Meet the Other Phone. Child-safe in minutes.

Meet the Other Phone.
Child-safe in minutes.

Buy now

Please or to access all these features

AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

Judge's warning to drunk women

985 replies

FirstShinyRobe · 10/03/2017 21:47

www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-manchester-39233617

AIBU to think she had a marvellous platform with her retirement speech to issue instead a warning to men not to rape women?

OP posts:
Wtfdoipick · 11/03/2017 14:57

I actually feel sorry for any daughters of the posters screaming 'victim blaming', if you are seriously going to tell them they don't have to take any precautions for their safety

Please don't, my DC are taught that there are dangers in the world and to take care to keep safe. I'm not advocating not teaching our DC but both sexes should get the same message we shouldn't put the onus on women. My DC are more at risk of drowning or falling and breaking their necks if they came home drunk than being raped walking down an alley the message is still don't drink to excess.

Elendon · 11/03/2017 15:02

It's quite clear on here that there are posters who have no idea about consent.

But I'm sure their partners are happy sexually with them.

Elendon · 11/03/2017 15:05

Your child is more at risk of being raped than drowning, falling or breaking their necks, or being beaten to a pulp by someone. They are more at risk of being raped than dying in a car accident.

OpalFruitsMarathonsandSpira · 11/03/2017 15:05

Elendon

How does this thread prove that?

melj1213 · 11/03/2017 15:07

What if the law was changed so that if a victim had been drinking that it was automatically seen as rape

Because that's stupid.

If I have one drink then I have technically "been drinking" but legally I am still in enough control to drive (though I wouldn't as I prefer not to drink at all, legally one drink won't put me over the limit) but not to say "Yes I want to sleep with you" to my boyfriend? And if we do it anyway he could be arrested and tried for raping me just because I'd had a glass of wine over dinner.

After ten drinks I may be unable to consent but I am treated the same whether I've had one or ten then that is infantalising women - we aren't capable of deciding our own limits so the law will do it for you and say any alcohol = subsequent sex is rape.

OpalFruitsMarathonsandSpira · 11/03/2017 15:07

Today 15:02 Elendon

It's quite clear on here that there are posters who have no idea about consent.

But *

Shock

I've reported that - how repulsive is that comment!?

Elendon · 11/03/2017 15:14

My daughter is currently having driving lessons. Should I do this? Imagine the risks involved?

OpalFruitsMarathonsandSpira · 11/03/2017 15:15

My daughter is currently having driving lessons. Should I do this? Imagine the risks involved?

I'd educate her about the risks. E.g. Don't use a mobile, concentrate... keep your wits about you.

OpalFruitsMarathonsandSpira · 11/03/2017 15:17

But if she doesn't get this advice and has a bump it is only metal.

We all know what is at stake (far more precious) if she isn't warned about dangers of a night out getting shit faced.

Elendon · 11/03/2017 15:17

Sorry Opal but why would you think that's repulsive?

There are women who have stood by their partners who have been accused of rape are there not?

OpalFruitsMarathonsandSpira · 11/03/2017 15:18

Wow you're still going in that instead of apologising.

Hmm ok.

You are making a show of yourself now to be honest.

Elendon · 11/03/2017 15:20

Well, I was involved in a car crash and I can say that the drunk driver who drove into the car (and ran away on a broken foot), got off with 3 points on his licence. I suffered a fractured pelvis, with loss of ovary some years later.

OpalFruitsMarathonsandSpira · 11/03/2017 15:21

Of course you were Elendon. That's a convenient anecdote. Please do go on.

melj1213 · 11/03/2017 15:27

My rapist is 100% to blame for my attack but I made the decision to put myself in the situation where he had such a golden opportunity to attack me without getting caught. My actions didn't invite his attack but it gave him the perfect opportunity that he might not have otherwise had. Perhaps if I had made another choice and walked home through a busy street he would still have attacked or I had got a taxi the taxi driver would have attacked but I cannot and will not go through life assuming everyone is a potential attacker and that every man walking down the same street as me is waiting to pounce because I would never leave the house if that was the case.

Therefore I don't assume everyone is an attacker but I do consider the risks of any decision ... so which is riskier, walking home in a dark park or through the well lit area? Which is riskier, walking home alone or getting a pre-booked taxi through a registered taxi company? It is about personal risk assessment

You cannot control other people and there are people out there that willingly, knowingly and actively break the law even thought they know it is wrong, because they have no concern for anything but themselves.

