To want rid of upstairs neighbour

[ChrisYoungFuckingRocks]

I live in a ground floor flat with a garden. There are two floors above me. A young girl with SN moved into the top (3rd floor flat) a few months ago. She is making all our lives a misery. She has three carers a day, and a sleep-in carer at night. I used to be a support worker for people with learning difficulties, so I am fully aware of what it can be like. However, they can't seem to control her.

She deliberately throws cigarette butts into my garden. I have to pick up 20-40 butts every day. My DD has ASD with pica, and I'm worried one of those butts are going to end up in her mouth. She throws milk and cream all over the middle neighbour's balcony and my patio. She treats me garden like her personal rubbish bin. She sits in the communal areas smoking with her friends (with a clear NO SMOKING sign right there), and leaves butts everywhere. The other day the neighbours stopped her throwing things at my car, and told me it looked like she was trying to break my car window. Neigbours had to call the police the other night as she was sitting in the middle of the road. And last night the final straw - she threw chinese takout all over my patio and garden. My garden is covered in sticky rice and other food.

The estate agents won't give out the LLs name or number (data protection). The carers won't give out any information as they have to protect their client's privacy. Her behaviour is getting worse and the carers can't or won't try to control it. The LL is by all accounts an arsehole who charges a huge amount rent (for the area) and will rent it out to anyone who can pay.

AIBU to want her out? I honestly don't think she has the capacity to live alone - she belongs in a home. And I don't say this lightly. Who can I contact, and WWYD?

Exactly sugarlightly. Also the comment about the bare minimum requirement for support work is plonking someone in front of the tv! I despair sometimes, I really do.

Unfortunately sugarlightly, I can tell you from my own experience (recent) that kind of language is being used again and jaynesworld, I think many parent carers are concerned about going shopping being seen as a leisure activity. I don't really see it as one myself. There is alot wrong with 'care' in this country :(

Chris - that is not the bare minimum.

And your repeated reference to people as 'them' gives a very clear indication of where you are coming from

Also the comment about the bare minimum requirement for support work is plonking someone in front of the tv!

I did not say that was the bare minimum for support work, I mean that is a bare minimum period. Spending hours planning a day out at the last minute is part of the job, yes, but is not the bare minimum that can be done, and that some carers do. It's easier for a lot of carers to just plonk someone down in front of the TV, instead of going out of their way to make the service user's life as rich and fulfilling as possible.

I have never just plonked anyone in front of the TV, and often used my own transport and petrol to drive my ladies to places they wanted to go. Garden centres, Christmas fayres etc. No compensation, but because they wanted to go and I wanted to take them. cue snarky remark about me wanting a badge.

And your repeated reference to people as 'them' gives a very clear indication of where you are coming from

Seriously? So we're allowed to refer to anyone as 'them', except when they have SN, then referring to them as 'them' is unacceptable? Really???? What on earth am I supposed to call more than one person? Them is the correct grammatical term for more than one individual.

It is not the bare minimum, the bare minimum is ensuring that they are safe, have their medication, they have clothing, have enough food, have their hygiene needs met, their basic needs met. If the bare minimum was spending time wondering round debenhams, social services wouldnt have cut those hours.

Sorry, that is the bare minimum. If you're not supporting people to access parts of the community they would be unable to access without the additional support then you're not doing your job properly and should be pulled up on it. That's the very least support workers should be doing; if you think taking people to their fave shops is going above and beyond then I completely disagree. I'm appalled that that's what you class as going 'all out'. That's the bare minimum. I know some fucking wonderful support workers (I hope they're the norm, not the exception).

I didnt say that you said lets go to topshop, I was using that as an example.

It is not the bare minimum, the bare minimum is ensuring that they are safe, have their medication, they have clothing, have enough food, have their hygiene needs met, their basic needs met.

Yes, of course Jayne. That goes without saying, and it would've thought it was so obvious that I didn't say it.

Op, call social services. Explain that even whilst carers are on the property this woman is allowed to endanger herself to the extent she leaves the house and sits in the middle of the road and the police had to be called for her own safety, whilst her carer (s) remained apparently blissfully unaware she had even left the flat.

I honestly struggle with what you're saying, but if that's the case, then call social services. The police call will be a matter of record.

an example of what though? In the post you replied to I talked about the risk assessment and planning involved and you still felt the need to ignore everything I'd written and write 'it's not as simple as saying let's go to top shop'. Cool, that added loads to the debate, cheers for that. Thanks for the contribution.

