Meet the Other Phone. Protection built in.

Meet the Other Phone.
Protection built in.

Buy now

Please or to access all these features

AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

...to give people assistance with claiming PIP?

437 replies

IwasateenagePIPassessor · 25/10/2016 22:08

No, of course I'm not BU. I'm just posting here for traffic. Name changed, obvs.

Bit of background; I was a PIP Disability Assessor for a while this year, until I decided that I couldn't work within the system with a good conscience, and left. I witnessed DA's who were trying their best, mostly, to help people with their claims. They (and I) were hamstrung both by our immediate employers, and a system (whether by accident or design) that discriminated against claimants with certain conditions. In the spirit of the release of 'I, Daniel Blake', which isn't about PIP but other failures of the benefit system, I've decided to give some general advice to those looking to claim PIP.

Firstly, let's look at initially making the claim. I would say the most vital point is this; PROVIDE EVIDENCE. The way that the claim form/questionnaire is worded implies that the DWP/ATOS/CAPITA or whoever will chase letters from GPS, specialists etc to back up your claim for you. In my experience, this doesn't happen. The onus is on you to provide this information, although it would be very easy to assume the opposite. Some photocopies of a recent prescription, letters detailing diagnoses and appointment dates, and evidence of secondary care involvement (especially people with mental health conditions) provide good evidence; if you haven't provided anything, then the DA has to go mostly on that short assessment with you. You may be horribly unwell or disabled for 5 days a week, if you're having a 'good day' on the assessment however, then your claim is in trouble. Evidence, Evidence, Evidence; I can't stress that enough. Don't let the DWP have the easy option; the decision they make is heavily dependent on the report written by the health professional that assesses you. The decision maker at the DWP has no medical qualifications of any sort.

If you have disabilities that cause you to have problems getting out (especially severe MH conditions), ask for a home assessment. The way the system is, if you have a MH condition involving severe anxiety or depression, or agoraphobia; then you attend a clinic appointment, it can be used as evidence that you aren't as bad as you claim that you are. The reasoning is that you can't be that ill if you can get to a clinic appointment. It's profoundly unfair, and a large part of why I left. Once again; evidence is so important.

Don't assume that the health professional that sees you knows much about your condition. In a working and well-designed system, those with certain conditions would be given appointments with HP's with a specialism in that area. It ain't so. You could get a general or MH nurse, an Occupational Therapist, a Physio or a Paramedic. It's completely random. If you can bring along a health professional of your own, then do. I'd advise anyone against attending by themselves. That's not because I don't trust the DA's; the vast majority are good people. It's just easy to forget things, and people with severe MH problems or learning disabilities/Autism really need an advocate of some sort.

If you're asked to do a set of 12 exercises (it's called the Musculoskeletal exam, or MSK), be sensible! I had people trying to please me by trying to do these despite evident pain; tell the DA why it would be difficult for you to do it. If you cannot do it, just do what you can and explain why. Completing those ridiculous exercises at personal cost, especially pain, will count against you. Don't make stuff up to help your claim (they'll see straight through it, and assume that you're dishonest), but don't put yourself at risk of harm by doing something that you can't. The DA has to take your safety into consideration when assessing what you can and can't do. Once again, evidence is key. If you need aids or adaptations to walk, or need to wear wrist supports etc, then bring/wear them. Help the DA to help you. They normally will.

Talking of assessments, if you report any MH conditions at all, then the DA will be observing you throughout the assessment for a Mental State Examination (MSE). In my opinion, this is even more badly designed that the MSK. A HP, who may or may not have any MH experience at all, will continually assess your mood, behaviour, anxiety etc throughout the assessment. It's completely subjective. If you have a serious MH condition, if you are in pain, if you are distressed or anxious then let it show to the DA. The stiff upper lip is the worst possible approach.

We were told that those 45 minutes were key. If a consultant wrote that you couldn't do something, then you did it in that 45 minute assessment (good day or not) then the weight of evidence would be on the assessment.

