I am scared of the kind of society we are becoming?

[brasty]

More and more as a society we seem to be losing empathy for people who are struggling. From those on benefits, to those in overcrowded houses, to disabled and ill people. If individuals think they would not find themselves in that situation, then any empathy seems to disappear.

Not everyone has the same personal resources. Some people are struggling just to get through every day and so eating healthily is not a priority. It is not accident that those with severe mental health problems tend to have worse physical health and higher levels of harmful behavior such as smoking.

Being chronically disabled is shit and makes life much much harder than those who have never experienced it realise. And yes someone may be "lucky" to have social housing, but how about having some empathy if they are struggling in an overcrowded house.

It scares me. This lack of empathy has real affects, Cuts are being made to benefits for disabled people, only because most people simply don't care enough.

Fantastic play MrsLupo and unfortunately yes, this thread (and much of society recently) is very reminiscent of it.

livia

It must be hard for you feeling judged for your lack of reaction to the suffering of strangers. Being called a sociopath must have felt like an over reaction to you.

I think that armchair diagnosis is Ridiculous

And people judging how others should feel are actually rather arrogant. You can't help how your emotions work. You can keep them under control to a point (e.g. Anger) but you can't force a reaction that isn't there iyswim.

And is it healthy for someone with severe depression and anxiety to force themselves to feel those emotions anyway?

You're right. People can't help their emotions or lack of emotions. And no one should be forced to have an emotional reaction that they don't feel. People react differently.

And you'd be more than welcome on the new planet. Do you think you could offer some particular skill set?

Pinkflamingo545 is probably the reason the OP posted about the lack of empathy. Britain as a nation has no right to complain about any type of immigration when it colonised most of the world and still slept at night. No one human being is entitled to anything more than another and if that was the case how were black Africans imprisoned in their own country for years by foreigners???? It's only going to get harder in this country so people are going to have to learn to share. As an aside, whenever foreigners travel anywhere no matter how poor, they are shown endless genuine hospitality by people that have next to nothing. As a society we could do better.

I try to do one good thing a day. Be it saying hello to a stranger or finding a 5 pound note and giving it to a young mum to put on the lottery. Or giving that 20p if someone is short for their parking. It all seems to come back to me twofold. It makes me feel better. So I get something out of it too.

I know what you are talking about OP. Its all too easy to make assumptions about others on benefit or with addictions, those from abroad or those who are on disability living allowance.

Media like benefits porn on channel 5 and the daily fail twist the real story and focus on one or two indivuals who might be swinging the lead rather than examining the fat cats that mean that despite being one of the richest societies on the planet we now have a definite "ünderclass" and it amazes the horrific number of people that fall for this nonsense and have foul attitudes to those less fortunate than themselves

We have to keep fighting the good fight, to recognise that 95% of people are essentially good people, look more at the governemnet ripping you off and screwing you over rather than the man next to you in the street

Isn't that war? Sacrificing your life for a bigger vision?

Ha! Ha,ha,ha,ha! You're absolutely joking right? They make millions out of putting bullets in us.

I think many people do have empathy, some devote their lives to helping others, and some quietly volunteer, or give to charity every month (a small amount this way will not be noticeable for many of us, but gives a steady stream to the charity).
But I think reading mumsnet does give a jaded view of how people feel - it often seems to attract the least empathic, and even cruel comments to those who are struggling.
I was struck by a thread this morning, complaining that a small increase in minimum wage may indirectly increase the cost of living, and make the rest of it a teeny bit worse off (when some of us even have qualifications that we feel entitle us to a comfortable life...). Everyone's entitled to a view of course, but the vast majority of posters agreed, and objected to the poorest working people getting a little more....I find that alarming, but have to hope mumsnet views don't reflect wider society :-(.

I find it particularly annoying that many of us have loads of empathy but just because we have a different route to eradicate or alleviate poverty than someone else they hold up the - you don't have empathy card.

The left need empathy for the right and vice versa as do Brixters and Remainers.

I am not sure things are too different. People have always grouped themselves with others.
In 1966 we had this which remains funny to this day

ohido I think it depends on the boards you frequent. MN strikes me as full of people who are falling over themselves to be the most empathetic, it's certainly not like real life

Would people do something that helped them get out of a situation knowing that that that action could harm others indirectly - people they don't know and possibly don't have empathy for?

