To think most Dubai naysayers are hypocrites

[WhisperedLoudest]

Not at TAAT more a TAA lot of threads.

Repeatedly on MN people say they'd never go to Dubai because of Human Rights issues at the same time as announcing they'd much rather go to do yoga in India or sightseeing in Morocco.

It seems rather hypocritical and an attitude that is very particular to Dubai and I suspect something to do with being perceived as trashy not disagreeing there

So if you have objections to Dubai on moral grounds where do you go? Do you apply same strict standard to other countries.

I've often asked on those threads where people do go but never received much of a response.

Watching Tropic of Cancer really opened my eyes to the abuse of migrant workers in Dubai.

One of my oldest, most trusted friends lived there for a while and couldn't wait to leave, which tells me everything I need to know about the place. She had to wait until she had permission from her husband to leave I believe.

Her feeling was that it is superficial, money orientated (conspicuous consumption), the distinction between ex pats and local people is very hard to circumnavigate and as a country there are still big issues with imported slave labour and ill treatment of those who aren't rich or educated.

Not sure if the comment on page 1 about the Michael Korrs bag is for real - but that captures what I don't think I'd like about it.

I do apply the same standards to other countries. There are many countries I won't visit based on the way they treat people/animals etc. Dubai is just one of several on the list.

I'm guessing that the country that is seen as the most racist/uncultured/backward/sexist, etc. posted on MN is Australia. Far more than Dubai.

How the fuck?

www.independent.co.uk/life-style/health-and-families/health-news/female-genital-mutilation-fgm-case-per-hour-uk-nhs-circumcision-a7564571.html

What about this? FGM may be 'illegal' in the UK, but it's still widespread and not a single successful prosecution in the 22 years its been outlawed.

We're not exactly shining lights.

The point I am making is that in Dubai, you can't actually prosecute someone who has genitally mutilated a girl, because it isn't illegal. That's a different issue to the ridiculous fudge in the UK where successive governments are afraid of tackling 'cultural practices', and where the process is far more underground within some communities, and where you can't just nip down to your local GP practice with a five year old.

I still don't get why it's 'hypocrisy' to not want to go somewhere where you really don't like the way they do things.

Why is that such a bad thing?

www.independent.co.uk/news/world/asia/rape-victim-dubai-united-arab-emirates-uae-extra-marital-sex-report-detained-in-dubai-police-charity-a7422326.html

I'd rather spend my money and time elsewhere. Why is that hypocritical?

It's not hypocrisy.

Stick to your guns.

I travelled a lot

No where have I seen migrant workers treated so terribly while everyone else swans around in such luxury

I have seen terribly poverty next to wealth but not such a huge divide with nothing or so very little in between

It is that that I just cannot justify it's a country that is built on slave labour and is fine with exploiting people simply becuase they can and seem to see nothing wrong with behaving this way not becuase economics determines they have a need to but simply they can and do not think these people are worthy of treating any differently

My partner and I don't go to countries to which we are ethically opposed.

This includes Dubai for its horrendous human rights record and Morocco for the occupation of Western Sahara. There are a number of other places we won't go either.

I don't think Dubai is "trashy" at all. It's a super lavish high end destination which has built a huge tourist industry. But I don't approve of the way this infrastructure has been created.

That said, I don't go about making comments on other people's holidays. I know someone who refuses to fly for ethical reasons and it does come over as rather priggish.

@Astoria7974 said "I spent most of the holidays there [dubai] in sleeveless knee length dresses."

Astoria, my idea of a perfect holiday involves me being outdoors all day (in comfy about as revealing clothes as you describe), climbing mountains or cycling or kayaking etc. Not necessarily with male chaperone. Is that possible in Dubai? Is it just a shopping mall...

Whatever their human rights abuses, I think it's possible to do the active holiday thing somewhere like Russia or Maldives. I know of tour-guide holidays walking in Morrocco mountains that would allow it, too.

The four times I've been to Dubai, two business trips, two stopovers on the way to somewhere else, there's been too much stink of sewage. So no, I wouldn't go there for pleasure and as I'm retired now, I don't have any reason to consider a trip there. The perceived risk to me as a woman is also a factor.

i wouldnt go to dubai because as a fair skinned redhead the sun would and the heat there would finish me off and shopping and beaches is my idea of holiday hell , in the last two years places i have been to have been Paris, Rome, motorbiked through france, stayed in the black forest in Germany, Austria for a few days, Switzerland for a few days and then back through Germany lake constance for a couple of days and France and going to Cornwall this year, in the past places ive been to have been Turkey, Barbados, Holland, Belgium, Cyprus, Corfu, Tenerife, Tunisia, i go somewhere because i like the place not because of ethics soz

I would not go to Dubai. I know lots of non- Mumsnet people who wouldn't go to Dubai too. There are lots of other places I would rather go than Dubai.

