Transing a 4 year old

[ShadowChancellor]

On Monday, all the children at my kids school were taught about being transgender because the parent of a reception kid have decided that X is actually Y and are now sending their kid in as the opposite sex and have changed their name.

According to my kid they were shown a video that was all about how if you were a boy and liked girl things and girl clothes you were a girl and it was all very positive.

No parents were told before this happened. We only found out when the kids came out of school on Monday and told us.

AIBU to a) think that transing a kid at 4 years old is more to do with the parents not liking the fact that their kid prefers girls toys to boys toys and b) that the other parents should've been told before they showed our kids this film and promoted it all in school.

Its caused a lot of confusion with the younger kids who think you can change whether you are a boy or girl just by wishing it and didn't mention at all all of the problems that it can cause.

@Werkzallhourz - nothing to add, just wanted to say what a great post. Very insightful. Thank you.

That was in reply to Datun.

Yeah brilliant @werk, it's really helpful to ground this in actual examples.

Not opposed to supporting transitioning at that age if there has been some mental health assessment and discussion.

This however:

"According to my kid they were shown a video that was all about how if you were a boy and liked girl things and girl clothes you were a girl"

is a fucking disaster.

ben

God. I'm seeing too many similarities to Hitler Youth here.

The indoctrination of young children, teenagers opposing their parents view and calling them bigoted, party-line guidelines given out across the board, all of it state sanctioned.

You are right to be chilled and who it's going to rebound on is women, kids and genuine transsexuals who wouldn't hurt a fly.

Queer Theory is very wrapped up with paedophilia, discussions of it being a 'sexual orientation' etc and heavily wrapped up in the liberal, sex positive discussion of 'child sex work' (again, this whole liberal view of prostitution and the rape and exploitation of women on film as 'work' has chilling implications). Google Janet Mock. She thinks child prostitution is liberating and empowering.

I've seen transactivists who openly declare themselves 'men rights activists and anti feminists' dog piling feminists in their support of the transing of children. I've seen mothers of trans kids talking about 'support of the trans community' from these people, mothers taking advice from these people.

My peak moment was Bruce Jenner - he's pro trump, anti gay marriage, anti abortion, has a $1m boob job, kept his dick, still has PIV sex, and likes dressing up in ladies undies (I bet he has hours of fun all by himself) and somehow me being a little bit suspicious and refusing to call him brave, or to agree he deserved to take a place from a woman as 'Woman of the Year' makes me transphobic.

Another was Frank Maloney, now Kelly, by his own admission a wife beater who nearly strangled his wife to death due to the stress of his 'gender confusion' - he's now on the NHS website as a trans casestudy. That flies in the face of all we know, all the data, on domestic violence and why men beat up women. Even better, if he did it now, that crime would be recorded as committed by a woman.

These dudes NEED kids as part of their fantasy - they have erotisized being a woman, and as part of their 'we are the most oppressed women every to walk the earth' narrative they need that story that things would have been so much simpler if they could have transed as a child.

Scottishdiem, have you seen the DSM (psychiatric) criteria for transing children if they are assessed by a mental health professional? The criteria are the problem!

I think these criteria run counter to Sex as a protected characteristic in the Equality Act 2010 and I think women need to get organised and fight it legally on that basis as WOLF are doing in the States.

Is there a WOLF uk? Do we need to look into setting one up?

I should also add that I know several lovely transwomen, they are gender critical, extremely disturbed about the transing of children, outspoken in their support for women's concerns, and deeply worried about how this will all backlash on them and their community.

These transwomen know and accept they are male and believe the solution to trans discrimination and violence is to 'widen the bandwith of male' rather than insist they are literally women.

I fully support them wanting to live their lives as they choose, in peace, free from discrimination (who wouldn't?), and I support surgery and hormones for adult dysphorics who simply need to find a way to live inside their own skin and nothing else has worked.

This is not about being anti trans, it's about being anti trans ideology and gender self ID and Queer Theory, there's a very big difference.

I believe the way to do that is to deconstruct gender as a harmful, warping social construct ....

Nothing at all to do with rejecting or erasing people.

Beyond

I don't think so, I think a coalition of parties united around this issue would work (WOLF are collaborating with a Christian Family Values organisation) and I know of one or two individual women challenging some of this insanity legally.

Quite how we'd organise it I don't know. But I do think parents need to be emboldened, from what I gather, when universities, schools etc have had the Equality Act explained to them, and the CEDAW UN rules the UK is signed up to, they back down fairly quickly. That's just parents here and there I've heard speak about this.

Meanwhile people should write to their MP, I believe the women and equalities committee second reading of their Gender ID bill has been pushed back to the end of March so there's still time to raise objections.

The real issue is self identification and trans pathways for kids (for e.g I didn't realise until recently that the 'Gender expert' GP who is wheeled out in support of trans kids, has only ever done a one hour training course online, via the RCGP, provided by a transactivist organistion, it's not even provided by medics. You do the course, print your certificate, start drumming up business, that doctor even uses the Gillick competence criteria for prescribing hormones to underage kids without telling their parents.)

If more people spoke up, it'd really make a difference.

We need to be braver I think.

