About partners on the ward after childbirth?

[hullabaloo234]

Booked in for ELCS for breech baby.

Just going through this week's post and find a letter from the hospital about what to do/not do prior to the op, what time to arrive etc.

At the back is a letter for my "support person", with a list of do's and don'ts for their stay on the ward with me after my section.

Sorry, WTF?! I love DP dearly but not a chance do I want him or more importantly a load of other blokes on the ward.

I was already going to discharge myself the following morning but was realistic about staying a bit longer if needed- bollocks to that I am definitely leaving as soon as my catheter is out and I can walk again!

Am I the only person who thinks this is really bloody unreasonable?!

So if you have your baby during the day, you can have your partner there to help when you simply can't and the staff simply can't do it all. But if you are "fucking selfish" enough to have your baby in the middle of the night, you and the baby can just struggle on until visiting hours?

I shall make sure if we ever have another that he/she arrives during the daytime then !!

I think it's the fanaticism of natural birth and if you didn't/ couldn't have one without medical help then you're in the wrong. I feel there's definitely an element of expecting/ deserving suffering. No other ward would treat surgery with 2 paracetamol or expect patients recovering from anaesthesia and major blood loss to get their own breakfast.

The only hcp that have spoken to me with contempt are hospital midwives. Community midwives are ok. Other hospital staff fine. Senior midwives fine.

I'm having a consultant led elcs in a couple of weeks so my only exposure to hospital midwives will be on postnatal. The trust is under intense scrutiny so I'm hoping the staff are on their best behaviour. Just hoping I have an uncomplicated section that means I'm not 'ill' as last time I was ill and it took two days to finally see a dr that properly medicated me.

I'm really angry about how women are treated and the crap we're supposed to put up with.

Increasing population + hospital cuts + realisation that women don't need a week in hospital after a perfectly natural birth (such as my DM had with me in the 70's) = conveyor belt system that we have now, I think treaclesoda. It's gone far too far in the other direction since my mum had her own room and a midwife helped her with every single thing!

Where did it all go wrong from the end of the 70s onwards Treacle? Hmm.....

It was very strict in the 60/70's babies slept in a big nursery separate so the women could rest and visiting times were very restricted

There seemed really to be more consideration for mothers get the desperately needed rest that is vital but who wants to sleep away from their baby

And with you first baby you stayed in at least five days my mum stayed in 10 days

Yes, I'm not arguing that we need a week in hospital after a straightforward birth. But I just think we have moved so far in the other direction that it's become quite barbaric. There are far too many people (I'm one of them) who had a long traumatic labour and a c section at the end and are outright refused decent care afterwards, particularly wrt pain relief. I've had a few surgeries in my time, some big, some small. I was refused pain relief after both c sections, but woke up on a morphine drip after a couple of much smaller surgeries. The contrast was incredible.

Not sure if it's been picked up on yet but the Daily Fail have nicked this thread.

🙄😡

Oh FFS. Does not one of their journos have a creative or original bone in their bodies heads?!

I wonder if the change in training has bearing on this. Years ago to be a midwife you first had to train as a nurse for 3 years then get some experience under your belt before getting onto a midwifery course which I believe was 18 months. Now they train straight into midwifery for 3 years . I wonder whether the lack of general nursing training and ward experience is a factor.

What I find shocking is the complete lack of empathy from some posters.

To the woman who boasted about her dp refusing to leave after visiting hours, did you ever, for one second think that there may have been a woman in there with you counting the seconds til visiting hours were over so she could have an examination/discuss personal issues/run over to the loo/let out post c section farts etc without fear of embarrassment? And the frustration she must have felt at your partner refusing to leave?!

I personally think the solution is a few hours a day (im talking like 3),where partners HAVE to leave so women can be afforded some level of privacy. Ideally a few hours in the day and then a few in the night so women can sleep without 6 other snorers!

Even then I'm sure there would still be some selfish cries refusing that.

www.dailymail.co.uk/femail/article-3980700/Mother-Mumsnet-user-starts-furious-debate-saying-men-shouldn-t-allowed-stay-maternity-ward-overnight.html

realisation that women don't need a week in hospital after a perfectly natural birth

But why is it that all women, incl all the ones that havent had an easy natural birth (whatever that mens btw) are then expected to be treated that way?
Why is it that women who have had extensive surgery are treated the same way, when, even in a time of budget restrictions etc etc, in any other department, they would be treated better?

So yes about this crazy idea of an easy natural birth available to all women who want it. For the others, its obviously their fault
I am also wondering if this isn't also about the fact that no man ever gives birth so who cares about what women go through?

temporary

Not having a go...different experiences and all that

But when i had ds 1 "naturally" dh stayed with me til about midnight and was sent home after i got out from surgery

Does that actaully happen, women have an emergency cs and the husband is sent straight home.

Happy to believe it does due to hearing some of these horror stories.

I don't think men should be allowed to stay either. Looking back best thing I did was book a private room. It was £60 a night 20 years ago. The first DC was emergency caesarian and I was kept in a week and only paid one night. Partner was there doing all the running around, freeing up staff for others, and he slept on fold down bed. Second DC I was out in one night. With first DC there were two fights (one an argument one got physical) on the maternity ward that first week due to the stress of men/women/babies all strangers living in close proximity. To hear that women gave up breastfeeding due to lack of privacy is horrendous.

