To think the abortion rate will increase after April this year?

[RocketQueenP]

When the new rules on tax credits / universal credit come in ie when no one can claim benefit be it top up or otherwise for any more than 2 children

Sadly I am helping a good friend cope who has just had an early abortion, she did not plan the pregnancy and one of the main reasons is she and her DH are low earners/ They already have 2 at school, and won't be able to afford to have this baby. She is devastated and has admitted they could have squeezed another DC in if it wasn't for the new rules. I think this will happen a lot. :(

In times gone by people would adopt out children that were unplanned that they couldn't afford and I really feel that this is what we are headed back to. Not adoption but, you get my drift

I also think the government fully know this and its one of the reasons they have brought it in. Simple population control

I don't think it's population related as people are still free to have children, more about parental responsibility.

Not all children will become tax payers of the future, many won't just like many adults aren't now. If we do get to the stage of needing more tax payers then there is immigration.

People will still have children, they just need to pay for them. It's not like China with a limit on couples.

The majority of contraceptive failures are because of incorrect use. Contraception isn't that unreliable. And the reality is that if you need whatever the amount of additional tax credits is to be able to afford a third child then likelihood is you already have children you can barely afford so would make bloody sure that you don't get pregnant again. Millions of couples seem to do it.

I do think that couples need to be given greater access to sterilisation however, as I routinely hear of couples being refused even though they say their family is complete.

But we should not be living in a society where people feel they can rely on benefits to live whatever lifestyle it is they want to live. If you can't afford more than two children, then don't have more than two children. Take risks and the state shall provide should never be something we aspire to.

Child tax credits, verbena. I think you can keep child benefit.

30 hours a week free childcare sounds great on paper.

Not a single nursery round here is offering it though - they'd go under if they did, apparently.

What about those that have good jobs, have 3 or more children and then get hit by job loss? End up in low paid work as nothing else available and need to claim tax credits for the first time, but can only claim for 2? What happens then?

Rape or coercive control if no longer living with the perp and can provide evidence of conviction

Lol ok. Because conviction rates for both are soooooo high.

and can provide evidence of conviction or suitable third party evidence

So this pretty much invalidates the exemption doesn't it? Or are they planning to massively overhaul both the speed of and rate of rape conviction?

Xpost helpmebuy

People don't want the government to tell them how to live their lives yet complain when the government says "your choice and responsibility".

I thought it didn't apply if one partner was working? Might be wrong though.

Am I correct in thinking it doesn't apply if you or your partner work more than 16 hours a week?

Anyone know if this is correct?

We don't need a rise in birth rates to support the economy. Automation is coming, soon.

I suppose we could go down the route of enforced euthanasia . Right then, who's aged parent/ disabled child first? Yours or mine?

Right, the state not paying for 3rd children is just like euthanasia.

No job is guaranteed, likewise nobody has a cast iron relationship.

It's like any other financial commitment, you decide to proceed knowing if anything happens you will still have those outgoings. Some people do it anyway as believe everything will remain rosy, some just don't think about it as their wants come first.

Maybe now, instead of believing someone else will pay more will have to step up and provide by whatever means possible.

How does this affect families where one parent has a first family? E.g. My exP and I have two Dc together however he is now married and although he doesn't intend on any more children it is possible. Would he and his wife (who has no children) be entitled to tax credits? Exp doesn't claim any CB or tax credits for our DC. I do.

Afresh.

No that's the benefit cap

Contraception is free on the NHS and pretty effective. There are obviously people who have contraception failures but statistically that ought to be fairly low, given that correct condom use or use of the pill is 99% effective.

The reality is that tax credit spending has got a bit out of hand. Something has got to give, and the public made it pretty damn clear that they didn't want the salary cut offs for tax credits to be altered when the government tried to do that.

What about those that have good jobs, have 3 or more children and then get hit by job loss? End up in low paid work as nothing else available and need to claim tax credits for the first time, but can only claim for 2? What happens then? - If they have good jobs then surely they can put money aside for such occasions? Hopefully the decision will make all people, working or not, stop and think (and plan) the future much more careful. The government initiative may just make more people take stock and act more responsibly in the future, surely that's a good thing?

So we're looking at eugenics then at heart ? WannaBe The idea that people genuinely want to live on benefits is insane. The idea that people aspire to have an lack of purpose in life is crazy. Honestly. The media fed ideology of 'benefit scroungers' really suggests a lack of insight into psychology and sociology of people.

Sorry just googled and don't think it is. God knows where I got that from.

We are one of the few countries that provides a pretty exhaustive welfare state. Two kids is enough if you can't afford to have any more. It's not the state's job to pay for people to have as many kids as they want.

This ^^

one

It only effects resident parents, or each household.

So man has 2 kids moves out gets someone else pregnant he is free to do so and the state will fund his 3rd child but not if 2 kids already reside with him

The idea that people genuinely want to live on benefits is insane. - No it's not. I know lots of people who genuinely want to live on benefits, and they do. They know the system like the back of their hands and know exactly how to get the maximum amounts of money from it. You might want to believe that such people don't exist but I can assure you that they do!

The UK is plenty rich enough to pay but chooses to allow businesses to escape tax and gives cuts to the government's rich friends.

Even though automation is coming it doesn't replace all jobs - we are still going to need people to look after us when we are old, so perhaps supporting families, even poorer ones, is a wiser move than this. But alas the government, and most people, don't look to the future but instead want short-term solutions for long-term issues.

What happens if youve had 2 children who are now adults then fall pregnant again ?? Would you be able to claim ??

The number of people I know who get caught mid 40s and had no plans whatsoever to be doing the school run again is unreal. But these things happen (( apparently it's dues to a huge hormone surge, basically the body singing last chance saloon before the menopause hits ))

Some of you seem woefully unaware that contraception can (and does, hello ds3) fail

Regards multiple pregnancy: Where two children do not already make up a claim.

Scenario: One child already. Finds out pregnant with twins - so one foetus has to go? And before any decries of 'unfair' or 'exception' think about it from the standpoint of the comments made already. Clearly no one wants to take on the responsibility of saying 'well rules are rules'. That is a moral and ethical minefield. And pure inhumanity.

Abortion should be choice. Poverty should not be made into a reason for it.