AIBU to think it is only superstrict school that has problem with our DS

[tinkerx5]

Our DS is a perfectly happy confident and sociable 7 year old. NEVER at any time have after school care, superb childminders or family and friends /grandparents he is left with - or ourselves think/indicated he is a problem in any way. DS is a confident and intelligent lad for his age...he has a wide vocabulary and interests, is advanced for his age in some school subjects, and has an accelerated reading and maths age. His school (a very strict Catholic results driven school) acknowledge this and he has accelerated maths and comprehension tuition at the school more suited to that level. The problem we think is with the school and not our DS ...DS has a mind and opinion of his own ...school teacher expects them (yes a class of 7-8 year olds) to work in silence every day - 1 hour in the morning and afternoon sessions -absolute silence. We know this because they told us our son had a problem during such sessions-fidgeting or completing work during these windows. He is kept in at break and lunch if he doesn't finish his work. Is it me or is this tough on a 7 y/o? DS does his homework at home without any issues. He also doesn't have tantrums, cross his arms in protest or get upset like he does at school, but of course is not expected to work in silence. He does work efficiently and quickly at home, if I ask him to help me at home with anything, he obliges and loves to get involved. AIBU that the school have turned around to say we should take DS to our GP for a referral? I really think they are attempting to force a sqaure peg into a round hole here. We have an older child that went to the same school and is now at university ...even they are shocked by the school's suggestion😯 and freely admit compared to their former school...this in was STRICT. The school is surrounded by very poor schools in our area. AIBU to dismiss the school concerns? If DS went to any of the surrounding schools here...trust me - they would think him an angel compared to many. We have to see the head nedt week...this is not over hitting, bullying or lashing out at other kids in any way...AIBU?

I too have a confident,happy and sociable 7year old with accelerated reading and maths. He too attends RC school, the majority are here in Ireland. never ever had a complaint about him in nursery , playdates ,relatives or in the more junior classes at school but as he has moved into a classroom where he is expected to sit quietly and work in silence its become a real challenge to him, turns out he has dyspraxia but only for his teachers we would never have found out. I'm not saying this is the case with your ds but maybe have a chat with the teachers about their concerns before you dismiss them outright.

Clearly there is an issue with your DS if you are being asked to come into school. I doubt this is the first instance of him being noisy/disruptive/refusing to work and they will have done all they can before involving you.

I do think you need to go in and listen to the school. Hear what they have to say, exactly what the issues are.

natweb the only time I expect my pupils to work in silence for an hour is for a test or exam
You don't think they need practice at working in silence in order to do well in exams? As a secondary teacher, I would worry if my classes Kay ever worked in silence in tests.

Only, not Kay. Don't know what my iPad is on.

Well that school would be great for you then brasty but evidence shows that for the majority of children they learn better by doing and explaining the process to others. Especially age 7.

Is that why China is ahead of us in schooling then? They use very traditional methods.

Ovaries- the dope he marks was to emphasise the feeling from the OP that her Ds couldn't have a SN as he was so clever and nice.

I have a kid with multiple SN inc. ADHD. Sometimes they are nice. Sometimes, not so much.

Usually depends on medication ad external triggers.
I

Speech marks. Not dope marks

brasty They might be ahead of us in standardised tests for Maths, Science etc, but that doesn't mean we should aspire to that sort of education system. Presumably the Chinese education system prepares pupils for life in Chinese society and culture... authoritarian and oppressive.

Finland generally top the tables and the kids don't start school until age 7 there - nor do they regularly attend church.
Getting good test results isn't everything. How to negotiate, compromise, collaborate, share and expand on ideas are all things that can't be learned sitting in silence.
That's not to say that it should never happen but 2 hrs a day at age 7 is ridiculous.

Ahh I getcha Countess.

I can empathise; I feel like a twat without meds and hate any kind of sensory overload. Put the two together and I'm definitely not nice, speech marks (I think I prefer dope marks ) or otherwise!

Actually, new research is consistently showing that traditional chalk-and-talk is more effective than more modern collaborative techniques. I've been teaching for 29 years and the research feels right to me.

More effective for what? Results or developing social skills?

DS has a mind and opinion of his own...and a wide vocabulary

Translated - he's a gobby, rude liitle shite who backchats the teachers.

they told us our son had a problem during such sessions-fidgeting or completing work during these windows
If DS went to any of the surrounding schools here...trust me - they would think him an angel compared to many

So he has behaviour issues which are having a direct impact on his ability to self discipline & take instruction.

