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to start a thread about trans panic because there have only been seventy six already

417 replies

GustyParson · 28/03/2017 17:22

Trans people want to steal your rights! And stroke your cat. They want to colonise your child's reading books, infiltrate your favourite prisons, appropriate the gold medals you would otherwise win for your peerless skills on the pummel horse, take the best seats on the Tube, demand that midwives talk exclusively about pregnant fathers, haunt your preferred changing rooms, run rampant through the Brownie Guides, go unchallenged in every echelon of the WI, burn all your favourite pronouns in an industrial furnace, benefit from all your oppression, demand your pet dog be addressed as Mx, frolic carelessly across the flower bed you've only just planted for God's sake, insist that there are more than two genders, require to be recognised as the gender 'combine harvester' one day and the gender 'quail' the next, piss on the toilet you wanted to reserve for your friends, and call you Cis which is like totally cruel because it sounds like sissy.

Alternatively, trans people are people, they are not trying to hurt you, most of you have never met one, none of you need to feel threatened by them, and there really isn't a need to start fifteen threads a week fretting that they're going to steal your last Bourbon Cream, appropriate or destroy feminism, or change your baby's name from Thomas to Pixie. Seriously, calm down.

OP posts:
Notwhatiexpected · 28/03/2017 21:44

CIS means a sub genre of a while, well that's at least one if it's meanings. So a CIA woman is a subset of a wider genre, "woman" as a gender, with Transwoman another subset.

Which is incorrect, as really Transwomen should be a subgroup of male as a sex, given that any surgical changes made are cosmetic.

Notwhatiexpected · 28/03/2017 21:44

Of a whole, not while.

Notwhatiexpected · 28/03/2017 21:45

CIS not CIA, jeezo.

stinkingbishop · 28/03/2017 21:56

I just know that I have a trans daughter, who is going through hormonal treatment, and is due to go on the surgical waiting list in the autumn, hopefully. I have fully accepted that this is what she wants and needs to do. But it is hard. And it would be good to be able to get support from an anonymous forum concerned with all things parental.

However I know almost every time I click on a trans thread I just feel panicky and nauseous. The spite. The endless thought experiments based on various hypothetical toilet situations. The polar opposite of support. I guess it's a little taster of what she has already gone through and will continue to. The fear I saw in her eyes when we were in Topshop the other day and she looked at me and said 'I don't know what fitting room to go in, it's going to be wrong whichever'. It broke my heart.

AssassinatedBeauty · 28/03/2017 22:11

stinkingbishop there is an LGBT parents board that is specifically there for support. I don't think I've seen any threads posted there turn into theoretical/hypothetical bunfights. I'm sorry you don't feel like you can get any support at all on here, it should be a place where you can talk about things without worrying about your thread getting derailed.

WoodPigeonInFlight · 28/03/2017 22:16

Thanks Eats

I think you have made some excellent points in your posts.

kua · 28/03/2017 22:17

I understand what your child is going through is difficult Stinking but how can you or she know that how they feel
at this time will not change? Surgery and cross sex hormones are life changers. Sterilisation.

There are many blogs online of those who have detransitioned, prior and post surgery. I would highly recommend reading 4thwavenow who are parents going the the same as yourself.

VestalVirgin · 28/03/2017 22:21

However I know almost every time I click on a trans thread I just feel panicky and nauseous.

Then don't. Why do you read them if you are not interested in the impact transactivism and resulting changes in law have on women, and dismiss very real dangers to women as "hypothetical"? Hmm
You know by now that this is discussed on those threads.

If you want help with your parenting, then make a thread about your child and your problems.

FellOutOfBed2wice · 28/03/2017 22:24

Don't mind me. Just settling in for a little watch gets comfy

EatsShitAndLeaves · 28/03/2017 22:25

I hear you Stink and it must be so difficult for you and your child.

There are SO many threads on MN now and on social media and the debate is becoming at times unhealthy polarised to my mind.

The reason imho is the anti-woman/lesbian narrative the TRA's have whipped up and orchestrated that has resulted in a backlash now being realised by very vulnerable people transitioning Sad.

For all the threads though - please remember that there are a lot of people out there that are supportive, understanding and others who are far from hostile.

Standing up to the arguments of extreme TRA's does not make people anti-Trans.

I personally want to see equally, respect and kindness towards your child - as I would for anyone.

