To continue to wonder who is happy with where Brexit is heading

[Bearbehind]

Whilst I'm sure Leavers will undoubtedly think AIBU the last thread filled up so here's another 1000 opportunities to discuss what you think about where Brexit is heading.

Ah, we're back on the tactic of questioning people's mental states apwhen we get called out. Nice low start to the day.

The growth was initially put down to 0.1% following the boe measures taken after the referendum, and increased to 0.3%.

larry im question the concept of 'uncontrolled' immigration. It's not, nor has ever been uncontrolled. Even with FOM there are controls in place.

rorty you are another one who's sole intention on these threads is to goad others.

Yes, I've previously said Nissan leaving would make people see what a bad idea this is and I stand by that.

I still think that when people start to be personally affected by Brexit they will question it. If not Nissan then inflation might be that trigger.

Nissan is not the good news you flag wavers think it is because it means one of 2 things

Either we are not heading towards a hard Brexit which isn't what you want

Or the government will be effectively underwriting the losses associated with a hard Brexit for Nissan but where will that end? Effectively we'd end up paying big businesses to stay rather than our EU membership only without the rebates- where's the benefit in that?

If you are going to contribute to the discussion please feel free.

If, like surfer you only come here to wind people up, and are unable to add anything to the conversation, please stay away,

Yes, I've previously said Nissan leaving would make people see what a bad idea this is and I stand by that

& you would have walked through the streets of Sunderland saying that would you?

Hmm uncontrolled mass immigration , is that why we have been working so closely with France over the situation in Calais ? Surely if it really is uncontrolled we would be allowing them through , no need for border controls or a massive fence !

If anyone from Sunderland asked me then I would have said that yes.

Would you walk through say the Polish communities in UK towns saying they should go home 'for the greater good'?

The LSE carried out a survey which proved most people don't want to control immigration if it will cost them personally, this is the same principle.

Whilst people might think Brexit is a good idea, if they begin to be personally disadvantaged by it things will change. Many people can't afford a cut in the income/ increase in outgoings.

Are you going to tell us what you think of Nissan staying surfer or are you just here to stir the pot again?

You should nip over to the US thread if you're worried about people's mental states being questioned. After the vote this years forecast stayed the same but next years was cut though we were still forecast to be fastest growing in g7. Independent analysts predicted point three.

Immigration has not been controlled otherwise freedom of movement has no meaning.

I'm very happy for the people of Sunderland, very happy, who wouldn't be?
Here's to the people of Sunderland who voted leave anyway & took that risk for the greater good. Awesome people!

Oh & Bearbehind - you forget what you & smallfox said to me every time you crashed my threads on the ref board, threads I started specifically for leavers, 'we post where we like' - it's the reason I hid the entire board.
Anyway, I'll leave your thread because you've asked me to & I don't stay where I'm not welcome.
But to answer your thread title question -
I'm happy.

On the subject of Nissan, it is amazing how stories can be twisted.

There was a woman on the 10 o'clock news last night talking about Nissan's decision to stay as if it happened because of Brexit.

The irony that their decision was only ever in doubt because of Brexit is quite incredible.

I'm not happy. I've had 2 friends whose uk businesses have shut down due to the crash of the GBP to USD as they relied on US imports.

Other friends are having contracts withdrawn or put on hold due to uncertainty in the UK economy. These are mostly from German investors.

surfer the thread you most recently referred to wasn't specifically for Leavers, even the OP of that thread pulled you up on that.

Secondly, you are more than welcome to post here if you actually enter into discussions on the subject but the absolute extent of your vocabulary on this subject is 'I'm happy'.

Why are you happy?

Nissan staying either means soft Brexit or the government supporting these big businesses so they remain competitive- why does that make you happy?

Boink,

People whose businesses depend on fx really need to learn about hedging and use it. It is cheap and readily available these days.

Ditto those living abroad and depending on gbp income. Why not sell forward; again readily available and not expensive.

Although I am sympathetic, it is only to the same extent as to someone whose house is robbed and they have failed to have contents insurance.

rights and obligations of free movement

Free movement isn't uncontrolled.

Ah, knew I'd find eventually what a pre-brexit q3 prediction. Not worse, not better. Probably not a bad thing thing though the effect of falling sterling and upcoming inflation is still a worry.
From telegraph
in March the Office for Budget Responsibility predicted third quarter growth of 0.5pc

Although I am sympathetic, it is only to the same extent as to someone whose house is robbed and they have failed to have contents insurance.

larry that's incredibly patronising and factually incorrect.

You can't hedge indefinitely and it's betting on the unknown anyway.

contents insurance protects you if you are robbed, hedging protects you from fluctuations but they can be positive or negative.

Nissan staying either means soft Brexit or the government supporting these big businesses so they remain competitive- why does that make you happy?
You can't just decide what it means, and then demand people pick one and tell you why it makes them happy. Maybe it means Nissan were never really going to leave, but tried to blackmail T-May who possibly told them to do one.

Ok wendy you tell me what you think it means?

Don't let the fact it's being reported that the government have issued Nissan a letter stating they will ensure they remain competitive get in the way of your thoughts.

Bear,

You can easily hedge three years and, for larger cash flows, up to 30.

Fluctuations can indeed be positive or negative. So you can no longer enjoy windfall gains. That is the point.

It is not patronising to state a fact.Hedging is available and inexpensive. Gambling on a stable exchange rate, especially if you have dependents, is irresponsible.

Even The Times is talking about "last ditch pledges to keep Nissan in Britain". I can only read the first couple of paragraphs because it's behind the pay wall. If the Times can have this story, why shouldn't we question what deal has been stitched up? Will other car factories come for their bribe too?

Peregrina,

I get the Times paper edition. It is all very vague but along the lines of what Bear said. It does sound very vague though and I have no idea if it has any legal meaning.

The patronising bit was the comparison to not insuring your contents.

That is foolish but deciding whether hedging is appropriate is a commercial decision which can only be proved to have been the correct one retrospectively.

If you don't insure you contents and you get robbed you lose.

If you hedge and sterling goes down you gain but if it goes up you lose.

They are not at all comparable,

Bear,

You don't lose! If you account in Euros (I.e your expenses are in euros) and you hedge, your euro cash flows are made certain.

What you 'lose' is the potential gains in your base currency due to the foreign currency appreciating.

If you will potentially be put out of business by fx movement. You are foolish not to hedge. Don't really think this is debatable.

"There is no compensation package,” a No 10 spokesman said. “What was made clear to Nissan and to others in the automotive industry is that what we want is a competitive environment for the whole of the industry.”

This seems pretty clear cut to me.

It is debatable because hedging doesn't really sit with the entrepreneur spirit of most small businesses.

You can'lose' if the hedge turns out to be the wrong decision.

I'm not disputing in some circumstances it's a good choice but it is nothing like insuring your contents.

wendy even your quote backs up what I'm saying. The government has assured Nissan it will help it remain competitive - how do you think it will do that?

Quote from news last night Both sides deny any kind of 'sweetheart deal' - but a senior government source told ITV News the letter promised to "support competitiveness" post-Brexit