've packed nothing for the move. My saviour the tv is broken!

I have been at the end of my tether all day. It has taken all of my willpower not to swear at my children. I have spoken sharply when they have fought or been cheeky.

I was very judged pre kids but now I get it, I really get it. My children are warm, loved and know that sometimes their behaviour is out of order. I am human and they see human reactions.

Yabu on 2 counts-judging other parents based on a snapshot (with undertones of class snobbery) and putting your child into nursery so that you can shop unhindered while judging other busier parents.

I might lose my temper but I would never ever put my kids in nursery on a day off-each to their own OP, each to their own !

On children acting differently to adults: I act in age appropriate ways, like taking the last available supermarket trolley sometimes, changing lanes on the roundabout, saying no to people's requests occasionally and doing a myriad of other things that no doubt piss people off, but if they get aggressive and shout at me, I see them as having a temper problem rather than "just having a bad day", I'm afraid! My two year old acts in age appropriate ways that piss me off sometimes too, but if I shouted at her for that, I'd be the one with the problem. You need to locate the blame in the right place otherwise you just make yourself into the victim: "it's my fault she shouted at me, I should have been more aware of the possibility that she's having a bad day." That's what children learn from you when you try to dissipate the blame for your bad mood or angry outburst onto them. It's not right. Yes, we all get cross. But don't excuse bad behaviour by pointing out that your children were asking for it somehow by acting their age and not conveniently being invisible when you need them to.

I have definitely said things I am not proud of to my dd when I am tired stressed and at the end of my tether. Not that it makes it OK, but I'm not a saint and do lose it. I would and have said similar things to my OH too when warranted, so not something I reserve only for dd - although he generally doesn't ask me to watch him do a handstand 50 times in a row while dinner is cooking and I am trying to multi task all daily housework into a 30 min window before bedtime. And he doesn't cry when I tell him I am busy so he will have to wait. My point being that as much as I love my dd she does some annoying crap sometimes

Surely it's part of a parent's job to teach their kids that people have limits and you can push them too far - otherwise they'll get one hell of a shock when they get into the real world and find out the hard way!

Wow, this thread is shocking. There is no excuse, absolutely none for speaking horribly to a child. Children can be intense and annoying but there are ways of dealing with it without nastiness. To the person who said everyone has shouted at their children - nope. I've never, ever once raised my voice to my DS and he's 9. (He's a narrator too!) If he's intense or annoying, I ask him nicely to stop. If I was horrible to him, he'd learn that's OK! I can't understand why people are justifying it.

I've also never once raised my voice to the children in the classes I've taught. Again, there are ways of getting 30+ 5,6 and 7 year olds to respond without being a screaming banshee and the children are respectful and well mannered by the end of my year.

I detest shouty, nasty parents.

Anxious2017 you're right, it's not nice to shout.

But please could you explain what happens when the nice requests to stop are repeatedly met with defiance?

Let's just say all three DCs are arguing and then it culminates in the eldest two beating each other up in public (and the eldest is nearly as big as you). What do I do then?! Keep on with the softly spoken requests, or....?

But you're a teacher anxious, you're bound to have more patience than the rest of us or you wouldn't be any good at it.

Are you really so lacking in empathy that you can't understand it might be harder for some of us? That we're doing our best but this something we find hard and sometimes fail at? Is there really no aspect of parenting that you, in your most secret thoughts, can acknowledge you're not doing so well at?

Because as a short fuse parent, this is hard for me. I try. I count to ten. I take deep breaths. I leave the room. But sometimes nonetheless I still find myself snapping "fgs, can you two just shut up and do as you're told for five minutes??!"

I'm good at other things, I think. My kids are happy, confident little people. But never losing my temper is something I really struggle with. I don't think that makes me a terrible parent.

It is unfathomable to me how anyone can NEVER raise their voice to their DCs.
I admire those who never lose their rag. Is there any situation in life where you do lose your temper?
Makes me wonder how much of this is self control, how much personality type, and how much is lifestyle.

I am pretty patient and of course there are moments when my child/class aren't perfect but I don't deal with it by bellowing or saying nasty things - I really don't feel that the volume of a voice makes much of a difference to behaviour, as the classes of shouty teachers probably behave worse and definitely aren't bothered by it. It's no incentive to behave differently. Respect and trust work much better in my experience.

Sometimes my DS does "do my head in", but I find reasoning nicely works. Why would I need to snap or shout or call him nasty names? The children that have this done to them will grow up doing the same and treating others in this manner.

And I ask this as someone with a sort of 'type a' personality.

Interesting, Nomoreangst, it would be fascinating to find out. I don't really lose my rag although if I did, it would be at people driving while using their phones or those who take disabled spaces when they don't have blue badges

Well that answers my question on empathy

Anxious I don't think I've ever snapped or shouted at any of my DCs when I've been alone with just one of them. It's when there are siblings in the mix that things become challenging, in my experience. Just saying.

