To think it's common sense to let a w/c user have the w/c spot

[SparkyStar84]

I've just seen the ruling on disabled people getting priority in disabled spots on buses. Isn't that common sense. What kind of person would deny a w/c user the space because 'pushchair'?
I'm a w/c user it makes it easier in a way to get about with children, though I know some w/c users still have a buggy.
This is about the parents who refuse to move, when asked, by someone who might have an appt or something important to get too. Not saying the parent doesn't. But isn't that the point of foldable buggies over great big travel systems?
It just bugs me that people have had to leave the bus because a parent wouldn't move. As a parent with kids of many ages, also remembering times gone by, the purpose of easy foldable buggies is that you can decamp when on the bus.
Do you think it's an issue that buses need to provide buggy spaces too?

user it doesn't matter. In your scenario the Mum may not be a twat, but she still doesn't have priority over the wheelchair space. Thats just the way it is.
If you don't feel well enough to use the bus under the existing terms of services then don't use it. Simple as that.
Wheelchair user and buggy pusher are not interchangeable.

User1471, it doesn't matter about the individual circumstances of the parent and buggy. They have a short term limitation.
Wheelchair spaces are there to remove the long term barriers to everyday life that wheelchair users experience, and are provided for wheelchair users.

The mum with the c section, baby and one year old is in a relatively short term situation that she may well have planned for and had choices about (not nec the c section). She may be able to access a range of support- get a lift, ask a friend to baby sit or come along to help her for this short time. Before wheel chair spaces and drop down busses, people stayed home more. They did their shopping when partner could help. They organised life so they didn't need to go out with a c section,and two children under two.

The wheelchair space allows wheelchair users to access public transport.

Just want to point out here that (while I am on the wc 'side') a bus redesign could be beneficial for wc users too. Sooo many buses don't have enough space in the wc bit to actually get my powerchair on myself - DH has to lift and bump the back.
This also applies to accessible toilets. Stupid architects.

User, if the lady with the c section can't manage the bus for whatever reason then she will have to make alternative arrangements for that tiny amount of time. The wheelchair user may well have a lifetime of transport difficulties.
You have no idea whether or not it is painful for the wheelchair user to wait.
Using phrases like 'militant in her rights' is unacceptable.

It doesn't matter what you'd 'expect 'chips
The fact is that legally, your £2.80 is the cost of transporting you from a to b. It does not necessarily entitle you to a seat, even at non-peak times.

You would think it would be.

Yesterday on a facebook parenting site I saw one of the admins post "why should I buy I pram/ buggy I don't really like because I use busses"
Then " they say they want to be equal so why ask for special treatment"
Then this gem "should I just not have kids because I don't drive"

This is a young woman I have known all her life and would have always thought she would be sensible and fairly decent.

Of course when she was challenged on her pathetic views she just switched off the comments so nobody else could disagree.

People like that are very real (and selfish vile little pricks)

You can pay £120 for a train ticket and that doesn't entitle you to a seat. Just ask Jeremy Corbyn maybe not

Another thing to consider... the lady with the c section is not the ONLY lady that's had a c section and has other children that rides the bus. If they all use the wheelchair spot, who is to say the next bus has one in that spot as well, and the next one... and when they're healed and not needing that spot, there are plenty more mums that have had c sections to take it... You can see where this is going.

www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-4136592/Woman-t-bus-beacuse-mother-won-t-buggy.html

Just after the ruling this happened. There were people complaining that a wheelchair user asked for an empty buggy to be folded down so she could get on the bus as what if the mum wanted to put the children in it.

Tbf if you aren't healed enough from a c section to lift the buggy, it's not recommended you go out pushing one either. The strain is similar. And you should especially not be lifting them off and on buses. If you're well enough to do that, you're well enough to lift a pram section or vacate the bus

Like someone said upthread, some people are entitled twats. This doesn't change when they have children.

So all those saying people are bashing parents - no just selfish knobs!

If I had been on that bus I would have moved the pram myself out into the road given a choice

This happened in Dublin a while back. Very similar situation a mum with a child in a buggy was in the w/c user spot w/c user wanted to get on bus. Bus driver went down requested that the mum fold up buggy and sit child on lap so w/c user could get on. She refused driver and other people on bus offered to help her, she still refused result w/c user had to wait for next bus. But it wasn't that simple because not all buses have the w/c accessible ramp so the w/c user had to wait for 4 more buses to go by before a w/c accessible one came along with ramp. There was loads of debate about it and many felt the bus driver should have ordered the mum off the bus but driver said they could only request they move not order them to. Majority of public appalled at mums attitude.

I hate this entitled attitude that has crept into society and I am sorry there is never ever a situation where a mum with a buggy should get priority over w/c user spot. I used to walk to bus stop with baby in sling fold up pram out on bus sit with baby in sling and then when off bus transfer baby to pram simple and that is with toddler and buggy board in tow. There will always be someone including bus driver who will help you if needed.

I wonder if it was Trifle sitting upstairs refusing to fold.

user I have just had a ceserean and I have a one year old. I would move out of the space immediately.

Why is it so difficult to understand?

Hopefully people know that most parents aren't entitled twats, we're just normal people going about our business who know what 'wheelchair accessible space' means.

green no risk assessments need to be written for generic journeys not every bloody journey don't be ridiculous.

Anyway hope this judgment helps clarify that wheel chair users have priority over buggy users.

militant wheel chair users ?!

Some people need to check their privilege.

Getting sick of this "whataboutery." It's disablist and twattish.

Hopefully the individual wc user would not be militant in their rights if explained to

Maybe stop using the word 'militant'. It is wrong and unnecessary.

The video is even more shocking as it seems the bus passengers defend the women who has the pram. Should have got the police, named and shamed the people. Let them get abuse back for a while.

dulra it's disgraceful isn't it. What an absolute cow. I would be tempted to have filmed her and put it out there.

Militant wheelchair user!!! Wtaf!

I feel a bit depressed after this thread. I know most posters are decent and wouldn't dream that they should use a wheel chair space for a buggy and not move but there are a few defending their rights to equal sharing of the space.

You might expect this on FB as there are always idiots but I expected better of mumsnet.

I also feel mumsnet HQ should look further at some of the disablist comments here and intervene.

People have just got used to it, is all. Most parents today have only used buggy friendly buses so they assume it is their right to wheel their buggy on (as long as there aren't other buggies already). They don't realise that it's a concession not a right. In addition, many of them have never considered buying a second smaller buggy, which used to be essential if you wanted to use the bus, and have never practiced folding it one handed so assume its an impossible task.
Given all that though, most decent people accept that they should be considerate of wheelchair users, disabled people, old people, etc and if they aren't I would assume they are very badly brought up.

I think the only comfort is that most people on this thread are saying ' I would move' and anyone who doesn't is an idiot. If my child refused to move I would be asolutely mortified and think I had done a rubbish job. And these are grown adults.

Given all that though, most decent people accept that they should be considerate of wheelchair users, disabled people, old people, etc and if they aren't I would assume they are very badly brought up

But you know, I see a continuum between the attitudes on here which are twattish about wheelchair users, and those attitudes about standing up for people more generally on public transport - also long-running threads.

In both cases, there's one attitude that is around: "I will make a judgement about who deserves me to move/give up a seat, rather than follow a general rule of thumb (or legal decision)."

Most people make kind reasonable judgements, but we see on this thread (and others) that people who see themselves as kind and reasonable do not always make kind & reasonable judgements.