To feel weird about stranger wanting to put dead wife's ashes in my garden?

[Dottie39]

We bought our house 5 years ago. At viewing elderly couple told us they had lived here 50 years, since early 60s and had brought four children up here and they seemed like it was a slightly reluctant sale.
Anyway, fast forward to this morning when I get a call from the gentleman to inform me his wife passed away last month and on her deathbed had asked to be returned to our house. He asked if we would mind if he and the children had a little ceremony and scattered her ashes in the garden.

I feel like we can't refuse as so sad and obviously the house holds a lifetime of memories for them. But... I don't know, it just feels a little weird, I feel like we would be intruding in our own home to be here so would have to leave them here. AIBU to feel weird? I really want to refuse but it feels so heartless to do so!

LEELULUMPKIN are you seriously saying that you would sell a house without providing that information?
Well so the OP has to be "nice" and let them but then it is ok to sell the house to someone that might completely alter the garden because they dont know?
That is not righy

This is such an interesting discussion. I am basically with BarbarianMum and MouseClogs - if you can make it work you should. But, the repeat visits would be the thing I would be worried about. And feeling that I was obliged to keep x rose in x place or whatever.

We also bought a house that had been a family home for 40+ years, the older daughter asked to pop in after her mothers death (we saw he outside and invited her in).

She was lovely and glad, but she cried as she realised that house was now gone. It had changed so much in every way, and clearly was now a new place entirely and not the house of memories she still thought was there. It was in a weird way something she moved on from, but she said she hasn't been since. They may find this.

Personally, I'd be happy to welcome a visit for them, but not scatter. I'd hate to have the responsibility of a bush I'd probably kill, or be wary of removing dirt or adding patios etc in the future because of it. Also, this may sound heartless, its now our home and it would affect my feelings. I'd worry about future visits, imagine if they saw a dead bush/ patio or decking in the spot or my children digging trenches? I couldn't be sure I'm offering a peaceful spot, and it's likely at least one family member would struggle with that. I likewise wouldn't dream of asking for it to be done for me.

I think it was very very rude of them to ask!

Haven't read the full thread, but what I would do is this.
I would suggest that (has been mentioned) it be suggested to the family that the ash be scattered where they can visit easily. However I'd offer that they bring a very small amount to scatter in their mums favourite spot in what was her garden, and come to remember her for an hour or so.
And I'd offer tea and cake.

I'm not particularly good with people and I don't like people visiting etc.

But for some odd reason I'd be fine with this I think. Even if they did visit at other times.

This is actually quite an unreasonable and awkward request to make of you and your family, the people whose home it is now. I'm surprised so many people think they'd be ok with it. I'd be inclined to politely decline, explaining why it's not appropriate for you.

I too think that you should say no. It's uncomfortable to do but your garden is not a graveyard.

It's now your home, to live in how you want, and having the remains if Mrs X at the bottom of the garden IS going to impinge on your ownership. It would be like they owned a bit of your garden.

What's that WW1 poem - "there is some corner of a foreign field that will be forever England"

Well in your case it would be "there is some corner of the garden which would be forever grandma". And someone else's one at that.

No, absolutely no.

I think this is a fascinating thread. Has the OP been back? or have they just set up their interesting little moral/social dilemna and left us to it?

For me, (and I realise this may seem somewhat of a digression, but bear with) this thread has helped me understand what has been going on with some of the post-Brexit name-calling and general nastiness.

So as I see it there are two main groups of people:

a) those who wouldn't be bothered about scattering a stranger's ashes in their garden and would say yes
b) those who would feel uncomfortable about scattering a stranger's ashes in their garden and would say no.

Within group a), there are people who say they quite understand people in group b), and think group b)'s position is just as valid, just different.

But there are another small subset of a) who can't understand that people in group b) feel differently and perhaps have beliefs about death or values about their home and garden which would make them feel very uncomfortable granting this request. This subset of a) are the ones using words of group b) like cruel, selfish, heartless, "why would you tell a bereaved man to f off?"(paraphrasing)

So this subset of group a) interpret a difference in beliefs and values to group b) as group a) being morally superior.

I think this is what has happened in some cases with the Brexit vote. Some remain voters, rather than accepting that leave voters have different but equally valid values and beliefs to them, have, because to them voting remain was an obvious decision, decided that this demonstrates their moral superiority. They have interpreted a difference in beliefs and values to being morally superior (and cleverer of course).

Please note I am not talking about all or most remain voters. I am talking about the minority who are continuing to call leave voters very nasty names (see the comments below this Guardian article if you are not convinced this is going on - illiterates, morons, uneducated, inbreds, idiots, just a selection to illustrate).

www.theguardian.com/politics/2017/feb/08/mps-reject-brexit-bill-amendment-to-protect-eu-citizens-in-uk

Of course I would! Why on earth would a new owner even need to know that? Where do you draw the line? Not buy a lovely house because someone had possibly buried their pet budgie/dog/hamster or scattered their nan's ashes over the roses 20 years ago?