I would go on holiday in the U.K., to France, Ireland and to Scandinavia. Possibly Germany, Spain, Italy. All colonial countries yes, but they all have a considerably more robust approach to human rights than Dubai. If not going to Dubai makes me a snob then so be it. I draw the line at Dubai.

"It's a place that in modern day times is built on slavery"

This ^^ sets Dubai apart from other countries with dodgy human rights IMHO.
It is a different order of wrong and I wouldn't be comfortable going there.

I'm going to Dubai this year and I can't wait! 3 nights at the Atlantis before moving on to Bangkok 😁

Atlantis has been on my bucket list for years so I'm looking forward to ticking it off. There are polical / moral problems with a lot of countries - you'd be a hypocrite to say you won't go to one but you'd go to another!

There are polical / moral problems with a lot of countries - you'd be a hypocrite to say you won't go to one but you'd go to another!

But by going to all of them, you are such a perfect, morally superior person, because you are not a hypocrite. Yeah, right.

Seriously. Dubai is just the evillest country ever. The misogyny they share with a lot of countries (to which I would not travel either), but the slave labour I believe is unparralleled.

And what for? Shiny shopping malls.

See, I could understand if someone went there to see the landscape. All countries are different, and there may be unique plants and animals that can only be seen in places that are misogynistic hellholes - would be hard to see desert flora without dealing with misogyny, for example.

But fucking shopping malls and hotels? Really?

I don't think people from countries such as the UK and America really have any right to be critical of other nation's for their human rights violations - Pot, kettle, black!

Um, as German, I can feel plenty morally superior to Americans (and I do), but I would sooner travel to the US, even with their current president, than to Dubai.

In the US, a man who rapes me will likely not be punished.
However, it is also unlikely that I will be imprisoned for reporting the rape.

There are different levels of horridness, and Dubai is several degrees worse than the US. And the US is much, much, much worse than the UK. (What, exactly, ARE the human rights violations committed in the UK? Not doing enough against FGM? That's hardly the same as a government actively killing women.)

I've been to Dubai. I always said I'd never go for a holiday but I went with work so maybe saw a different side to it.

Was there for 3 days. And had an amazing time.

People turn up their noses at Dubai because it's new money.

No, I "turn my nose up at going there" because of the hideous way they treat women.
Eg that case a while back (sorry, can't remember names) in the news where a woman reported being raped and SHE is the one who gets arrested!
Fkn sick.
Why would anyone female want to go to a place that treats them so appallingly?

I have no desire to visit Dubai, but nor do I particularly want to visit Egypt, Morocco or India either because I hate the thought of visiting places where women are treated so appallingly. And dozens of other countries too.

I love the idea of travel, expanding my horizons etc, but I don't want to bring my hard earned money to countries where I experience relative freedom as a visitor yet would have minimal rights if I lived there.

It is not being unreasonable to want to be able to legally kiss in public hold hands even if not married or wear a sleeveless top on holiday.

I wouldn't go to Dubai, even if it was a free holiday.

Why would anyone female want to go to a place that treats them so appallingly?

Yeah, I really don't get that.

I mean, it is not like only buying fair trade products and stuff, which you do because you have a conscience and don't want other people to suffer - it is literally safer for a woman's life to not go to Dubai.

This is unique to women, this willingness to participate in one's own oppression.

I cannot imagine any other oppressed group berating each other about how "hypocritical" it was to not want to go to a country where your legal status is about the same as that of livestock.

Seriously.

"Seriously. Dubai is just the evillest country ever"

Fine. It has faults, but SERIOUSLY - worse than Stalin's Russia, worse than Hitler's Germany. FFS.

I cannot condone the treatment of rape victims and women caught in custody battles, or the treatment of migrant workers but that does not = "the evillest country ever".

"where your legal status is about the same as that of livestock"

Another one confusing the UAE with Saudi.

It is not being unreasonable to want to be able to legally kiss in public hold hands even if not married or wear a sleeveless top on holiday."

In practice you can do all of these things and nobody would be rude enough to comment, but it is polite not to do so. Go to the malls and you will see people in sleeveless tops every day of the week.

I know I sound like a complete Dubai apologist - I'm not, just can't stand some of the ignorant comments that are being made.