To think it's horse shit when people say they don't need to drive

[pleasemothermay1]

Until you need to meet up anywhere that's not on there doorstep that is

I well annoyed supposed to be meeting my friend who always says she dosent need to drive as she gets about fine

However trying to meet at at 12.45 to go swimming and the pool is to far for her to get there and back for the school run if she drove it would be a 15 minute drive I then suggested soft play near her house howeve the bus dosent run there is on a industrial estate And she would have to walk 35 minutes before she even got to the bus stop gurr

It's the same every time even if we're meeting up with out the kids in the evening unless she able to get a lift then she can't come

Out so you don't need to drive unless the place is not on yur frigging door step gurr rant over I can understand if you live in London but we live in the sticks

Hmmm 'wouldn't or 'couldn't are too different things though aren't they?
I bet that there are stables and yards within 30 / 40 miles of where you live.. if for whatever reason your child had a passion for riding, if you drove you could drive them to / from if necessary.

I'd like to think that any parent would support their child in their passion where they possibly could - whether its sport, drama, dance or whatever.

If you don't drive, its harder. Not to say there aren't other obstacles too, but that's a big one.

two different things!

Well if our local stables were 30 miles away and I could never drive my dc there I'd wonder how the hell they managed to get so passionate about it in the first place

I can understand if it's come through something you can commit to locally such as a drama club, but the likelihood of that happening for the majority of parents is minimal enough to not make it a need.

MagikarpetRide - I'm not sure I agree with you.. Obviously your child is may be unlikely to become passionate about downhill skiing if you live in the middle of a town, but if your DC play sport even at recreational club level - rugby, netball, football, there's always going to be training and then away matches - surely that's not uncommon?

If they swim, you'll need to drive to early training (before buses often).

I cannot think of a single one of my DCs friend's parents who don't drive.
One parent can't drive far / in the dark because of a medical problem and we rotate lifts when needed - others have clashes because of other DC so again for team sports, lifts are given etc. and we do rotate because its a pain in the butt on occasion but everyone does drive to facilitate their DCs hobbies and in some cases, passions.

I'm really surprised you think that's unusual.

Well if our local stables were 30 miles away and I could never drive my dc there I'd wonder how the hell they managed to get so passionate about it in the first place
Well our local stables were 30 miles away and we used to take the train and walk.

Yabu to think it's horseshit. I know several independent people who can't or won't drive who walk, take the bus or other transport.

Yanbu if your friend expects you to do all the ferrying to her, won't use other transport or was to expect lifts. Db used to be that way. He could drive but didn't like to. Instead he expected everyone to always go to him or go near him or to pick him up. There was plenty of good transport around him too, he just had a very self absorbed attitude which only changed when he got a gf who live further away who couldn't drive. I remember once he expected me to drive to him a week post appendix op because he didn't want to come to mine for family lunch.

That's interesting bbcessex out of all four DC I know loads of non driving parents, some where only one parent drives and some who can drive but don't have a car. None of the children seem to be held back by it, there's dancers, footballers, hockey players, actors, rugby players, scouts, rainbows and swimmers.
The kids get lifts, taxis, walk, use public transport and cycle. Lots of clubs fundraise to put on coaches or buy mini buses.
Most of the children have developed interests and passions from doing things available locally though. Not many people take a four or five year old fifty miles to see if they get good at something.

bbc I don't think it's unusual for dc to be in clubs at recreational level. I think it's unusual for them to be at superstar level requiring 40 miles journeys regularly in pursuit of their dreams. My dc swim, very early, buses run fine round here. If they didn't then taxis would come in. Away matches/meets with the local pool and with the football and rugby clubs have organised transport, which tallies with my small home town. My dc aren't teens yet but I expect them to be bus savvy when they are (yes my personal expectation of my dcs).

atenco hahaha well naturally of course. It'd be the only way my dc get to a stables. Unless mil takes them but then she knows the deal that if she signs them up then she ferries them

I dread to think how some of you posters are going to cope a few decades down the line, when petrol is no longer freely available!

