To be shm after children are at school

[Notthinkingclearly]

I have 2 dc who are 6 and 9. Since my first child was born i have been a stay at home mum. My DH works away alot abroad so I am often on my own. My Dc's have not been the most robust and have both had quite a few weeks off school with legitimate reasons over the last few years with hospital appointments. I have felt that if I had been at work I would have been a rubbish employee. I seem to be really busy all the time but feel I am constantly justifying to everyone why I don't have a job. I look after a relations 2 year old one day a week, help in school one day a week and I am a member of the schools PTA. I don't go out apart from supermarket or a walk during the week and only ever sit down to eat my lunch during the day. Am I as spoilt and lazy as I am made to feel?

oh there is no point me working as once childcare cost is deducted, I'm not earning much" oft expressed on this thread
Only the opinion of a pointless lazy SAHM but I suspect the logic is that irrespective of who is paying for it, if childcare is only 100 pcm less that one person wage, then it isn't necessarily FINANCIALLY worth the return to work in the short term

There's enough school holidays to keep all the geese fed Sailaway we dont feed ducks we eat th

Thanks Lizzie

WizardSally "The depressing thing about this thread is not only those who think it's ok not to work and to live off another human for no reason at all other than laziness, it's the putting down those who manage to hold down a full time job and run a household."

I think it is depressing you seem to want to categorize stay at home parents as some sort of sponger. You seem to only value work that is paid. I find that sad. What couples chose to do with their child care arrangements is down to them. I know a woman with a very good job whose husband is a stay at home dad. I don't judge him or feel he is sponging off her. I respect them for their choices.

I think we are all different, clearly single parents and many couples will not have the chocie for one or or both not to work. But if they have a choice it is not a 'moral' issue. It's a choice.

I think it sounds like jealousy really. I may be quite jealous that others have exotic holidays, a nice sofa, two cars in the family, but it is their money and their choice how to spend it! There is a serious issue for women (or men) who give up a career to be the main carer at home. They do need to have protection, I'd never want to do that kind of thing if I wasn't married to the man.

I've only known one couple in real life where the couple actually shared child care 50/50. I know a lot of people, one family only did 50/50! I think 50/50 would be ideal. But until job sharing becomes a real option for most people it will not work because most jobs that are part time are low paid, low status, sometimes insecure (as in not necessarily a long term contract) and sometimes demotivating! So two people doing that kind of a job each would possibly not earn enough to fund the family.

Two people sharing equally similar job shares (not necessarily in the same company, obviously) meaning both have 50% earning capacity of a full-time job could really work and give both equal time with kids.

But society will need to move in a different direction to the one it is currently going in for that to be a reality, IMHO.

Please don't tell girls they can have it all, it sets up unrealistic expectations. Tell girls and boys they can't have it all, they have to make the best choices they can and be happy with them.

You can tell your dc whatever you want. I don't tell my dd that she can have it all, but I do model on a daily basis the fact that it's entirely possible to have an interesting, well-paid and fulfilling job and have plenty of time for the dc, do school runs, attend school events, take time off when she is sick etc.

If others choose a different balance, then that's fair enough, but I certainly don't want my dd to limit her expectations or aspirations.

I'd not want a partner who didn't see me as an equal. If they expected me to play house whilst they worked they would be in for a shock. Quite sad that so many suits can't function in the working world unless they have a person at home.

As for working parents paying for every service under the sun, I highly doubt it. No one I know has a cleaner, gardener, recipe box delivery etc. They just get on with it themselves. Something wrong if you can't manage a house and work.

Whilst we portray the imagine of women don't work and men provide there will never be true equality. I'd hoped we had moved on from the nineteen fifties and that girls were aiming just as high as the boys. How depressing to see that so many show children that boys get no choice but to work all hours whilst the girls see they have a house to look forward to cleaning and a man to look after.

What's particularly depressing is that when the estmated 50% of you end up divorcing, you will realise that your husbands got a sweet deal out of all this and you got the absolute shitty end, but for now you think it's wonderful. I certainly do not envy SAHPs.

Daily baby stuff, thank you! My mother was in a similar position once my father left.

Blimey. This makes for depressing reading. Not a lot of mutual support and appreciation going on!

I think dailybabystuff (6-Feb-17 23:29:14), who has grown children, made a very important point about the long view of this issue, which I am not sure that anyone has picked up on.

It seems to me that the persistent problem with discussing this issue is that people don't want to admit that there is no perfect solution: there are advantages and disadvantages, and we are all muddling along.

