It's another inlaws AIBU...!

[ToastMama]

I'll try to keep this brief. In laws have serious form for not respecting boundaries and for over stepping the mark when it comes to our kids (7 and 3). However as it is largely well meant I have to let it be, and try to just roll with it as much as possible. They've offered (again, very kindly) to look after the boys while we're at various weddings etc this summer. I've just found out they've booked to take them on a caravanning weekend - including our puppy, who will apparently sleep in the awning (I'm assuming this is an outdoor part of the caravan? I'm not a camper)

AIBU to think it would have been polite of them to have a conversation with us first before going ahead and booking? They seem to operate on "we'll provide childcare in exchange for doing whatever we want to do with them" basis. I'm extremely grateful for the offer of childcare, but my FIL is a controlling bully and this just feels so manipulative.

Yep I'd tell DH he needs to tell them that you really appreciate all their help but please run arrangements like this by you first.

X

My first concern was the puppy in the awning. Fecking freezing!

Same here! I'm a veteran camper, and when we've had a puppy (I've had 3 over the years) they've always slept in with us. Even in summer, the nights can get very cold.

Puppies are wriggly little buggers and can escape a tent or awning with remarkable ease, even if it's got a sewn-in groundsheet (yes, the sneaky beasts can undo zips!).

I also wouldn't want a young dog to stay with someone else for 5 days unless it was someone I knew well enough to know that they treated and trained puppies like I do. Even then, I'd be reluctant to do it unless there was no alternative, like I was in hospital or something. The ILs may have very different standards when it comes to acceptable behaviour and may even be old school and believe in hitting puppies when they do the "wrong" thing.

And they are BU for arranging all this without telling you. A 3-year old is too little to be away from home and parents for that long imo and, while I loved camping trips with relatives when I was a kid, I didn't go away without my parents till I was at least 6.

How do the older kids feel about this? Are they looking forward to it?

Is there any way they can all go just for an overnight, and you could drive over and pick them up the day after the event you're going to?

I might be minded to find a diplomatic prior engagement that involves the children on a day that's in the early part of the trip, so you have good grounds for going to pick them up from the campsite. or, if that's not feasible, make other arrangements.

Does the campsite hsve self catering accomodation? Book yourselves in too, also in secret.

Top plan! It would be nice for kids and puppy and would piss off FIL no end to have his control freakery thwarted.

If the site doesn't have s/c accommodation, I'll gladly lend OP a tent, stove etc gand dog cage so they can camp too.

I just feel like they've had their turn at parenting, this is our turn

Which is fine, but then you don't ask them to have them for weekends!

The way I see it you either trust people to look after your children or you don't. If you do, you trust them to do things like camping, and if you don't, you shouldn't be taking childcare from them at all.

It's possible to trust them to look after your children for 1 to 2 days in the grandparents house.
At the same time not expect to be informed that your children are instead being taken away caravaning for 5 days.

Thank you, Huldra. And I very rarely ask them for childcare - they ask me if/when they can have them. They enjoy looking after the DC, they just like to do it on their terms... which largely I accept is a fair trade off for the occasional night out/away, but booking a holiday behind our back on the grounds that if they'd have asked I'd have been reluctant is on a totally different level IMO. Particularly given the age of the DC, dog etc.

We've seen them this morning and tried to discuss it, but FIL wouldnt even look up from his phone to engage with us. MIL is insisting the boys would love it, which is total missing the point.

Then what is there to discuss? Simply say to them that you as their parents will book any holidays they go on, and they won't be going on their grandparents holidays especially as they didn't even ask.

Puppy will escape from awning unless crated as has been said. Also, I caught someone trying to steal DC's Skateboards under the gap of our awning years ago. I may suffer paranoia but I wouldn't trust someone not to steal pup.

My MIL was a bit like yours, I trusted her with the kids from a certain age because they were pretty sensible, but never the dog. She'd never had a dog of her own so happily left open doors without thinking. SIL had to chase her dog halfway around the village after one visit to the Inlaws. She just didn't think 'dog' at all.