Cars are for the rich, that has always been the case, but the time will come when they are only for the mega, ultra rich, and the rest of you snooty bunch, viewing us who can't afford cars with contempt right now, will be joining us on foot, or on the buses.

"You can open up so many other avenues to your kids if you can offer them access to 'the world' "

But equally, if fewer people drove, all children would have far better access to the world, as it would be safer for them to be out of door on their bikes, scooters etc.

I think being able to drive will become an obsolete skill for most British drivers within 10 years. In the FT at the moment there is an article saying that two days ago Uber made self-driving taxis available in Pittsburgh. (Though apparently the taxis still have drivers to take over in an emergency, so I suppose this is still experimental.) Once they are able to dispense with the drivers, it will cost less per mile to journey in driverless taxis than in a car you own, and private cars will become mostly obsolete.

I know loads of people who don't drive, including DH. We grew up in London, you just don't need a car here - it's an expensive luxury. The only thing which gave me a decent incentive to learn to drive was going to a university city with really really crap public transport.

mollie123

What is you issue with my statement? I said I don't look down on anyone who does not drive. That is the truth. Some people in this thread seem to do that. I don't.

choose your friends carefully

???

I have great friends thanks. I was reacting to the stories of others who seems to be use as a free taxi service which I would not tolerate.

Totally depends on where you live and what your lifestyle is. I lived in central London for years opposite a tube station and close to two other tube stations, within walking distance of great parks and tourist attractions as well as the GP, nursery and supermarket. I didnt need to drive at all. Dh worked outside of the borough at unsociable hours and needed a car but we were only allowed one parking permit per property anyway.
When ds reached school age we moved out of London and a journey to school took ten min in the car the back way and 80 min by bus and walking due to bus times, waiting and the fact that over a mile of the journey was on foot and up hill. I had to pass my test. That said before I drove I got my ds to school, I met people everywhere and I never asked for lifts; I just walked long distances and got on with it. So people who dont mind doing that dont need to drive. When I needed to get somewhere quickly there were taxis, which arent cheap but the odd taxi was cheaper than driving lessons, test, mot, tax, insurance, car, petrol... people said that driving would change my life and were almost quite patronising about it when I passed. I've never shared the enthusiasm. Yeah it's convenient but I often find myself walking to the shops because I dont find it a hardship to walk..

Depends on the non driver. My sister has a licence but doesn't want to spend money on a car so cages lifts all the time. Never offers petrol money, never has to be the designated driver. It's bloody irritating. We don't give her lifts any more but other people do.

I know several families who don't have cars for environmental reasons and most of them walk/ use public transport for everything and then do car share/ hire for those times they do need one. If it works for them, fine. However I got really hacked off with one mum who sanctimoniously informed all and sundry about how good they were not killing the environment and then spent every week cadging lifts to various forest schools in the middle of nowhere. I used to get calls from one forest school coordinator asking if I could pick up the mum and her DD 'on my way' - which would have meant a detour of 20 miles each way!! .

Its not just lifestyle choices though. If you don't live in a town with good public transport, or you can't choose where you live, it can be very limiting.
I managed perfectly well without a car until I got a job where it was expected that I would go out to visit clients. Because of the nature of the business, a lot of these workplaces were in out-of-town industrial units poorly served by public transport. Learning to drive was the only viable option (and indeed a condition of employment of many subsequent jobs)

My DS lives on an estate about 3 miles out of town. He is a single parent in social housing and didn't really have much choice in where he lives. He can't drive. He has a SN teenage DC who can't be left unsupervised. He doesn't expect lifts from people & walks everywhere he can but can't find suitable employment because of the timings & frequency of the woefully inadequate public transport in that area.

We live in the suburbs and have one car which DH and I share. I'm a SAHM to a toddler, DH works full time. He takes the car to work Monday - Friday as default, unless I 'book' it with him first if I've got a day out or something planned. He can get public transport to work without too much issue.