SAHParents do get to have more time and more flexibility with their children, which may lead to all sorts of nice things for the family, or may lead to a frustrated and dependent parent and kids who don't know how to make their own toast.

WOHParents do get to have independent working lives, which may lead to all sorts of nice things for the family, or may lead to over scheduled, stressed families with little time and intimacy.

I am a SAHM, who got the balance wrong. I loved being with my children when they were younger, and felt that it was a wonderful and valuable way to spend my time, but I didn't work enough outside the home, and now I am isolated and insecure.

From day one of having kids, I have been happy to admit that there are advantages to working outside the home, and in real life most WOHP seem happy to reciprocate. On here, too many people are defensive about their choices.

Well I've worked and I've been a SATM and being at home is a million times better. I've not missed a single moment of my children's lives I've been very lucky and my DH appreciates me being home

Yes, I've been both and both are crap /good in their own ways. Working part time is the best option imho, you get a bit of security at least. It's just a tricky time in life whichever option you choose. Snipping about it helps no one.

Seems to me that the jealous insecure people are unsurprisingly insecure in their relationships, and jealous of those who are secure enough not to worry about DH leaving.

I mean, what's the point of getting married and having children if you're so concerned that DH may leave at any moment, that you effectively work for free to pay someone else to bring up your kids.

Everyone has different situations. As Clara said - there are pros and cons to both.

I feel for working mums, especially those working FT who still seem to have the lions share of doing the house snd kid stuff and have always been happy to help with their kids before and after school snd school holidays. I think they do a great job.

Who works for free?

I've always earned plenty of cash. Far more than the cost of any childcare ( we used virtually none) and the help we have in the house .

And I don't work because I'm afraid DH will leave me ( I mean he might but I can certainly pay my own way if he does).

I work because I like it. And (like most men) I manage to do it and be a decent parent. Go me.

Only read half the thread so far, but can only say, isn't it a coincidence how many husbands and fathers have jobs with looong hours and frequent trips away from home? And how many jobs women do would would not pay enough to cover childcare.
Its almost as though there is no expectation that parenting ,housework, appointments and being in for the plumber should be equally split or that both parents take a hit to their career...

I suspect a lot of men make no effort whatsoever to play an active role in family life.

I mean, my DH is pretty successful, yet he doesn't need 100% total absolute flexibility .

that you effectively work for free to pay someone else to bring up your kids.

Why do these threads always kick off so much? Why do people have to make judgmental snide comments about other people's choices?

I think both sides feel defensive.

" IfNotNowThenWhenever

Only read half the thread so far, but can only say, isn't it a coincidence how many husbands and fathers have jobs with looong hours and frequent trips away from home? And how many jobs women do would would not pay enough to cover childcare."

Yes yet the individuals always see themselves as the exception. "Well in our family dh happens to earn 10x what I do and so in these rare circumstances it makes sense for me, the woman, to stay at home."
completely failing to see this is pretty much how it is in society and fit's with expectations of men provide, women do not work or do a little job for pin money.

I work because I like it. And (like most men) I manage to do it and be a decent parent. Go me.

I agree with you. Go Carl. I don't work because we don't need the money and I felt strongly that I didn't want my children to be looked after by someone who is paid to do it. And (like most women) I manage to be a SAHM and have an interesting life that I like. Go me.

(I'm not remotely defensive, by the way. I am a highly educated person; I am fully aware of the upsides and downsides of my own decision. If I were in different circumstances, I may have made a different decision. As a result, comparison is pointless. But I'm not the one flinging insults at "all working mothers".)

I had dinner last night with a friend (partner in US law firm) whose childcare bill in 2016 came to €62,000. That's before taking account of food and accommodation (full board) for one of her nannies. And she still has childcare crises.

natalia everything in life has up sides and down sides.

My morning down side is that I am on a train to Salford!!!

Why did the BBC move to Salford of all places? Someone? Anyone?

Apologies to any residents of Salford but by God, it's depressing.

It is one of the global elite's most staggering achievements, to convince the feminist movement that it should embrace a hyper capitalist ideology. It has persuaded the developed world that to structure their lives around wage slavery is noble and pro-feminist.

Alot of very brainwashed people are the direct result.

Traditional women's work has been so carefully maligned and undermined that any woman who enjoys it is dismissed as stupid, uneducated. A Stepford wife.

A most successful hijacking.

I agree with you. Go Carl. I don't work because we don't need the money and I felt strongly that I didn't want my children to be looked after by someone who is paid to do it. And (like most women) I manage to be a SAHM and have an interesting life that I like. Go me.

Me too. Yay go me!