to be pissed off that the town hall will no longer let me run my club, due to us not accepting girls?

[Waterlipe]

Basically, my 2 sons wanted to join Beavers, there were no places (we have DS2 down on the waiting list, we have since birth, he's now 4, so we'll see if he gets in, but it's unlikely. DS2 is 9, so would be in Cubs, but still haven't got a place yet, has been on the lists for a few years. There are places in Brownies, etc. :( which is frustrating, as the boys would enjoy that too, but oh well, so I set up a crafts club for boys. It used to run at the village hall (it was all official, don't worry) and it was quite popular, the village school isn't great and doesn't offer many extra-curricular activities, so the club that walks the children home (can't think of the company!) often brought the children to me (obviously this was all sorted out with parents) and they did crafts! (btw there was an other after school club in the church rooms (which is just opposite, so there was places for girls to go after school if their parents needed). We had around 3 boys on the first week, but it got up to 25, which we were very happy with! It was just so nice to see them so eager to learn how to do these activities. Anyone, of course, one mum moans that she wants her son and daughter to be in the same place, to which we said that she should put her son in the after school club at the church, oh no, she preferred our activities (it was me and a couple of my friends who ran it)... She threatened to go to the police for sexism, etc.

In the end she came one day and told us how she has written to the council, etc.

We have received a letter (I'll actually attach it to this thread in the morning, I'm just too lazy to get out of bed) about how we can no longer use it unless our rules are changed, but yet this was fine when we first opened it. Maybe no one can help until I attach the letter, which is fair enough. I'll do it when I wake up

in hindsight if you had just let the precious woman have her dd join you could have avoided this.

which would then completely negate the whole point of the club being boys only.

I read your post in the middle of the night as I couldn't sleep. I was thinking about an example from my own life. I cycle with a Breeze group, set up by British Cycling to encourage more women to go on bikes. Cycling is mainly a male activity and unless your really fit many women don't see cycling as being for fhsm. It has boosted my confidence immensely. Thinking about it, this club is no different. Could you find some statistics about participating in craft activities for boys compared to girls. You need a compelling raison d'être to show what good your club is doing.

As a mum of three boys unable to get into beavers, I'd welcome it! It has really annoyed my eldest that his friends (girls) are in beavers, but there's no space for him and he's not allowed to join brownies. I see no problem with separating them. Brownies just needed to be cooler which is actually the Real issue and a bit sad.

I wanted to say yabu but you really are not. I love what you are doing and my son would love it. My daughter does other clubs.
I agree with gathering a list of male/ female only activities in your community. Also feedback forms from parents.

Another yanbu here!

I think your club is a great idea have you got the energy to fight it put together a document (not the right word) stating why it is just for boys . Sometimes in mixed groups the club or activity wont flow as well and there is nothing wrong in single sex activities.

I still think YABU. I also think the WI should be open to men and sports teams should be mixed at amateur level, certainly at schools level. Old boys clubs welcome women now I believe but if there are any that don't, they absolutely should. Changing the roles of women in society begins right here, with the children, and it might be easiest to segregate these kids to get the boys cooking and sewing but that doesn't make it right.

Far too many sensible grown up answers so I'm going to suggest you become mixed but deny the entitled with a space for her daughter anyway due to ' number's, or if you fancied being super churlish, make it 50/50 and tell her as such there's no longer space for her son. Then let the other parents losing places that it's down to her.

Before anyone on here has an aneurysm I'm not seriously suggesting she does that esp not to the extent it negatively impacts on children but sometimes it's good to have a vengeful daydream.

Op you are not being unreasonable, I would write back to the council asking for detailed reasons your boys only club is wrong when Beavers and Brownies are okay and add that since Beavers is heavily over subscribed you are in fact doing a service by evening up the activities available so as to avoid gender bias in the community!

I really think you need to get the parents on board with this and explain what has gone on, rally together to put your case to the council.

I think the club sounds like a great idea, its a shame some selfish woman is trying to spoil it for you.

sports teams should be mixed at amateur level, certainly at schools level.

I don't think this would work for rugby.

YANBU and they cannot surely shut you down and let the Brownies remain.

Maybe repost in legal for advice??

YANBU

There are state funded single sex schools - so having a club that is just for girls or just for boys is no different.

There are loads of things like 'coding for girls' etc.

If this woman wants to run a co-ed craft club she can do so. Spiteful bitch.

I think I understand you ....beavers was for for boys...there was enough spaces for all the boys..then they took girls...who also had brownies..now not enough space for the boys...soooo apparently brownies need a female only space from males....but beavers don't get a male only space...so you thought you would rectif that and do a boys only club..well done..I don't see the problem...but clearly the daughters mother does,she thinks it's ok for her darling daughter to ride rough shot over any rules in place....state your case to the council...explain that there weren't enough beaver places and the Boys right,y so want their male only space...if brownies can get away with it ,so can you....