Flowers
QuentinSummers · 28/03/2017 22:33

I'm getting so sick of the biology "some animals can change sex so sex isn't fixed" bullshit.
Most animals reproduce sexually, and all those that do have two sexes. No vertebrates do this and produce fertile offspring - so it's irrelevant to humans.
Some animals can switch sexes but as far as I know the only vertebrates that do this are fish. Again - irrelevant to humans.
Intersex people have a developmental disorder and are infertile as a result.
Humans are sexually reproducing and sexually dimorphic like the vast majority of vertebrate animals.
Arguing about slipper limits and how they can change sex is about as relevant as arguing about sharks and how they can sense electric fields. Or birds and how they can fly.
Some animals can change sex, not humans. Some animals have one sex, some have two, we have two.
This isn't a social thing or something that's arguable, it's a fixed biological fact. That's how we reproduce and how so many humans exist on the planet.

OlennasWimple · 28/03/2017 23:02

I find children and teens wanting to transition interesting and horrifying in equal measures, particularly those under the age of 16.

We don't let under 16s choose whether to have sex - we deem them incapable of consenting, for their own protection

Similarly, we don't let under 16s get married.

We don't let under 16s join the army (or even under 18s, without parental consent)

We don't let under 17s drive a car

We don't let under 18s buy alcohol, fireworks or sharp knives.

But we are supposed to support 12/13/14/15 year olds to take harmful, largely irreversible drugs and / or undergo significant surgery?

Sad

This is not to downplay the difficult situation you and your DC are in, Stinking

Mistressiggi · 28/03/2017 23:07

The poster writing about medical examinations made me laugh with the "I fired my doctor" comment. That is nowhere near the reality for most people in the U.K. There may well be a shortage of doctors meaning you may not get much choice about who examines you, but if you have held out for a female for whatever reason and then a transwoman comes in, you can't just say no I'll wait for a biological woman - and if you refuse treatment, where does that leave you? Not hiring a new doctor as if you can get them in Tescos!

OlennasWimple · 28/03/2017 23:10

It quite possibly leaves you not receiving treatment, Mistressiggi, and possibly being labelled a bigot and terfy transphobe

Doyouwantabrew · 28/03/2017 23:13

Only read the op!

Massive yawn kiddo. Your report card reads 'coukd do better'

BewitchedBotheredandBewildered · 29/03/2017 00:52

Well hard luck Doyouwantabrew, you really missed out there.

And making a spelling mistake on a report card comment has given me a good chuckle to go to bed on.

Or have I missed some subtle point?

EatsShitAndLeaves · 29/03/2017 01:03

Wow- some of the later posts reminded me of why I have not posted on this topic.

I'd ask everyone not to descend into fighting fire with fire on the TRA propaganda - that's what they want.

Equally- do fight against the subjugation of women's rights.

Those things are not mutually exclusive imho.

BastardBloodAndSand · 29/03/2017 01:09

Anyone with a penis should not be placed in a woman's prison.

Anyone with a vagina should not be placed in a men's prison.

If someone has a penis and they force it into another person than they should be treated as the rapist they are

Other than that I really don't care, go eat glitter and shit rainbows. You only get one life and all that. BUT I do think we need to stop naval gazing and chewing over the whole gender thing, it's getting fucking stupid and is giving people who may already be vulnerable something else to get worked up over. I also predict some very fucked up adults coming up who have had massive, life changing decisions made for them which are pretty experimental because let's face it, 30/ 40 years ago we wouldn't have pumped young teens with vast amounts of hormones on their say so.

The message given out should be to just get on with it and be happy.

BewitchedBotheredandBewildered · 29/03/2017 01:23

The fight is for women.

Not against transwomen.

It seems simple, and obvious.

Why is that so difficult to comprehend.

Trifleorbust · 29/03/2017 04:48

I love this OP. Too funny.

SallyInSweden · 29/03/2017 07:16

This reply has been deleted

Message withdrawn at poster's request.

SallyInSweden · 29/03/2017 07:24

This reply has been deleted

Message withdrawn at poster's request.

neverthetwainshallmeet · 29/03/2017 07:52

I agree with you OlennasWimple.

However, stinkingbishop, I really do feel for you and your daughter. It must be very hard for you both. You have my support and will find no judgement from me. Flowers

Moussemoose · 29/03/2017 07:55

And if you genuinely thought segregation was useless then why bother having any segregation at all? Exactly! Why do we separate on grounds of sex when it doesn't protect women?

That SallyInSweden is kind of the point. Posters when discussing 'safe women's spaces' overlook the fact that they aren't safe at the moment!

If women's spaces are not safe, and they aren't, women should campaign for individual cubicles. Toilets in schools are frequently the places where the worst bullying happens. Men don't need permission to barge in and assault or film women when they are vulnerable.

Megatherium · 29/03/2017 07:58

No doublethink involved, SallyinSweden. It's perfectly logical to accept that segregation on the basis of sex offers people some privacy and a degree of safety whilst also accepting that, of necessity, it doesn't offer any guarantees and that such safeguards as it does offer are very easy to overcome; therefore if a man is determined to do so he really doesn't have to jump all the hurdles involved in becoming trans.