My opinion, for what it's worth, is that PIP discriminates against those with learning disabilities or MH conditions. Seriously. It's appalling. If you are turned down, then PLEASE appeal. You'd be surprised how many obtain PIP through appeal; it's often through providing further evidence. Don't give the DWP the chance to deny your rightful claim in the first place; provide that evidence when you first fill in the forms.

OP posts:
Thread gallery
5
IwasateenagePIPassessor · 28/10/2016 23:30

With assessments the nearest is closing, the next nearest requires me to be able to manage steps at an inaccessible train station. I know they do not offer home assessments in my or neighbouring county, do they ever allow pip without medicals?

I've never heard of Home assessments not being offered, but I only worked for one company and only for a few months. I'd imagine that might contravene the Equalities Act.

OP posts:
PlayOnWurtz · 28/10/2016 23:30

This thread is a great thing you're doing! Thank you

IwasateenagePIPassessor · 28/10/2016 23:35

Sorry if this has been asked. My renewal is due in the new year and I stupidly didn't keep copies of what I submitted with my application. Do I have to send copies of all my diagnosis reports etc again and treat it like a new application or do I just submit things as they are now?

Theoretically, any previously submitted documents should be available to be viewed by the DA on the secure DWP database pre-assessment. It might be worth ringing them to ask though.

OP posts:
leanback · 28/10/2016 23:35

Also to add for anyone applying - Something we found with our clients is that often they'd just say 'they managed' because they could get themselves into bed if they did x and y. You need to detail all the extra things you do in order to get into bed compared to a person who does not have a disability. The questions are deliberately broad and vague. You need to fill in the blanks.

Because I was working VI we also used to say that you should described the problems you'd have in your day to day routine if you were staying at someone else's house not your own. This was because most of our clients knew how to get around their house by memory reducing the amount of falls and bumps they would have if they were not familiar with the furniture. Tell them that if someone came in and moved your furniture you would not be able to notice and trip over. However I do not know how useful that is for those with other disabilities.

I'd recommend contacting any charities or not for profits relating to your disability to see if they offer and advisory service to help you fill out these forms. They will know exactly what information needs to be included and will probably help you think of things you'd never considered before because they are so normal in your routine.

Becca19962014 · 28/10/2016 23:36

Apparently it's to do with being so rural e.g. One postcode can cover several miles and sat nav is useless round here.

Obviously I'm not an assessor though, it's what my GP said and they've literally begged for home assessments for housebound patients and it was refused so no pip.

jbee1979 · 28/10/2016 23:36

This will be so useful to me at work and at home. Thank you Smile

IwasateenagePIPassessor · 28/10/2016 23:38

A bit of disclosure; I worked for Crapita. From what I've read since then, ATOS are even worse. The two companies seem to work in quite different ways; it would appear that it's easier to access a home assessment if you live in a Capita area.

OP posts:
leanback · 28/10/2016 23:38

Also to add about getting to assessments I had clients the DWP paid taxi expenses for in order to get to the assessment centre. I'd push for a home assessment and if that's not possible see about taxis. Don't see this as you jumping through hoops. The onus is on them to ensure you are physically capable of attending your assessment.

PlayOnWurtz · 28/10/2016 23:39

Thanks for the reply op.

One thing I would recommend sending in, don't know if OP agrees, is an impact statement from your spouse. I was advised to do this and dh wrote exactly how he helps me and how my conditions affect him too.

IwasateenagePIPassessor · 28/10/2016 23:43

An impact statement might help, it certainly can't hurt. It wouldn't hold the weight of a doctor's report though, in my experience. Make sure everything is signed and dated.

OP posts:
IwasateenagePIPassessor · 28/10/2016 23:46

I've read up on ATOS since starting this; it would appear that they can be a PITA to obtain a home appointment from sometimes. Might be worth trying to involve a local councillor or MP. Unless your local MP is IDS, obviously.

OP posts:
Becca19962014 · 28/10/2016 23:48

I cannot travel that far by taxi due to severe pain, even short journeys are a problem due to getting in and out of a car. Train would be my only option, with overnight stay as can't manage both ways in a day.

Crapita did my OH assessment ten years ago. They determined I represented a tripping hazard to my colleagues (I lose consciousness several times a week) so needed to use a mobile to let the receptionist know every time I was unconsious saying where I was so they would trip over me Confused I also couldn't be trusted due to a history of alcoholism - quotes from their report.