You cannot change everyone, you cannot prevent them from committing crimes but you can protect yourself - man, woman or child - from becoming one of their victims by being aware of your own actions and making decisions based on your own personal safety.

So yes, you should have the right to walk unmolestd through a park at 4am, but in reality the rapist in the bushes doesn't care about your rights, nor does the mugger lurking behind a tree. So you can be stubborn and walk through that park and take the chance with your personal safety or you can be sensible and take the longer, but well lit and busy, route home because it significantly reduces your risk of becoming a victim of crime. That is not victim blaming, that is taking responsibility for my own personal safety.

Foureyesarebetterthantwo · 11/03/2017 15:30

I think there is a big difference about teaching personal safety and saying 'never go out and drink as you might get raped'. The second is unrealistic, young women do go out and drink, so do young men, whether you like it or not it's the primary way they socialize and most of us have done it too (or should the only women that don't drink be young ones?)

I teach my girls to follow their instincts, not to be polite if someone appears off or threatening and move immediately away, to keep their phone on them, to go out in a group, to get a taxi home (and always a proper one not some dodgy guy), walk each other home and stay over rather than walk home alone and so on.

You have to be realistic though, you could be attacked by a taxi driver, you can't get a taxi from a tube to your home if it's less than 10 min and hanging around waiting for one puts you at more risk than just walking briskly, and it's also not realistic to say never drink at all, as even one drink blurs your cognitive function.

I just don't find the advice 'don't drink' realistic, our society has commercialized going out on a Fri and Sat night for partying yet women who are tempted by cheap offers, encouraged into pubs/nightclubs by councils and government who have offered 24 hour drinking, but then are then vilified if anything happens to them.

InsiderOut · 11/03/2017 15:34

Elendon
It's quite clear on here that there are posters who have no idea about consent.
But I'm sure their partners are happy sexually with them.

WTF, Please give one single example of one poster who 'has no idea about consent'. I don't believe you can because there isn't one.

You keep making these ridiculous untrue sweeping statements about what you imagine other posters might possibly be thinking.

I can't tell if you are posting because you genuinely believe what you are saying is true or whether you are just posting to cause arguments. You've been asked numerous time to give examples to back up your far fetched claims about what posters on this thread really mean or think but have failed to do so.

KindDogsTail · 11/03/2017 15:37

Handbag

What if the law was changed so that if a victim had been drinking that it was automatically seen as rape because alcohol is deemed to impair someone's ability to consent therefore they could not consent. Would rapists still target drunk women? Who would they go after next?

It already is supposedly rape when someone has been drinking, but in practice the defence barrister says that she was not all that drunk, just drunk enough to lose her inhibitions and that she did consent,

Lots of people do have consensual sex when they are drunk so it is all easily manipulated by defence barristers and rapists acquitted.

In this case where the rapist was sentenced it was only because a witness heard the girl screaming. Usually there are no witnesses.

WHo would they go after next? In some cases, I think, maybe no one. I think there are some rapists who are opportunistic about entitlement in certain situations and take advantage.

SarcasmMode · 11/03/2017 15:38

Elendon some rapists are sadistic - just not all. Not every rapist is the same.

KindDogsTail · 11/03/2017 15:39

I meant "are opportunistic and feel entitled"

Elendon · 11/03/2017 15:51

Not every rapist is the same. Really Sarcasm ? Care to elaborate?

OpalFruitsMarathonsandSpira · 11/03/2017 15:53

You think every rapist is the same Elendon? Hmm

Batteriesallgone · 11/03/2017 15:53

I still think this line is disgusting, and it's the one she chose to end on:

'please be aware there are men out there who gravitate towards a woman who might be more vulnerable than others'

She seems to have no awareness that for some women vulnerability isn't a choice, or a one off thing on a night out, and it's almost like she's prepared to throw such women to the dogs. I can't square what she's saying with real concern for rape victims and rape prevention.

InsiderOut · 11/03/2017 15:56

Elendon
It's quite clear on here that there are posters who have no idea about consent.
But I'm sure their partners are happy sexually with them

Are you going to give an example of a poster who has made a comment that makes it clear that they have no idea about consent or not?

It's tiresome how you make these sweeping statements but refuse to back them up. You are happy to insult people but won't actually reply to anyone who is asking you to clarify or give examples.

OpalFruitsMarathonsandSpira · 11/03/2017 16:00

I do wonder if we are trip trapping over a bridge... no one is this cluelwas, surely.

OpalFruitsMarathonsandSpira · 11/03/2017 16:01

Or clueless Blush

Swipe left for the next trending thread