Huldra's post is spot on - who on earth thinks it's normal to agree to a day of childcare then blithely announce you've booked a 5-day camping trip with a 3-year-old and puppy in tow?! Bonkers.

OP, YANBU at all, and outside of the weirdos of MN who seem to think providing free childcare equals carte blanche to ride rough-shod over parents' wishes, nobody normal would think this is remotely appropriate. You need to say no to this or you'll create a rod for your own backs, it's a slippery slope.

YANBU but you need to start standing up for yourself. Why do you let them providenchildcare when your FIL is a sexist pig? I would be limiting contact with DC towards him if that how he treats the DC's mother and grandmother and any other women in the DC's life.

I would not allow them go camping with them. Find alternative childcare.

Ask your DH if he had any pets as a child. If he did, did any of them mysteriously run away or go live on a farm?

What did DH say?

Oh well now, with a five-day holiday when they were only supposed to be minding them for a day, whao! I totally get what you are saying OP. Just no!

Honestly, if you're not happy with it, don't discuss it, just say no! Your kids; in laws can go sulk if they don't like it. Doesn't sound like they are doing this to do you a favour - more as a power play

I don't think you're unreasonable either, OP.
How about this response...
"Thanks for agreeing to babysit the children and dog while we are at a wedding but we didn't realise you had already booked a five day holiday, camping. Obviously, that's too much for the children and dog at this time so we have made other babysitting arrangements. Thanks again for the offer."

Then if you want you can suggest that your DH take the children and dog to their caravan for a visit for the day.

Hope you can sort something out, OP.

Well they can't take the DC away for longer if you drop them off and pick them up before and after.

TBH I would at their attitude and would probably forgo events rather than let someone show such blatant disrespect for my parenting and such a lax attitude towards my DC welfare.

YANBU. I'd be fuming at this. There's a huge difference between having kids overnight at home where you know they're safe, and going on a mini break somewhere that you've no control over.

I personally don't like to be more than 1.5 hours drive away from DC, which some will undoubtedly see as crazy and controlling. My argument is that they're my kids and whilst they're under 18 it is entirely appropriate that I'm close by and a bit over controlling. I'd be hugely grateful for an offer to mind them whilst swanning off to a wedding, but I would expect a discussion about going camping. I might be ok with it, but as the parent that's MY call to make, not the grandparents.

Flame away

So you asked for 1 day of childcare and theyre planning 4 nights and 5 days? Id want to call the police for child abduction quite frankly. Unless you can pick your kids up after 2 days as a compromise i would cancel all contact until FIL can look up from his bloody phone and talk to you. DH would also have to be onboard or packing his bags. People dont get to take young children away for that long unless the parents want it.

So just say they can't go. Find alternative childcare for all the weddings

I would have turned off the internet if FIL was using it on the phone to get his attention. To be honest I would just call a halt to the whole thing. We went camping with friends once, their dog escaped from awning a nightmare for us.

Find alternative childcare for this occasion and your PiL go on their holiday without your children and puppy. Just tell them that you have other plans for your kids and going away for 5 days at that time doesn't suit.

I wouldn't put a puppy alone in an awning, btw. Puppies escape.

The awning thing is going to divide posters into campers who know what an awning is and who will say it's fine and people who don't, who will be horrified.

OP - the awning thing isn't a problem. Focus on the other issues.

This is very strange behaviour. I wouldn't try and come up with an excuse as that doesn't deal with the issue.

I think you need to cancel the babysitting and think about how much you let them babysit in the future. The bottom line is that your fil bullies you and mil. I'm not sure that it matters what boundaries you try and impose, your fil doesn't respect you so he won't respect your boundaries. They can spend time with the DC whilst you or DH are there.

I think you are very lucky and the kids will have fun. YABU.

Puppy/dog should NOT be sleeping in the awning!! They are either stone cold or boiling hot there's no in between, we have a caravan and a big dog and he would never be expected to sleep out there despite being 5 years old and 40kg