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AIBU?

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Original poster

To think friends are being over-senstive?

999 replies

pomadas87 · 20/02/2017 18:51

A friend (who lives abroad) messaged me and a couple of our good mutual friends - he shared happy news of his new baby and some pics. Everyone v excited and wished him congratulations!

He then said "so who's next to have a baby - she needs a playmate!" ... me and DH are newly married and are getting the question quite a lot...! Other friend said "I'm looking at you guys" (meaning me and DH)...

I then said "not for a while I'm afraid Grin why don't you have another one straightaway and you'll have Irish Twins - instant playmate!"

Meant it in a joking way and then they all called me a racist, xenophobe etc.... I didn't realise it was offensive and now I'm feeling shitty! Did they overreact to my (stupid) joke or am I just an idiot?! Confused

OP posts:
bunnylove99 · 20/02/2017 21:06

sibys1 your post is spot on. The term is offensive, derogatory and best avoided.

shinynewusername · 20/02/2017 21:06

Like most of these things, not offensive if used in Ireland, by Irish people, of themselves, but rude from non-Irish people. See also jokes about Jewish mothers, redheads etc.

Well done, OP, for having the grace to admit you have got it wrong.

ILikeBeansWithKetchup · 20/02/2017 21:06

Well the sun always shines on the (self )righteous !

I still haven't gathered the pluck to tell the Head of my school that 'coloured' is not the best word to uses these days.

JaxingJump · 20/02/2017 21:10

Ha! I always thought Irish twins was something to be proud of. I'd be proud of my bravery. I'm Irish. I hear Irish people using this term anytime anyone has babies within 12 months. it's never used in a derogatory way, more in a 'I can't believe you are having two in 12 months' way. It's something special.

Lockheart · 20/02/2017 21:11

I've never heard of the expression "Irish twins" before. Had to google it.

To me "black and tan" is a colour and pattern found on dogs like dachshunds.

And I'm another one who had no idea the expression "throwing a paddy" was anything to do with the Irish. I just thought paddy was a word like strop. I remember my mum using it but can't recall if I've ever used it myself.

You learn something new every day.

SanityAssassin · 20/02/2017 21:11

There's no agreed definition of race Sanity and many see it as a social construct anyway, so saying something about a particular nationality/ethnic group can indeed be seen as racist. (That doesn't mean I think OP has been racist in this example).

If there is no definition of race then it would be impossible to be racist? or just a carte blanche to call anything racist?

ILikeBeansWithKetchup · 20/02/2017 21:13

I offer you the UN definition:

The UN does not define “racism”; however, it does define “racial discrimination”: According to the United Nations Convention on the Elimination of All Forms of Racial Discrimination,
the term "racial discrimination" shall mean any distinction, exclusion, restriction, or preference based on race, colour, descent, or national or ethnic origin that has the purpose or effect of nullifying or impairing the recognition, enjoyment or exercise, on an equal footing, of human rights and fundamental freedoms in the political, economic, social, cultural or any other field of public life.[24]
This definition does not make any difference between discrimination based on ethnicity and race, in part because the distinction between the two remains debatable among anthropologists.[25] Similarly, in British law the phrase racial group means "any group of people who are defined by reference to their race, colour, nationality (including citizenship) or ethnic or national origin

m0therofdragons · 20/02/2017 21:13

It's a phrase I've heard my Irish family use so I've never thought of it as racist. Must be exhausting getting so upset by life all the time.

auntyhiro · 20/02/2017 21:13

Apologise then make sure you call them racist nazis on every single comment and generalization they ever make.

People from norfolk... northerners...english...conservative voters

Every single time

Gwenhwyfar · 20/02/2017 21:16

"If there is no definition of race then it would be impossible to be racist? "

No, because you can still discriminate against people you believe to be of a different race from you.

NataliaOsipova · 20/02/2017 21:17

Why is everyone so bloody rude and self righteous these days?

I agree with this! You see, if Beans had a quiet word with her Head and said "you know, that isn't a good term to use", that'd be fine. Public spirited, even. But what you might see these days would be a campaign to get her ousted from her job on the grounds that she was a racist. There's just too much emphasis on semantics these days. I think context is always king. If someone expresses an openly racist/sexist/disabilist view, then they should be called out on it. But it's very wrong to accuse someone of doing so just because they have thoughtlessly used a proscribed term. I think that is bullying behaviour itself.