GirlScout what I find the most incredulous is that the Gender GP, Dr Webberley prescribes medication on the basis of an email, this is truly unreal - see this from one of her patients:

"I am a transwoman and after initially seeing my GP, I found my self worrying about how I would have to wait for over a year for my GIC appointment. I wanted to prevent further changes due to testosterone, including the loss of my hair. After a long time looking for faster routes, I began to lose hope and reached the end of my tether but managed to stumble across My Web Doctor. I sent a email message and was shocked to recieve not only a reply, but actual prescriptions for the medications that I needed. To this day I don’t know where I would be if it hadden’t been for Dr Webberley’s amazing online serve. I have recommended it already to all of my transgender friends who reside in the UK."

Susan Snoad

Hulababy, here's a link to the video. It's a Daily Mail link, sorry.

There's pretty much nothing that I agree with in this video but one thing struck me as particularly outrageous. The text claims that being trans is genetic which is rubbish. I feel that teachers and educators generally should be analyzing the content of this material. Had people done so I don't think they could have shown it.

The level of stereotyping in "I am Lily" is grotesque and regressive. I find it deeply offensive.

This thread has really opened my eyes.

The last 24 hours have fel like a "lightbulb moment" for me; trying to separate my feelings as a feminist and someone who doesn't agree with sharing mine and my dd's female spaces with trans-women, has bothered me for a few months now. I felt like I ought to be supporting a minority group of people but it has never sat right with me. This thread...wow.

I want to thank those posters (@GirlScout72 @BenLinusatemyhomework @Wekzallhourz @RufusTheSpartacusReindeer @Whitestuffisnaff and others) for their posts. The video of Biology Isn't Bigotry made it clear why we need to not shut up about this.

This world scares me sometimes.

These transwomen know and accept they are male and believe the solution to trans discrimination and violence is to 'widen the bandwith of male' rather than insist they are literally women.

Fully agree with them.

An organisation challenging the trans agenda, the event in Sheffield on MP3 is worth a listen: www.radfemcollective.org/no-platforming/

Is that the video they showed the children?

The one where they talk about 'boys toys' and 'girls toys'?

Not sure if this John's Hopkins has been posted but this link was just sent to me: www.acpeds.org/the-college-speaks/position-statements/gender-ideology-harms-children

Kourtney - mumsnet has definitely made me change my opinion.

I'm not surprised that autistic children are more vulnerable to this sort of black and white thinking.

DS (autistic) at 14 was terribly distressed for no obvious reason after a PHSE day. Months later it emerged that they had heard about paedophilia, and that it meant attraction to underage children. So, being attracted to 14 year old girls, he'd decided he must be a loathsome paedophile, and that he must never mention it or he would be arrested. Took bloody ages to disentangle that one. Thank goodness nobody told him that liking soft toys and ribbons made him a girl.

KatieCave, so sorry to hear that your life is a nightmare. There are other posters here in your position who can offer more informed advice. But I didn't want to leave your post unanswered. This is what I have learned:

Steer clear of Mermaids. It's an activist group and parents are encouraged to push for transition as soon as possible. Here's a link to one article about Mermaids. The CEO of Mermaids flew her child to Thailand for surgery when he was 16. It's a homophobic and misogynist organization. In a recent court case the judge refused to treat them as experts. They are not a scientific body.

The suicide statistic that Mermaids pushes - and even some HCP do, to their shame - is a lie. Trans kids are no more likely to attempt or succeed in suicide than many other teenagers. It's a vulnerable age.

Refuse blockers. There are a lot of really good links and resources on this thread on the subject. Another parent in your position asked about side effects when the clinic suggested blockers and her questions were basically brushed off. So she looked them up for herself and refused them. Blockers have a lot of really serious side effects. I suggest you read up on them. I believe Lupron is the most frequently used.

The long term prospects of adults who go through medical transition are very poor. They think that transition will bring them happiness but older transwomen have a sky high suicide rate. I'll look for the link, but off the top of my head I think it's 19 times the norm. Basically, if you protect your child from transitioning they are more likely to have a happy future. Trans adults are a very unhappy group with poor MH.

The trouble is that if you refuse blockers the clinic will discharge your DC as blockers, followed by hormones, are the only treatment they offer. There is a fixed belief that counselling is a form of conversion therapy and that, instead of exploring why a child may think they want to transition the only option is to press ahead with medical - and irreversible - transition.

You may, as other parents have had to do, find yourself and your DC completely unsupported if you refuse blockers. But considering that 80% of children who express gender dysphoria grow out of it if left untreated, it seems to me that - although it may be a lonely road - it's better to leave your child untreated than to start on a path of surgery and lifelong medical treatment.

You have got to wonder where the hell biology teachers are in all of this in schools!

nice

Quite relieved to read that link of yours. But dang! It's common sense. Shouldn't haven't to even be said!

GirlScout I was a biological science lecturer at university - if I were still in post I would be raising merry hell about all this - as I am no longer in that position I am doing all I can to raise awareness by for example writing to Maria Miller MP and have "plagiarized" the trans narrative by stating that I feel my entire academic and professional career is being "invalidated" by the trans rhetoric.

Soul

LOL, I hear you, I'm hoping the W&EC have had lots of letters of late, as well as MPs. And as I'm fond of asking TA's, 'where do babies come from?' - I distinctly remember THAT biology lesson! Much staring at shoes and red cheeks in my class!

x

Werkzallhourz - Agree with your many important points. Thanks.