We could survive without a car and do see it as a luxury. Town and train station on a main line are only 15mins walk away. Having two cars would definitely be an extravagance.

When I don't have the car we do stuff in walking or cycling distance. Pop to the local shops, get groceries delivered, only go to groups and soft plays etc that I can walk/cycle to or easy public transport. On days I do have the car we can be more adventurous and go to things further afield or not accessible by public transport. The days out by car are a luxury and spice up what could otherwise be a fairly unexciting routine of the same few local places. Yes good fun but not an essential in my opinion. However, i do have some friends who have a more entitled point of view and feel being able to get wherever they want whenever they want is their right, not a privilege.

On days I don't have the car most of the time during the week I wouldn't sign up groups or classes I couldn't get to independently! I certainly don't expect friends to give me lifts everywhere! I would hope that 'friends' are understanding and wouldn't suggest going places they know I couldn't get to!!! Friendship is about compromise and understanding? If arranging to meet someone I'd either suggest meeting somewhere mutually convenient to get to or offer a lift.

Lots of people can't drive. I can't drive as a I had a major panic attack on my test and never recovered the confidence. Lots of disabled people don't drive. I ride a bike. I'm an avid mountain biker, so I'm pretty hardcore and not afraid of bad weather. Unless she is insisting that she wants to go to the places that are inaccessible by public transport then why can't you just arrange to go to places that are more accessible?

I never had a car until my 40s, I did okay without - it was hard if DH was away for long periods in the winter.
But I needed one for DC

I've taken her to music class today, 10 minutes drive. Without it was about an hour each way, 2 buses and a train and lots of waiting.
Just going from one town to another. Same with swimming lessons - I was paying £8.50 in taxis each way, now a short drive

I never wanted a car, I think there are too many and I wish public transport was an option, but most of the time I can't actually afford it.
DD and I have had a great summer with the car and we have been all sorts of places we couldn't get to by public transport.

I also lived in Newcastle for years, no need for a car at all - if only most places were the same

"You can open up so many other avenues to your kids if you can offer them access to 'the world' "

But equally, if fewer people drove, all children would have far better access to the world, as it would be safer for them to be out of door on their bikes, scooters etc.

THIS... so much. I found it so infuriating when my daughter was young at how limiting car-focussed culture made her life. I totlaly get that driving is necessary for a lot of people, especially, if you're doing school runs, followed by work, carting lots of children around, but it would be lovely (and safer) if we started re-centering pedestrian, cycle and play areas, more.

People who don't drive really get on my wick. Mostly family members who think it's ok to take the piss and ask for lifts all of the time just because we are "lucky" enough to have two cars, or friends who cancel plans because it's too difficult to go places, all because they can't drive, well bloody learn. I think if you have kids and can afford public transport then you can afford to own and drive a car and there's no excuse. Unless I had a medical issue there's no way I'd be dragging my kids around on dirty, smelly public transport.

Unless I had a medical issue there's no way I'd be dragging my kids around on dirty, smelly public transport.

Yep. No kids here but I wouldn't dream of catching public transport without my hazmat suit.

I don't drive and I don't have any intention of doing so. I live in a London suburb and work in London and have no need to drive to get to see my family and friends, get to work,get DD to her activities or school. We can manage all these quite well on public transport, bike or foot. On the odd occasions that I go and visit areas which have rubbish buses or trains I am quite capable of organising a taxi from the nearest station. You just have to plan a bit in advance and with the internet and various apps it's quite easy. I don't agree that it's cheaper to own and run a car where I live rather than cycle or use the bus/tube/train.
If you have a friend who hints or asks for lifts then I understand you think all non car drivers are a pain in the arse but not all of us are like this. I don't ask for lifts nor expect them.

Unless I had a medical issue there's no way I'd be dragging my kids around on dirty, smelly public transport

is it the smallpox you're worried about? The plague? The hordes of commoners? Because I'm sitting on a (clean, air-conditioned, Wifi-enabled) bus as we type, and my child appears to have survived so far...