I don't know about overrall policy, at the very top of the NHS where it is male dominated but I actually found, as a patient, that it wasn't the male doctors who were reluctant to provide pain relief. It was the female midwives. Even when the doctor prescribed pain relief, the midwives response was always 'well, let's just try without it first and see how you get on'. I actually wondered if they might be on some sort of performance appraisal where they are rewarded for administering fewer drugs?

It's nice for people to have their husband there but not all the time - my husband wouldn't stay anyway lol but it's not nice when your bleeding/ breastfeeding and struggling with pads / stitches etc -to have strange men wandering in and out of the room .

And by 'let's try without it first' they meant 'you're not getting it. At all'

Interesting thread, fwiw I'm learning a lot. I hadn't realised how strong the feelings were about this. I do get the privacy thing (the idea of not being able to close curtains is horrifying) but for me at least privacy means not having people looking. Whether they're male or female doesn't make that much difference.

Urgh, the daily mail at its finest. What comments:

Pfft if i wasnt alloud in for the birth of my child he would of been born at home

What a twat.

Men have no place on a women's ward overnight unless they are staff.

I'm lucky enough to have had my babies in France where they try to give you a single room, if that's not possible you get a double and wards with curtains don't exist. Dads are not allowed overnight but they would bend the rules for a distressed woman in a single room. Single rooms prioritized for c section, multiples, first time births and anyone with an episiotomy. You generally stay in 3 or 4 days (more if breastfeeding not established/baby gaining too slowly/mother not ready to leave support or still in need of pain relief) so it would be horrible to have no privacy for all that time.

There needs to be enough staff to look after women and babies properly in the UK.

I wish more hospitals had private rooms. Ideally for everybody, with enough staff to cover. The thing I was most desperate for in hospitals was sleep - I had a 2-day labour and then a baby who was awake all night, and the only sleep I got was an hour or so in the evening after partners left and another in the morning before they all trooped in again. No chance of getting any rest in the day. I don't know how I would have coped with partners 24/7 and no quiet time at all - I was hallucinating from lack of sleep as it was.

When I gave birth to DS (now 6) I had a horrid labour and birth and was then put on a ward with 12 other new mums. Partners were there all the time though I think there were visiting hours no one really seemed to adhere to them. It was lovely chatting to the other new mummies when it was just us and the ward had no visitors, having said that it was lovely to watch DH with his new baby too, after all, the first baby should be equally enjoyed by both parents IMO. Having said that, although we had flimsy curtains between patients for privacy, they did nothing for sound privacy. The poor young girl next to me arrived on the ward with the babies dad who spoke at 1000 decibels all the time, you could hear the poor Lass asking for some spare knickers from her bag and he got the complete arse because although he hadn't packed her any clothes or underwear ("surely that's provided from all the tax I pay?!") he HAD bought her fresh coffee and croissants (what more do you want?) as well as a list of office duties she was required to do as soon as she was back on her feet, could she please email a man called Peter and would she mind moving to a private room because there was no need for her to be in a ward with this lot. (Meaning us other mothers I think) I had to laugh as off he stomped up the ward to demand a private room. I did ask her if she was alright, she looked exhausted obviously but mortified more that I'd heard it. She may well have been appreciative of stricter hours for visitors.

Can't tell you how happy I was when we moved and the local hospital to us now is lid out with only private rooms. It definitely made recovery after birth of DC2 a lot calmer and easier. And then each woman can choose her own times and companions presence without upsetting the others.

Good luck with your birth OP

I see were still focused on letting men bond with babies. This is not the purpose of post natal wards, nor should it be any consideration. Women are on post natal wards because they are unwell following childbirth. It's not a family bonding camp.

2 ELCS, out next day both times as hospital policy to avoid infection so long as you wanted to/seemed well enough. Ask for catheter out so you can get moving around as soon as you feel able, ask if you can have a shower as soon as poss too. Other men on the ward a fact of life.

I imagine that's because its much easier to ignore sick patients who are stuck in bed and can't get out than it is to ignore their healthy advocates who can actually walk up to them and directly ask for help.

Actually it's because visitors aren't demandinf little irrelevant chats about the nurses perosnal views, asking for cups of tea to be made, listening to people moan about paying for parking and generally getting under their feet.

I don't want strange men gawping at me post birth, but I don't want strange women doing it either (and no, it doesn't make it any better for me that they have given birth too - I have zero interest in 'bonding' with strange women so fuck off is it ok to have curtains open if there's no men around).

No one is asking you to bond with anyone but women have to be there, their partners don't, and they will want as much privacy as you, whereas men have not been through a medical procedure.

f someone told me shortly after birth that they were taking me away from my baby for no good medical reason for 12 hours I'd probably try to break bones to prevent them. No idea why its suddenly acceptable if the parent is male.

One more time for those who aren't reading - it's because men are not patients. Postnatal wards are not bonding centres for men and babies. They are to take care of women and babies who need medical attention. It would be odd to do it to a woman because she's given birth. This is quite simple. Men are visitors