He may well be an angel in front of or in other informal settings.....but that doesn't necessarily mean he's an angel 100% of the time in school as well.

They've informed you this needs addressing but you choose to bury your head in the sand instead - and blame them.
Will you be blaming them and holding them accountable if your dc fails his exams or doesn't do as well as he could?

The gp referral doesn't mean he must have a type of ASD. It means that something is affecting his focus and learning at school...whether that is neurological/emotional is for the health professionals to investigate.

Have you ever considered that he might be under a lot of pressure to live up to the 'perfect' image & high expectations that you have of him?

Chinese education is a hot house system where as soon as kids get to examinable age they're basically studying 12-14 hours a day. Teachers are strict. Parents are strict. And young Chinese graduates are generally useless in terms of taking ownership and self-management and will often work long hours but not take care of themselves or think independently . We basically have to employ people to get them sorted - from drivers, to office mothers/fathers, to extra managers.

I don't think classrooms should be about teaching social skills.

The Scandinavian countries seem to have found a balance between obtaining excellent results and having a very different approach to learning, that's true. As pps have said though, certain systems work for the cultural norms in which they are implemented.

With the PFB attitude to education we see all too often on here, introducing such a system in the UK would, I imagine result in a bloodbath first, and then more cries of wah wah the school has failed Junior when Junior doesn't leave with 65 A levels.

I'm also in a country where they begin school at 7. They are already expected to know how to read and write by then though (that's taught at nursery- which works more like infants in the UK) and go straight into a 6 hour day sitting at their desks.

Some do well, some less so. Just like any other country.

(sorry for mini hijack OP, just adding to the mythology on the "On the continent they don't get out of the sandpit till they're 12 and are still highflyers" rubbish so often spouted.)

I went to a primary school a bit like this in the mid 90s (so not 1950s either!).

We had to eat our school dinner in absolute silence and if anyone spoke they had to stand in front of the hall and recite grace.

I was genuinely a good kid at school, terrified of getting into trouble, worked hard etc. But for some reason I found it really hard to sit in silence and was forever getting subjected to this for whispering in lunch.

I look back and think what a miserable set up it was!

I'm pretty sure the OP's DS's school only expects silence for quiet work in class not at lunchtime .

That sounds utterly awful heron but definitely that wasn't normal in the 90s

sorry for mini hijack OP, just adding to the mythology on the "On the continent they don't get out of the sandpit till they're 12 and are still highflyers" rubbish so often spouted

This made me laugh!

I would add to this by pointing out that other aspects of education might well be very different - more, rather than less, homework, less comprehensive support for SEN, less emphasis on differentiated instruction and interventions etc.

You can't transpose one feature of a whole onto the UK education system just because you like it and expect outcomes to stack up.

I would always take professional advice in taking my child to the gp.

Well the rights and wrongs of a very formal, authoritarian and results driven environment for a 7 year old isn't really the issue here. He's in the school he's in unless the op is willing to move him.
The good news is that now that the school have identified that there is possible sen they are required to make adjustments to help him and get expert advice on this if needed.
I would go in and speak with the class teacher/SENCO and let them know that you are going to request a referral from your gp and you would like to work with them on whatever strategies/adjustments they feel necessary to help your son manage his environment at school.

An hour in silence is not that bad. Taking a child to church and having them be quiet for an hour I always think is good for them too. Some people just need to learn to shut up. Silence can be a huge blessing to many.

I think at 7 my children's private schools had fairly quiet classes too - it makes learning easier and you can do whole class teaching particularly when all the children are at the same academic level. In a sense I pay fees to ensure that silence.

From what I've read about teaching in Finland, once the children start formal learning at age 8, the methods have mostly been pretty traditional. They sit in rows facing the front, 95% of maths lessons are taught using a textbook, there is very little group work, children are regular expected to work quietly on their own, chalk and talk is not frowned on, etc. These were the methods that produced their high PISA results.

Like most countries, there has been a tension there between what progressive educationalists with power and influence like Pasi Sahlberg would like to see happening in classrooms, and what actually goes on. Finnish teachers have had complete autonomy in their classrooms, and they have used it to largely stick to traditional methods. The new curriculum just introduced represents a victory for Pasi Sahlberg and those who agree with him. It will be interesting to see what happens.

You have no idea how your son is in school op. None. Remember that documentary where they put a secret camera into a primary classroom? Every single parent said they thought their child was so well behaved and they were shocked by what the reality was.
The opinions thing rings alarm bells to me too. I would consider carefully what thw school has to say