Useless buggers, though I admit that might not be all of them. Possibly.

So yeh I don't have a lot of faith in them. At all.

Not looking good is it?

IwasateenagePIPassessor · 28/10/2016 23:48

magpie; a lot of those observations are depressingly close to the truth, unfortunately.

OP posts:
IwasateenagePIPassessor · 28/10/2016 23:50

If you can organise a tape recorder, and you notify them in advance, and provide a copy of the recording immediately afterwards, then you are allowed to tape the assessment. You have to provide a physical copy though, taping it on your phone etc isn't acceptable.

OP posts:
Becca19962014 · 28/10/2016 23:51

My MP is not IDS but shares his opinions.

I live alone so no spouse etc to help.

Need to go to bed now but will continue watching this thread. Thankyou OP.

leanback · 28/10/2016 23:52

becca id be insisting on a home assessment, and as op said see if you can get an mp involved. It doesn't seem realistic to travel that far especially if your condition makes travelling difficult. Kick up a fuss, enough noise and they will probably discover they can do home assessments after all.

IwasateenagePIPassessor · 28/10/2016 23:52

It's a proper bastard of a system.

OP posts:
Becca19962014 · 28/10/2016 23:53

There was a document released that stated the law under which assessesments should be recorded using equipment provided by assessors with two recordings made. Has that been overridden? I'll see if I can find it and post a link.

Sorry for lots of questions!

PuppetInParadize · 28/10/2016 23:54

This is excellent, OP. And timely. My task for this weekend is to finalise ds's PIP form. I think, on reading the OP, I need to copy a couple more reports. Other DS with extra needs was PIPed a year ago - he got what he was entitled to, but the interview was awful. He has HFA and was on good form on the day!!The DA was talking me as if I'd lied about his difficulties. I think other DS will be just as he is every day, fortunately. Confused He has LDs and much worse speech. It's all horrid. I hate the whole business but the money is very useful. I've been filling out forms for DS for over 20 years, and you never get used to it.Sad

RubyGoat · 28/10/2016 23:54

A quick question- I have an intermittent neurological condition which causes pain, loss of muscle control, nerve disturbance, & paralysis to a varying degree. Often I appear fine, although I am rarely pain-free. As my condition in ongoing & I cannot work fulltime (struggling to work part time at present), I'm thinking of applying for PIP. According to the guidelines I should qualify but I cannot predict when my attacks will occur, & cannot travel when they do (or walk, talk, see properly etc). So they would never see me like this. Would it even be worth it?

Sorry if it's a silly question but I'm stressed about the hassle of applying if I'm one of those who are likely to fall between the cracks due to the fluctuating nature of my condition. Stress makes it worse.

IwasateenagePIPassessor · 28/10/2016 23:56

Even if your local MP thinks that this system is acceptable for some bizarre reason of his/her own, don't forget that the whole point of this Kafkaesque cobblers is to target their mythical scrounger. If you contact them with a verifiable condition (and you have a local newspaper looking for stories), then you might find even Stephen Crabb quite amenable to help.

OP posts:
IwasateenagePIPassessor · 28/10/2016 23:57

I was under the impression that the person being assessed had to provide the recording equipment, Becca

OP posts:
leanback · 28/10/2016 23:58

lego they should assess you on the guide of how it is on your worst day. Should being the operative word. You need to stress throughout your application that you have some days when etc etc etc happens and make it very clear the unpredictability of your condition. Lots of conditions are worse on some days than others.

Becca19962014 · 29/10/2016 00:00

My MP won't help. They won't even help get medical care I need in my county never mind benefits they think should be axed anyway due to the burden on workers like them.

IwasateenagePIPassessor · 29/10/2016 00:01

Lego, it might be worth a go. The advice would be to request a home assessment, get written evidence of the condition, meds etc. If the condition doesn't affect you more than 50% of the time it's difficult to get PIP. It also depends if you get warnings or an aura before attacks; if you don't get warnings, it's easier to claim that you require supervision for safety's sake.

OP posts:
Swipe left for the next trending thread