Keep this thread going..I feel angry on your behalf and I want to know how you get on

YANBU

Are you running a volunteer-run group that charges for materials only, a not-for-profit group that pays you a salary, or a business? That determines what you can compare your group to and, I suspect (no legal knowledge) your legal status.

Also, I think the problem here was that beavers took girls...I've got boys and girls...brownies just needed to do more of what beavers did,and less sewing ,more tree climbing ...there was no real need for beavers to take girls...it's good for them to have a male only/ female only space.....I think we should campaign for beavers to go back to male only

Whatever happened to the old Boys' Clubs? I remember my gran talking about them.

tbh, the long struggle to allow women to be equal to men with access to male only groups means that male only groups are never likely to be seen with a kind eye, no matter what the reasoning behind it.

I'd make sure that everyone knew that there would be loads of upheaval and who is responsible.

The mum is being very unreasonable anyway as there is a mixed setting for both her children as the OP pointed out. If it was actually the only craft club she would have a strong case for objecting.
I'd just write back saying the aim of the club is to provide a space where boys feel confident doing activities traditionally stereotyped as girls-only and pointing to the fact that you have 25 and can't accept any more at the moment. You could also make the point that this started to help boys on the waiting list for beavers and Cubs as they are not able to join brownies and guides as an alternative. Invite the council to come to a session to meet the boys and parents to understand how they benefit.
Normally I would hate the idea of segregating children in after-school clubs but to be honest if you were running bike maintenance and metalwork for girls the council would have immediately understood why, even if a boy objected he couldn't join.

I remember starting football in primary school. Girls football after school it was great there was about 20 of us really enjoyed it, then the teacher got sick so arranged that we could join the boys training while she recovered. I think it lasted 3 weeks before all the girls dropped out. I remember feeling really intimidated in the mixed setting cos I wasn't very good, and being shit at football didn't matter in the girls training sessions but suddenly when there were boys who had been doing football for years and not just a few months around it wasn't as fun anymore.

I can see how similar can be said for boys in a craft club. If these are activities that's are traditionally seen as 'girly' and girls who have take part in these activities before ( in a different setting, perhaps their mums have thaught them etc) are seen as being 'better at crafts' it could quickly become less fun for the boys, and obviously the more of their friends who drop out the less likely they are to continue going. I do think there is still a place for some sex activities, particularly at primary age where kids are so aware of themselves and being seen to be cool- and they are, whether we as parents are prepared to admit that or not.

I applaud your motives. Girls dominate pretty much all non physical primary age activities and boys can be driven out ( ditto girls in footy teams). My " specialist area" is church choirs - run separate boys and girls treble choirs and you win. Try to mix (at parish level) -and the boys give up unless there is a strong driver ( for us a boys prep school with a singing ethos contributes a handful who attend together).

However , you are going to have such a fight and may well fall foul of the legal stuff. I'd give up and tell them why.

As a mother of 2 boys I would welcome a club like this in our area. YANBU!

I would send out an letter to all the parents and state that unfortunately the club will have to close due to the complaint from Mrs X, then hand pick a few boys to come and 'play' at your house. Then wait for the floods of complaints to hit the council and the evil looks for the entitled bitch at the school gates. Your club that you run out of the goodness of your heart, silly cow should start her own club.

YANBU. Brownies only accept girls and this is considered fair by the council/society.Beavers/cubs/scouts accept both even though there are waiting lists which mean some boys cannot get a place. Council/society are fine with this.You try to make provisions for boys to have an activity that they 1) are allowed to attend and 2) has spaces but the council/society is not happy?? What a joke. Why is it ok to have "girls only" but not "boys only

This.

I agree with the poster who talked about Breeze cycling sessions for women - because cycling is a very make dominated sport/past-time (eg I did a charity ride in the summer - 36 of us from work - 6 women!) - if you can get similar statistics about crafting you can make the case that this is encouraging boys would not otherwise do crafting.

I'm not sure that you will fall foul of the legal stuff but it's a shame that this mother has put you in the position of having the hassle of fighting it.

Another huge YANBU from me. I presume those who do think you U also disapprove of brownies and guides?
I've read several times that girls/ boys perform better in certain circumstances when segregated. This would be one.
The poster earlier who said that amateur sports should be open to both sexes equally... how ridiculous. Can you see women and men playing rugby together, for example? Single sex rules would keep women out of sport. My friend (5' 0") has started running with the Women's Running Netwotk. She wouldn't be running if she had to do it with men.

The boys in OPs area are at a huge disadvantage, and her club was a great idea.
OP fight this. You've heard lots of good points and arguments from the wise folk of MN that you can use. And get your parents on board too. Good luck.