TheTroutofNoCraic · 20/02/2017 21:20

I'm Irish...and an Irish Twin (DSis 11 months younger) and it was a commonly used term in Ireland when I was growing up there. It has never occurred to me to take offence to the term.

ToElleWithIt · 20/02/2017 21:20

I'm Irish. I'd consider it ill-judged and a bit ignorant coming from someone not Irish. It is used here in Ireland with only slightly negative connotations, but sounds worse when used by someone non-Irish. A few years of hearing "throwing a paddy" "paddy wagon" "a bit Irish" can really grind you down. I think as a race we mostly take it with good humour and self-depreciation, but it doesn't make it any less inappropriate.

TheWinterOfOurDiscountTents · 20/02/2017 21:20

It doesn't have to be racist, or offensive, or a big deal.....its just something that makes you sound a bit of a tit.

It doesn't have to be either "hugely offended" or "you're so stupid to be so bothered", you know. There is a huge spectrum in between. One could be mildly miffed, for example. Or momentarily ticked off.

ILikeBeansWithKetchup · 20/02/2017 21:21

My head is a man btw.

I attempted public spirited once when I suggested homophobic banter was maybe a bit 1980s and also that the term 'Scottish twat' was maybe a tad racist.

NotAMammy · 20/02/2017 21:21

I have only been on here a few months and I've seen this come up several times. Some people insist it's terribly offensive, some will tell you that your friends are ridiculously easy to offend. I think the general rule of thumb is to exercise caution around people who might be easily offended.

I'm Irish and Catholic and have no issue with it.

ILikeBeansWithKetchup · 20/02/2017 21:22

I think I am in the mildly miffed tom ticked off camp by this one!!

BitOfFun · 20/02/2017 21:22

I agree, Natalia. If I unintentionally used a phrase that had racist connotations, I'd expect friends to not leap to assume I'm a bigot, but point out to me why it was problematic, so I could make sure I didn't upset anybody in the future.

SanityAssassin · 20/02/2017 21:26

No, because you can still discriminate against people you believe to be of a different race from you.

But if there is no definition of race so how could I possibly think someone was a different race to me let alone discriminate? I I'm just replying to the pp who said there is no definition of race which really isn''t correct.

I believe there are races (as do most of these science types who study this stuff - not acceptable to be racist or to take the piss out of the same race Irish which is what Irish Twins is more about.

bumbleymummy · 20/02/2017 21:26

It's strange - I've never thought of 'having a paddy' as a reference to Irish people. Doesn't it mean having a tantrum - what's the association with Irish people?

BitOfFun · 20/02/2017 21:28

Rolling round drunk and aggressive, that one. Not very nice at all. I doubt many people make the connection toon nowadays though.

Luciferthethird · 20/02/2017 21:34

I often wind my brother and sister up that they're Irish twins. It's not taken offensively nor did I think it would be.

NotAMammy · 20/02/2017 21:37

Never made the connection with 'throwing a paddy' either. I'll stop using that one as that is offensive.

I would be pretty pissed off at any 'friends' who kept giving me stick for not having kids yet and then jumped on my back if I said something that was unintentionally offensive

OMGyoumustbekidding · 20/02/2017 21:40

I think had there been bad intent then it would be different. Your friends are being ridiculous and should have just told you nicely and moved on.
You would probably then go and find out about it and not say it again.

Asking about your reproduction is weird. Next time they contact you tell them you are desperate to fulfill their wishes and therefore you are to busy shagging to speak to them.

CantSleepClownsWillEatMe · 20/02/2017 21:41

I doubt many people make the connection toon nowadays though

Yes, I think this is true of both the "throwing a paddy " and "Irish twins" phrases.

The thing is, some of us do know the etymology of those phrases so surely it's understandable that we might be a little put out when it's used and doesn't mean we're easily offended as some here have suggested!

Those who don't take issue with it have been clear that they weren't aware of where the phrase came from or had only heard it in a lighthearted, jokey way. Thats fair enough but if people explain where it comes from and why it might be considered offensive, then surely it's best to bear that in mind rather than imply that they are easily offended or overreacting simply because you're ok with it?