Course they would - Most people who say they wouldn't are lying.

On this site empathy and kindness are valued highly and I don't know many people who would admit to a lack of it (given the reaction to my 'confession').

Most people who say they wouldn't are lying

I don't know. Does it depend on how desperate someone is? Would people do something that would benefit them but harm someone else - even indirectly?

For me, it would depend on the benefit to me and the harm caused to someone else.

would people really not take an opportunity to either stop a bad thing happening to them or make a good thing happen because a randomer might be harmed?

It's an interesting question but I don't honestly think that many people would put a total stranger over themselves

It's simple.... luck of empathy is linked to resources. We all fight to survive, to live, have food on the table and a roof over our heads. Britain is currently overpopulated... (housing crisis, NHS crisis, rising food costs) and we all are trying to have our own "patch". With money being less worth taxes will rise BUT there is still not enough to go around to those in need = inflation.

It's an interesting question but I don't honestly think that many people would put a total stranger over themselves

If a good thing could happen to you but that would come at a cost to someone else who you didn't know, would you not hesitate at all?

Not at all - I would do it in a heartbeat

Not at all - I would do it in a heartbeat

So you believe in a dog eat dog world?

Do you think that's just how you are? Personally, I would think about the positives and the potential negatives and weigh them up.

Empathy means putting yourself in the shoes of someone else and feeling sorry for them and understanding their predicament. You can emphasise without handing them your last widow's mite however if that makes our own children starve. You might instead buy them a sandwich.

(Don't take them to live in your home. Much as most of us would like to help the homeless it can be very risky - that tragic case of the lovely family who took in a homeless man and now he's murdered the mother and one of the children and the father is seriously ill in hospital. I am afraid given my family deal with people with mental illness day in day out we learned as children that although yuou can help at a distance it is not always wise to let the person into your home.)

It IS a dog eat dog world. In 46 years I have never seen anything to convince me otherwise. If I could stop something negative or make something positive to the detriment of a stranger, it wouldn't even cross my mind not to.

I know that's what I'm like (to the point where despite severe anxiety and depression, my thought patterns aren't 'suitable' for any kind of therapy including CBT).

The people I love, I love very much. I love all animals and wouldn't choose to harm an animal in that situation. But people I don't know... their issues don't touch me emotionally in the slightest.

Like I said

As places go I think the UK does a hell of a lot better than others regarding healthcare, education and benefits.

Try being disabled, ill, struggling etc in the Congo or in India. Even a baby born with a cleft lip or palate (one of the most common birth defects) wouldn't get surgery as our babies automatically would. Lose a limb/lose your sight/your hearing - no prosthetics, glasses, hearing aids unless you can pay for it. No education unless you can pay for it. No food banks if you aren't able to feed your family. You are quite literally on your own and the mercy of others in your community (who are most likely struggling also).

We have empathy in spades here - just look at the responses to national/international charities or collections for those affected by Tsunamis or whatever. Or the collection for the children of the two parents who died of cancer within days of one another.

And the countries who do get better health care pay more taxes for the privilege. My brother is self employed, lives in Germany and has to cover all his treatment. It costs a fortune. And yes he does get quick attention and all resources chucked at any ailment or injury but he does not get that for free.

There is compassion for people with disabilities that when I were young were mocked horribly. Children with learning difficulties and other disabilities were called mongies and spaz! I didn't see any kids with Downs or other conditons because they were probably in institutions. Now many children are in mainstream schools and are not openly mocked and bullied like they were. Kids weren't even pulled up for being so vile to them either. It was ok!

And even in the flipping Daily Fail when they published that awful picture of the Muslim woman talking on her mobile in the aftermath of the Westminster attack, the responses were 99% saying that she was clearly shocked and upset and calling the paper out for saying she was callous.

I see so many acts of kindness and empathy around me (a pretty rough and down-at-heel council estate). Of course there are people who have a me me me attitude and who look down on others less fortunate but that has always been thus.

It IS a dog eat dog world. In 46 years I have never seen anything to convince me otherwise

Haven't you? You haven't seen people help others, complete strangers? People who make the ultimate sacrifice such as in the French Resistance to make things better.
People who go into caring sectors such as the NHS rather than get a well paid job in another sector because they want to give and to help others?

The world is full of examples of altruism and empathy.