It's just dust, it's not going to rise up in the night and spook you or affect the value of your property in any way. Nature will spread the ashes anyway.

1. Scatter ashes on garden. 2. Ashes sink into earth. 3. Worm eat's earth. 4. Blackbird eat's worm for tea. 5. Blackbird flies off, lands 10 houses down and craps on your car/garden. Ooooh nooooo! Spooky ashes, tell the street it might affect their house prices.

As I said in my first post a body is totally different as is burying an urn with them in (I get that that might freak some people out if they dig and find it) but ashes no, it's purely symbolic and nowt to do with a new owner.

And I do realise I may have set some kind of record for the most tangential attempt to shoehorn Brexit into a MN thread yet

Confused, have you looked up the definition of rude? In what way was this request rude?

I think it's absolutely awful you've been put in this dreadful position. If it was me I'm afraid I would say no (I think the offer of the garden soil is a very good compromise though). I realise this equates me to being a heartless bitch to many on this thread but I feel it would intrude on what is now MY home and I would end up feeling very resentful if I allowed the ashes to be scattered.

I still think it is the right thing to say yes, because it is important to them and would make them happy. But you could gently point out some of the practicalities, like whether a future owner (or you) concreted over the garden, and also that the house is different now and so whether it still feels like the right thing to do, and also that if they wanted to visit they might find the garden in a bad state and would that make them feel bad, and also that they might prefer somewhere where they can access more freely.
I know it is not your duty to let them put the ashes in your garden or explain all this to them, but sometimes we have to go out of our way to help other people and be kind otherwise what kind of world is this?

LEELULUMPKIN well that's one of the issues, surely? The family of the deceased may want to visit in future. If the house is significant to them now, it won't become insignificant upon a second change of ownership. What expectations would OP be setting up for the family if she gives permission, and does it impose an ongoing moral obligation on her?

I'm sorry, I haven't read the full thread, but do you have a front garden?

If so, could they plant a rose or something there? with the ashes underneath?

Wrongtrouser - as I scrolled through I thought you had put that in the wrong thread but no! I think you make a good point and I am in camp a and think camp b is selfish, but I am trying to understand their viewpoint because what you say is right. This actually applies to most mumsnet threads doesn't it. They are a lesson in trying to understand that other people hold different, but equally valid, views. It's not easy tho!

No. You've been there 5 years. I would bet a million pounds this won't be the end of it. They will want to come back on birthday, wedding anniversary, anniversary of death. You give a little and people want more. I might sound heartless but I really do think they've got a cheeky to even ask, I wouldn't dream of it.

Making Merry - IF the OP had given permission to the deceased's relative's to make further visits' then YES of course I would tell any potential buyers that they might be getting a knock on the door. However if I did allow them to scatter them in the first place I would make it clear that it was a one time thingy and now MY garden was not a memorial garden - ie: open for future visits. I think this would actually solve the OP's problem as it may cause the family to have a rethink.

Wrongtrouser - spot on except there is also the section within the leave voters who are equally intransigent about those who voted to remain. Now they have won they feel they are morally vindicated to spout vile nonsense about people coming to our country blah blah blah, loony lefties, special snowflakes etc etc

So there is a minority in each group who do not accept the other group's right to a different and equally valid opinion and take the debate to the lower level of personal insult.

I'm really surprised so many people think burying the ashes is a preferable option, if their wanting to "visit" is really the issue here.

If they bury her ashes in OP's garden that will be her final resting place and they'll be far more likely to ask to visit her.

If OP agrees to allow them to scatter a few small handfuls as a ceremony, then she will disperse and they'll find another permanent resting place for the rest of her, which they can visit.

That seems by far the pragmatic solution to me.

(OP, I really don't think it's unreasonable at all to say "yes, of course you may have a ceremony in our garden, but we'd prefer you only scattered a few handfuls".)

And we scattered my dad's ashes in an equally personal spot to the OP and I know my mum now regrets not having him closer to her as she doesn't feel that she can just go and talk to him whenever she feels like it as she could if she had him closer.

At the end of the day a house is just bricks and mortar, it's the people within the family who make the memories.

My kids father (my ex) was tiny and I was shocked how much ashes there were.

He has been scattered in an outdoor place, he is in two necklaces, some are buried in the graveyard and I have the rest in a box and quite a lot is left. He went very far.

I wouldn't be too happy about it OP. It's your home now and if you are really against it you need to tell him. I don't think that would make you an arsehole at all. I wouldn't like it if the family starts wanting to come round often just to be in the place where she was scattered and that is quite likely to happen.

I'd probably say yes (though I have a tiddly garden & cats so they'd have to be buried otherwise I'd end up with Dear Old Lady being trodden indoors or crapped on in the border (and then eaten by DDog!). But I'd be making it clear that visits weren't part of the deal!!