I have empathy as much as an average person - completely understand parenting is complex, difficult and sometimes thankless. Still don't think there's any excuse for being downright nasty to a child. I think I have less empathy because of the abused children I've worked with, cowering in fright due to a raised voice. It's unnecessary.

Definitely more difficult with siblings! Is that shouting to be heard though, rather than shouting in nastiness?

Me too no more angst. I would like to be one of those calm parents but it's the end of the holidays, they are bored and there's a backlog of things that I can't do without children in tow who don't want to be there and make sure I know about it! And I need space -lots of it - and I don't just mean ambling around the shops space. I mean taking a shower or a shit without hearing ww3 break out.

Part of me thinks people are a bit mean to op. After all, she is right. But the other part says she deserves it for her lack of empathy. After all, if i had a rare day to shop at my leisure during the Easter break, I'd be feeling a bit sorry for the stressed parents and a bit relieved I was alone for once

Life is hard, cruel and so try to make the family home a place of peace and love. I've been through the mill with daughter and boyfriend woes so not trying to be condescending. Wee ones need love and nurturing even if we are tired and desperate

When my first child was 2 I was a very patient mum who had plenty of time to talk reasonably to her and it was actually really easy to cope with just one toddler.

When she was 7 I had her sister who never slept. Ever. She was 4 before she slept anything remotely like a normal sleep pattern but at the same point as learning to talk, she never stopped talking either.

She's 11 now. I'm pretty sure if you passed me in the shops you'd hear me say 'for the love of God, DD, just stop talking please, just shut up for five minutes!' as I can assure you that she will have been rabbiting on non stop since waking that morning. And it's bloody exhausting drivel mostly and while you are trying to concentrate on something it's hard to have this monologue going on in your right ear!

So judge away but don't forget that 2 year olds get older and they talk. My god they talk. And they don't always stop when you ask them nicely. Or at the second, third or fifteenth time of asking. And sometimes you do just want them to shut up for five minutes.

I don't know whether after much provocation, shouting something like "you stop that right now or you won't get xxxx, for god's sake, what is wrong with you, you're doing my head in" is nasty. Because if it is, then I am nasty.

Anxious, have you taught children who tend to have more emotional responses than others? Who cry or tantrum far more often and with less provocation than peers who have more placid, easy-going nature's? Presumably if you have you'll have done your best to help them manage those emotional responses, but also acknowledge it's part of their personality.

Well, those children grow up, and in spite of their best efforts, it's still part of their personality - you would know better than I, but don't child development experts reckon the basic personality is set by age 2? So there are going to be adults who struggle to manage their emotional responses more than their more placid, easy-going peers, though hopefully they'll have got better at it since childhood.

It's wonderful you're so patient. You sound like exactly the sort of teacher I'd like my children to have. But I am not that sort of person. I try my best, but I'm not perfect. Just human.

I had never raised my voice to my child when I only had a two year old. A year later when I had a defiant and sulky three year old plus newborn things were different. It's the way they should be able to understand and communicate but choose not to. It's maddening. And at the time I lost my temper after a stressful day in the sun and a potty training accident and then someone on the internet judged me and said how she would never shout at her child (at the time 6mo). It made me feel awful and I almost lost the will to do any of it. I sobbed for ages.

So yeah, judging and comparing. Good times.

As i said before i rarely lose my temper but when i have all three going off on one i have been known to shout. My middle son whos 9 cant seem to go anywhere without trying to hang off me at all times to the point it drives me mad. Im not very touchy feely and its not just holding hands he sort of grabs onto my arms and makes it so hard to deal with the youngest whos 6 or do anything. Ive had some really nasty looks in supermarkets when i finally have enough of asking him to let go and snap "for goodness sake just get off of me" which is usually made worse by him saying "but i just wanted a hug" i swear peoole must think im evil.

Having more or older children doesn't make you a better parent or more entitled to an opinion. I've had different challenges than my sister with 3 to my1. I've experienced things she hopefully never will and vice versa.

The whole " you're barely a parent yet but if you habe 5 like me you'll be entitled to an opinion" is frankly ridiculous

I really don't wish to excuse this type of awful behaviour - I think swearing or speaking unkindly to a child is unforgivable. BUT I think a lot of (particularly low income) families are under huge strain.... :((

As adults we are treated badly, few are courteous and kind. Road rage, shopping rage, school gate shite at pick up. So, if we can somehow hold our tongue, temper our patience to make the home as the last bastion so they have sanctuary and peace. The last two months I've been in turmoil with my teen so I know it's not easy and not trying to make out that I have the answer. Home should be where we feel safe.