Oh FFS!!! How on earth did this turn into a personal attack on me? I did the bare minimum - taking them on outings, taking them to the movies, taking them shopping, swimming, for walks on the beach, gave them their meds, showered and shaved them etc etc etc. I did all that. And I then used my own transport and money to take them to other places because they really wanted to go and couldn't afford it themselves. I don't want a badge, I don't want acknowledgement, I did it because I cared about them and their happiness and because I was good at my job.

The whole point of this thread was that I'm concerned that my neighbour is NOT getting the care she needs, and is putting herself and others at risk.

The bare minimum ( however what an awful phrase ) is ensuring that the people you support have the correct support to live a fulfilled life, whatever that may be. Supporting people to make safe decisions would be part of that.

Anti - Social Behaviour is just that , regardless of who is displaying it and should be addressed in the same manner.

Take for example someone who has 20 2:1 hrs that they need to access the community. The manager of the service deems 'planned' activities such as trampolining, music classes, discos, sensory etc as priority. Classes are an hour long and a 30 minute taxi, or an hour on the bus (if they are running on time). Also, you need to fit in your food shop and pay your bills. Trying to fit in a trip to a favourite shop is hard when all the hours are planned. I wish it wasnt't like this, but it sometimes is.

You don't stand a prayer with the carers themselves, but I would find out who they work for and also contact the adult helpdesk at social services. It sounds awful OP, but now that flat is being used in this way, it is likely to remain so.....especially if the landlord is being paid over the odds to rent to the care company or local council. In honesty, I'd look at moving. I worked for a care company working with the elderly and disabled....and loved it, until they started taking contracts for mental health clients. We received no training unlike extensive manual handling and dementia training, and at times, it was terrifying. I wasn't able to deal with it, especially one very violent young lady that we used to have to go into a home for as the carers based there refused to work with her!! But most were "independent living" clients in completely unsuitable accomodation. It used to break my heart as most times, they shouldn't have been there. And with budget and care cuts, it is only going to get worse.

Having a nightmare neighbour sadly means any sympathy or good feeling you may have towards them drains away very very fast.

But it shouldn't be hard, it shouldn't be the Manager who decides how those hours are used it should be the person who receives those hours to decide. This is possible and in my experience if it wasn't it would be questioned

Chris my post isnt aimed at you.
Bonadrag1988 it was an example of how you cant just pop to your favourite shop.

That's right Jayne. I had one of my ladies for 3.5 hours on a Friday. In that time we were expected to walk 30 mins to the bus stop, go to town and walk around for an hour, wait for the bus back, catch another bus to her weekly disco (which was 2 hours long), catch another bus back, and then walk the 30 minutes again. The lady she lived with went mental if we were one minute late. I usually ended up taking her in my car, as there was no way we could fit all that into 3.5 hours. And she could be difficult, sit down on the pavement and throw a massive tantrum, so that was another 30 minutes. Yet those were my 'orders from above'.

I know daisy, I agree it shouldnt be hard.
Before I left care work to go on mat leave we had a service user who had 2:1 hours to access the community. We decided with the non verbal s.u on the day which activities to do. The managers of the service and company deemed this to be a waste of hours and we had to have planned activities which used up all the hours. The non verbal s.u cant complain, there is no way to. Although they enjoyed the new activities, the su didnt get quite the same enjoyment as say a picnic in the park.

But most were "independent living" clients in completely unsuitable accomodation. I know Jane - one of my ladies had Downs Syndrome and early onset dementia. She should absolutely not have been living by herself. It was only after she fell over in the bathroom, pooed all over the floor and basically 'stopped', communicating, moving, eating, anything, and they had to call paramedics just to get her off the floor, that they transferred her into a care home.

I know Jayne - I didn't think it was . Mainly one person who was personally attacking me.

That's true Karala. Especially when it puts my own SN DD in danger.

I would film it all, call the police 111 and log it with them. Also log it with the council as a nusiance neighbour. Your neighbours disabilites are neither here nor there. This behaviour is unacceptable and you shouldn't have to live like this.

Adults with disabilities are not children and should be not be treated as such. Hope that helps!

Ha ha!
Nope, because I didn't say they were. I said the language was based on capacity not age.